Laser Stars / Galaxies

Beyond the boundaries of established science an avalanche of exotic ideas compete for our attention. Experts tell us that these ideas should not be permitted to take up the time of working scientists, and for the most part they are surely correct. But what about the gems in the rubble pile? By what ground-rules might we bring extraordinary new possibilities to light?

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Lloyd
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Laser Stars / Galaxies

Unread post by Lloyd » Tue May 01, 2012 4:13 am

* That's interesting about alignment of Milky Way satellites. Sounds like an EM effect, but also may relate to Halton Arp's findings about galaxy formation.
Lasers Stabilize Plasma Filaments
* Your webpage says:
The sun's heliosphere is an electric current sheet that is a vortex state, and stars form inside galactic spiral arm filaments. The "material" is the interstellar medium ISM, and the magnetically constrained galaxy filaments contain the stars orbiting the "center of the galaxy." Filaments explain why outer and inner stars all orbit a galaxy center at the same speeds, without requiring phony dark matter and black holes. Laser beams help stabilize plasma laboratory filaments, so laser beams from galaxy centers also stabilize stellar filaments.
* Do you have evidence of natural laser beams from galaxy centers? And, if so, what is your theory for how they occur? Can you provide any references for the statement that lasers stabilize lab plasma filaments? I found this abstract below, which seems to support your statement.
http://www.researchgate.net/publication ... _filaments
(See also https://www.google.com/#hl=en&gs_nf=1&g ... +filaments).
Abstract
The ability to select and stabilize a single filament during propagation of an ultrashort, high-intensity laser pulse in air makes it possible to examine the longitudinal structure of the plasma channel left in its wake. We present the first detailed measurements and numerical 3-D simulations of the longitudinal plasma density variation in a laser-plasma filament after it passes through an iris that blocks the surrounding energy reservoir. Since no compensation is available from the surrounding background energy, filament propagation is terminated after a few centimeters. For this experiment, simulations indicate that filament propagation is terminated by plasma defocusing and ionization loss, which reduces the pulse power below the effective self-focusing power. With no blockage, a plasma filament length of over a few meters was observed.

quantauniverse
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Re: Laser Stars / Galaxies

Unread post by quantauniverse » Wed May 02, 2012 5:04 pm

Laser beams are emitted by spinning neutron stars and pulsars, over vast distances. Several meter long filaments produced by lasers in the lab is a lot for that scale. Precursor supernova star Eta Carinae is still alive and highly variable, and was found to emit laser beams of ultraviolet light. Most all the luminosity of all galaxies is from the light of supernovas. http://astronomycentral.co.uk/eta-carin ... nihilation
Concentrated laser-like radiation beams of high frequency light in the spiral arms where supernovas explode and new stars form, causes the motions of galaxies. Higher energies produce x-rays, gamma rays, cosmic rays. The Birkeland current pinch where filaments wrap twist together produces this radiation. This twisting is from the galaxy spinning with the central plasmoid vortex. The spiral arm galaxy filaments are actually straight, and not bent, and reflect the direction of motion of the galaxy. Our milky way galaxy actually has straight spiral arms, like other galaxies. The intense high frequency radiation inside the filaments is pretty much the same as firing the lasers into the center of the plasma in labs. http://cosmosmagazine.com/news/4100/sup ... act-lasers
Single cold atoms like in outer space conditions can align and behave almost exactly like a laser beam with wave-particle duality. Helium the 2nd most abundant atom, when cold behaves like a laser beam, and could be involved along with magnetic confinement, in stabilizing galaxy spiral arm filaments. Thanks for your interest. These are knew areas nobody before has conjectured upon. I hope a highly plausable model of a galaxy will be developed soon, because all evidences support EU. The type II superconductor model seems to fit well for phony black holes.

Lloyd
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Re: Laser Stars / Galaxies

Unread post by Lloyd » Wed May 02, 2012 8:35 pm

* EU theory regards pulsars as pulsing electrically, not rotationally and not as neutron stars, and it regards supernovae as plasma double layer explosions.
* The only galaxies I've noticed that have straight arms are M51 and M61. See:
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch& ... galaxy+m61
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch& ... galaxy+m51
* It's possible that the Milky Way could be similar, since we don't have a good view of it from our position in it. Are those the kinds of straight arms you're talking about?
* It looks like your main info is correct, that Eta Carinae emits UV laser light and that lasers do stabilize and extend plasma filaments. I don't comprehend the rest of your info here very well. Are you saying that Birkeland current pinches cause the laser emissions and that supernovae cause galactic rotation or larger galactic motion? When you said Type II Superconductors, did you mean Supernovae? If you can explain your idea in more detail, that would be interesting.

Lloyd
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Re: Laser Stars / Galaxies

Unread post by Lloyd » Thu May 03, 2012 8:05 pm

LASER ACTION IN STELLAR ENVELOPES
* Thanks to Upriver for these papers. They seem to show what kinds of stars are likely to emit laser light. Does anyone have time to read these papers and see if they have anything else interesting to mention?
http://laserstars.org/pdf/1976Ap&SS..45...87V.pdf
Y. P. VARSHNI and C. S. LAM
Department of Physics, University of Ottawa, Canada
(Received 19 January, 1976)
Abstract. It is shown that in high-temperature stars in which high speed mass loss is occurring, the rapidly recombining plasma in the stellar envelope can act as an amplifying medium. Model calculations for laser action in He II λ4686, using the collisional-radiative model, are presented. Menzel's hypothesis of laser action in distended stellar atmospheres is shown to be fully substantiated. The relevance of these results in resolving the problem of intensity anomalies in the spectra of Wolf-Rayet stars is pointed out.
http://laserstars.org/pdf/1986Ap&SS.125..341V.pdf
Y. P. VARSHNI and R. M. NASSER
Department of Physics, Universiiy of Ottawa, Canada KIN6N5
(Received 26 March, 1986)
Abstract. Model calculations for laser action in He1 are carried out, when helium plasma is rapidly cooled by expansion. Results are presented for four transitions, two of which, 3^1 S+2^1 P^0 (λ7281) and 3^1 D -> 2^1 P^0 (λ6678), show strong population inversion. Available observational evidence for possible laser action in these two lines in Wolf-Rayet and emission-line stars is summarized and discussed.

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Solar
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Re: Laser Stars / Galaxies

Unread post by Solar » Sat May 05, 2012 11:33 am

Lloyd wrote:LASER ACTION IN STELLAR ENVELOPES
* Thanks to Upriver for these papers. They seem to show what kinds of stars are likely to emit laser light. Does anyone have time to read these papers and see if they have anything else interesting to mention?
http://laserstars.org/pdf/1976Ap&SS..45...87V.pdf
Y. P. VARSHNI and C. S. LAM
Department of Physics, University of Ottawa, Canada
(Received 19 January, 1976)
Abstract. It is shown that in high-temperature stars in which high speed mass loss is occurring, the rapidly recombining plasma in the stellar envelope can act as an amplifying medium. Model calculations for laser action in He II λ4686, using the collisional-radiative model, are presented. Menzel's hypothesis of laser action in distended stellar atmospheres is shown to be fully substantiated. The relevance of these results in resolving the problem of intensity anomalies in the spectra of Wolf-Rayet stars is pointed out.
http://laserstars.org/pdf/1986Ap&SS.125..341V.pdf
Y. P. VARSHNI and R. M. NASSER
Department of Physics, Universiiy of Ottawa, Canada KIN6N5
(Received 26 March, 1986)
Abstract. Model calculations for laser action in He1 are carried out, when helium plasma is rapidly cooled by expansion. Results are presented for four transitions, two of which, 3^1 S+2^1 P^0 (λ7281) and 3^1 D -> 2^1 P^0 (λ6678), show strong population inversion. Available observational evidence for possible laser action in these two lines in Wolf-Rayet and emission-line stars is summarized and discussed.
I sure had some research fun with that.

But I guess I’m having some problems with this one so I’d appreciate anyone helping me understand what I’m missing. I took a look at those papers Lloyd has linked as well as the article(s) from Quantauniverse. I also took a look at what is apparently the website of Y.P. Varshni and J. Talbot called Laser Stars.org.

The “Summary” of the Laser Stars website has a graphic representation depicting the range of the ‘stellar envelope’ that qualifies as undergoing the “laser action” which is the specific term that is used in both the papers that Lloyd cited. That term, “laser action” seems to refer more so to the quantum mechanical interpretation of the way normal laser light is emitted by way of electrons undergoing stimulated or amplified emission of photons as a process.

One of the key principles, or criteria, that seem to be pointed to in Varshni’s theory is the occurrence of “population inversion” which means that:

Quantum mechanically speaking; the electrons, atoms, molecules of a given species and for a given system are normally at some “rest state”, or “ground state”. Under normal “at rest” circumstances a small random percentage, a very few, of the electrons - for said population of said species, may be in an excited state. One can take such system and “pump” it (stimulate) via some given means providing energy to the system. The “pumped” energy input would then result in an increase in the number of excited electrons in the species now exceeding the number of electrons at rest or in the “ground state”. When the number of electrons in the excited state exceeds the number of electrons in the “ground state” the subsequent nature of the population compared to the initial state of the species has become “inverted”; thus the term “population inversion”.

The reasoning occurs with relation to normal lasers positing that, likewise, in order to keep the necessary “population inversion” going so that your laser continuously emits light “a certain minimum power” must be provided as a “pump” i.e. energy must be continuously supplied to the system. The author of the following video lecture mentions electrically “pumping” the system and coverage of “population inversion” occurs a@ 8:30 secs.

Lecture 5 part 1 (Lasers, stimulated emission, population inversion)

Now, these energetically “pumped” electrons, atoms, or molecules can undergo “spontaneous emission” over time all by themselves or one can ‘enhance’ and/or induce emission via “recombination” (“ion with an electron with the simultaneous transfer of kinetic and binding energy to a third particle (usually another electron”, “optical pumping” (injecting light aka “photon bombardment”)) etc. One of the papers aims to clear up some confusion with the naming conventions here:
6. Terminlogy
Finally we would like to add some remarks as regards the terminology. The phenomenon that we have discussed is known, more specifically, as supperradiance (Bloom, 1968) or supperradiant emission (Lengyel, 1971; siegman, 1971) in the literature of laser physics. Some authors (Allen and Peters, 1970; Allen, 1973) prefer the phrase amplified spontaneous emission. This helps to distinguish it from Dike’s supperradiance and avoid the semantic confusion surrounding the word supperradiance. We have, however, used the more general term laser action to describe the phenomenon, because it is better known to astrophysicists and because Menzel has used it in the same sense. Also, the term maser action in the contest of interstellar molecules is used in the same sense. – Laser Action in Stellar Envelopes
Consider Population Inversion again because we need to be clear on what it means:
This scheme is capable of generating intense laser action and it is known as the plasma laser or recombination laser. (…) the recombination occurs preferentially into the upper excited states of the ion, which then decay by radiative and/or collisional cascade to the ground state. Within the cascade from the upper excited from the upper excited states, population inversions may form among the excited states depending on the relative transition probabilities. – Laser Action in Stellar envelopes
So, that means lots more jucied -trons closer to the source outnumbering the sober -trons who've lost their buzz having 'collided' with the cold interstellar medium cop and rapidly cooled. So saying "laser action" seems more so a reference to the quantum mechanical processes or activities; not necessarily literal laser light or laser beams. This is where I'm having the problem needing help understanding. That, being said there is more of interest. The "Terminology" section of the above quoted paper states that “In the astrophysical context, the term laser action actually means amplified spontaneous emission…”

With “amplified spontaneous emission”: a process where spontaneously emitted radiation (luminescence) is amplified”, the thing that is interesting is the “Gain Media”. Some of these are called “Gas Lasers” which means that they consist of “Noble Gasses” such as Helium-Neon Lasers and Argon i.e. plasma. Why is that a problem? – because generally speaking 99% of the observable universe is in the plasma state. Considering that as such it is also a problem because of the way that, in order to achieve consistent emission of photons by way of “population inversion”, the system must be “pumped”:
As the gain medium adds energy to the amplified light, it must itself receive some energy through a process called pumping, which may typically involve electrical currents (electrical pumping) or some light inputs (→ optical pumping), typically at a wavelength which is shorter than the signal wavelength. – Gain Media
And from the Laser Stars page on the inefficiency of Photon Pumping one reads:
For this reason, most laboratory ion or atomic vapour lasers aren't photo-pumped with flashlamps or arclamps, they are instead excited by electron bombardment from a discharge.
So, instead of using photo-pumped methods for their vapor lasers the energy supplied for the continuation of “population inversion” is met with … ELECTRIC DISCHARGES.

Which then, by way of the Laser Stars link contained in that very sentence specifically leads to:

The Spectra of Gas Discharges

Hence, we’re basically right back to square one with turn of the century ‘electrical discharges in gasses’ (which we know to be (plasma), something that has been the bane of modern day astrophysics. I'm not saying that that is what Vashni et are saying but that certainly is a curious development as you read their website. I'm just pondering the implications of electrically pumped plasma lasers on our terrestrial sphere and the quantum mechanical interpretation of "population inversion" with excited electrons outnumbering lower energy electrons which excite the plasma into glow mode obviously from an astrophysical perspective as relates starlight from *some* stars. I didn't see anything in Vashni et al that went that far but the implication is highly interesting don't you think?
However, the second technique, electrical pumping, is practical for lasers. If the laser medium is placed in an electron beam, the electrons can create a population inversion by transferring their energy to the atoms when they collide. Several types of high-power gas lasers are pumped this way. More common is another technique of electrical pumping; the direct discharge … an electric discharge is created in a tube containing the gaseous laser medium, similar to the discharge in a fluorescent lamp. A population inversion is created in the ions or atoms to the discharge when they absorb energy from the current. – Introduction to Laser Technology: 7.5. Pumping Mechanisms
Precious. But it doesn't seem to infer lasers, or laser light, as normally perceived but more so an application of the interpretive quantum mechanical process.
"Our laws of force tend to be applied in the Newtonian sense in that for every action there is an equal reaction, and yet, in the real world, where many-body gravitational effects or electrodynamic actions prevail, we do not have every action paired with an equal reaction." — Harold Aspden

Lloyd
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Re: Laser Stars / Galaxies

Unread post by Lloyd » Mon May 07, 2012 8:24 am

* Nice analysis, Solar. I didn't notice your post here, because the thread was moved to NIAMI apparently.
* I read your post quickly and may have missed some things. My understanding of lasers is that the light has to be all of the same frequency. Did you find anything about that? If the frequencies vary, the photons interfere with each other and scatter, whereas, otherwise, they're able to maintain a rather tight beam for quite a distance. It's hard to imagine stars being able to produce photons all of the same frequency, but maybe it's possible to get 80% the same in some areas for limited periods of time.
* But the electrical aspect of this is certainly interesting too. And that's something I was curious about as well.

jjohnson
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Re: Laser Stars / Galaxies

Unread post by jjohnson » Tue May 08, 2012 12:42 pm

A related subject in the plasma (lasing medium) present at various densities throught a galaxy and around stars are water masers. Numerous instances of finding microwave amplification of stimulated emission of radiation (MASER) at radio wavelengths (hence, microwave emission frequencies/wavelengths) on the website of the National Radio Astronomy Oberservatory (NRAO) here and here.

So, in the presence of higher radiation frequencies - say UV - coming from a star, perhaps that is the energy source providing the ongoing pumping, that is, providing the constant power input to replenish the energy lost the through coherent radiation output. In interstellar spaces, the intensity of UV may not be sufficient to pump laser type phenomena, and the particle density in large Birkeland currents is so low that it is difficult for me to conceive of that as a suitable pumping source of power. It's not that they don't carry large power flows; it's that the power density is low and spread over cubic light years of volume.

So what is the relevance to the Dark Matter discussion here?

Jim

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Solar
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Re: Laser Stars / Galaxies

Unread post by Solar » Sat May 12, 2012 7:54 am

Jim has a good point. Could we petition the Moderator to split the thread at this location (here), which seems to be where the topic diverges, and create a separate thread called 'Quantum Stellar Atomic Lasers' and include this post (here) as the topic starter?
"Our laws of force tend to be applied in the Newtonian sense in that for every action there is an equal reaction, and yet, in the real world, where many-body gravitational effects or electrodynamic actions prevail, we do not have every action paired with an equal reaction." — Harold Aspden

celeste
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Re: Laser Stars / Galaxies

Unread post by celeste » Tue Mar 26, 2013 10:25 pm

jjohnson wrote:A related subject in the plasma (lasing medium) present at various densities throught a galaxy and around stars are water masers. Numerous instances of finding microwave amplification of stimulated emission of radiation (MASER) at radio wavelengths (hence, microwave emission frequencies/wavelengths) on the website of the National Radio Astronomy Oberservatory (NRAO) here and here.

So, in the presence of higher radiation frequencies - say UV - coming from a star, perhaps that is the energy source providing the ongoing pumping, that is, providing the constant power input to replenish the energy lost the through coherent radiation output. In interstellar spaces, the intensity of UV may not be sufficient to pump laser type phenomena, and the particle density in large Birkeland currents is so low that it is difficult for me to conceive of that as a suitable pumping source of power. It's not that they don't carry large power flows; it's that the power density is low and spread over cubic light years of volume.

So what is the relevance to the Dark Matter discussion here?

Jim
Jim, Does your objection to Birkeland currents being the power source, still stand, if we consider that microwaves are only produced at the edge of a filament, and not over the cubic light years of volume?
Let's take a case like our local chimney : a hot sparse plasma, with a stream of stars traveling through the center,and surrounded by a dense wall of cooler neutral gas. We would expect to have the inverted populations only near the edge of the chimney, where the hot plasma meets and is cooled by the neutral gas.
We have as you say, a low power density, but cubic light years of volume to draw on, to power any microwave emission we see from square light years of the filaments surface.

celeste
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Re: Laser Stars / Galaxies

Unread post by celeste » Wed Mar 27, 2013 4:20 pm

And Jim,
Perhaps plasma densities are not quite as low as you might think:
http://iopscience.iop.org/0004-637X/500/1/262

A low density bubble, surrounded by a higher density shell of scattering material, that matches the morphology of the local bubble. Remember the morphology of the local bubble actually turned out to be a "tube" that passed through the galactic plane and opened on each side.

So adding in this: http://www.solstation.com/x-objects/chimney.htm,
here is what we know so far: The sun is in this local bubble of "hot,sparse gas", which turns out to be a tube (chimney), running through the galactic plane. The tube is surrounded by a wall of dense neutral gas. We see scattering material in shells, that match the morphology of the bubble/chimney. We see a stream of stars (the Pleiades stream),running down through the chimney. We know that where a hot plasma is cooled by meeting with a neutral gas, we may have microwave emission, and we are receiving microwaves from every direction. Finally,let's add, earth's precessional axis is ~90 degrees from the pleiades (which is what we expect if the magnetic field of the Pleiades stream is driving our precession).

Rather than asking if there is any evidence of the local chimney being a current filament, let me turn it around. Is there anything MISSING for us to say, "The local chimney is in fact a current filament"?

celeste
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Re: Laser Stars / Galaxies

Unread post by celeste » Wed Mar 27, 2013 5:52 pm

Oh, and just so I don't derail yet another thread. Microwaves. We do see a fairly uniform distribution of them in space. Can they be coming from our local filament walls? You be the judge. Where are we in the chimney?
http://www.solstation.com/x-objects/lchimney.jpg
And those background microwaves show a dipolar distribution?
http://astronomy.swin.edu.au/cosmos/C/C ... und+Dipole

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