Epic Black Hole Dispute Between Scientists

[michael.suede]

I recently posted an email dispute between Steven Crothers and one Dr. Christian Corda, Editor-in-Chief of The Open Astronomy Journal, on my blog in which Crothers gets Corda to basically admit there are no black holes.

This elicited a response from Corda on my blog. A debate between Corda, myself, and Crothers ensued.

Follow the conversation here:
http://fascistsoup.com/2011/03/17/epic- ... cientists/

[orrery]

Finished reading the debate. Michael, you have my full support.

[schmidty226]

well, Black Holes do exist, but on the other hand, they don't. Black Holes cant be proven nor dis proven, Its all a theory just like the Big Bang (Theory). Its gonna take much longer to understand some of the basic principles. Ashame this Brainpower is being wasted when the case, i thought, was closed.

[davesmith_au]

well, Black Holes do exist, but on the other hand, they don't. Black Holes cant be proven nor dis proven.

Well, you could say that, but it wouldn't be a very scientific statement. I could say the underpants gnome is responsible for my boxer shorts going missing. Underpants gnomes can't be proven nor dis proven. That doesn't make the theory credible (BTW "proofs" are the realm of mathematicians, not scientists).

Considering black holes are a mathematical entity which have never been observed to exist in reality, and that the very math underpinning them requires that we effectively divide by zero, I don't find black hole theory credible either. Belief in black holes is simply that, a belief and is akin to a religion of sorts (take a look at the zealots who defend them). We just have to have faith...

Cheers, Dave.

[tayga]

I could say the underpants gnome is responsible for my boxer shorts going missing. Underpants gnomes can't be proven nor dis proven. That doesn't make the theory credible (BTW "proofs" are the realm of mathematicians, not scientists).

The very fact that underpants gnomes can't be "dis proven", ie falsified, is what, according to Popper, makes them un-scientific.

(Incidentally, it is well known that underpants gnomes are just overambitious sock fairies).

[Goldminer]

I could say the underpants gnome is responsible for my boxer shorts going missing. Underpants gnomes can't be proven nor dis proven. That doesn't make the theory credible (BTW "proofs" are the realm of mathematicians, not scientists).

The very fact that underpants gnomes can't be "dis proven", ie falsified, is what, according to Popper, makes them un-scientific.

(Incidentally, it is well known that underpants gnomes are just overambitious sock fairies).

Unbeknown to most, I wear Holy socks and underpants. However, I do not worship them. Those damned gnomes and fairies keep escaping with a little bit of my nether garments at a time! All this time I thought it was clothes entropy causing the disappearance through tiny undetected black holes.

[schmidty226]

i guess your right for the most part, but "Considering black holes are a mathematical entity which have never been observed to exist in reality" Reality can be thought of in many ways, not just "it actually exists." I believe the Theory has been warped into nothing more than a joke, if i didn't know what i know then id say your right and you have the right to think your right, (yes, repetition...) Not just the realm of mathematicians, anyone can walk into this realm when they need to. The concept is a bit, weird on that your right, they cant be observed so technically they don't "exist." I've seen many cases where people who don't believe in Black Holes try to disprove them, I've seen it on this very forum, not by you but by other people. evidence is the name of this Game, I have Faith in this Theory and that's all that's needed. On a side note i apologize for my horrible structure in which i write things.

[PersianPaladin]

I recently posted an email dispute between Steven Crothers and one Dr. Christian Corda, Editor-in-Chief of The Open Astronomy Journal, on my blog in which Crothers gets Corda to basically admit there are no black holes.

This elicited a response from Corda on my blog. A debate between Corda, myself, and Crothers ensued.

Follow the conversation here:
http://fascistsoup.com/2011/03/17/epic- ... cientists/

May I ask how "ideology" (as stated in your article) is relevant to this dispute?

[sjw40364]

I used to think Black Holes did not exist, now I believe they do, but only in the minds of those that support them. All logic is sucked in and never makes it back out