Scarring and Lichtenberg figures
- Shelgeyr
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- Location: Texas
Re: Requesting wisdom regarding electric force laws
Quick update: I located the math to describe the "contact points" of what I strongly believe (but must admit that I am assuming) is the intersection of a sphere and a cone (the Earth and a plasma force column of some type).
Check out: http://mathworld.wolfram.com/Cone-Spher ... ction.html I still haven't found the electric or magnetic set of force laws (one or many taken together) that would create a very forceful (as in earth-moving) spiral formation along the ground plane, with its "clockwiseness" controlled by the direction of the current in the cone-shaped plasma column. Granted, that doesn't mean the laws aren't out there, it means "I ain't one of them electrical engineers", and that I stand at least a fair chance of misunderstanding the textbooks I'm reading.
Doesn't everything from the "right hand rule" on pretty much dictate that any resulting spiral would be perpendicular to the ground plain? Slashing right through the pinch area? Being the "mirror plane" of which the two cones would seem to be each other's reflection? But that's not what I'm finding.
I've seen many "pinch" formations, and most cases are like "active galaxies", where the "radio plume" is at a right angle to the galaxy's plane of rotation, I would expect that (equating my conic "plasma force columns" to the radio plums) that the resulting spiral force (i.e. the active galaxy itself) would be in the plane which bisects the pinch area, not in the plane running along with and bisecting the force columns... but the geophysical evidence seems to indicate otherwise and I simply don't understand why.
The request for wisdom is reiterated, thanks!
Check out: http://mathworld.wolfram.com/Cone-Spher ... ction.html I still haven't found the electric or magnetic set of force laws (one or many taken together) that would create a very forceful (as in earth-moving) spiral formation along the ground plane, with its "clockwiseness" controlled by the direction of the current in the cone-shaped plasma column. Granted, that doesn't mean the laws aren't out there, it means "I ain't one of them electrical engineers", and that I stand at least a fair chance of misunderstanding the textbooks I'm reading.
Doesn't everything from the "right hand rule" on pretty much dictate that any resulting spiral would be perpendicular to the ground plain? Slashing right through the pinch area? Being the "mirror plane" of which the two cones would seem to be each other's reflection? But that's not what I'm finding.
I've seen many "pinch" formations, and most cases are like "active galaxies", where the "radio plume" is at a right angle to the galaxy's plane of rotation, I would expect that (equating my conic "plasma force columns" to the radio plums) that the resulting spiral force (i.e. the active galaxy itself) would be in the plane which bisects the pinch area, not in the plane running along with and bisecting the force columns... but the geophysical evidence seems to indicate otherwise and I simply don't understand why.
The request for wisdom is reiterated, thanks!
Shelgeyr
Sometimes I feel like a tiger’s got my leg...
Sometimes I feel like a tiger’s got my leg...
- Shelgeyr
- Posts: 178
- Joined: Tue Oct 14, 2008 1:36 pm
- Location: Texas
Re: Requesting wisdom regarding electric force laws
One more thing... Most (but not all) naturally occuring pinches - be they in planetary nebula or inscribed across the landscape - seem to have approximately the same angles involved.
Now, I haven't put a protractor up against my monitor, so I don't know what that angle is, but just eyeballing it I'd guess that it is NOT 45 degrees. It is narrower than that, and obviously I'm talking "inside angles" here. Looks more like 30 or so. Does anyone know if there even is such a thing as a "standard angle" for "naturally occuring plasma pinches", and if so, what it is, and what governs or determines it?
Thanks!
Now, I haven't put a protractor up against my monitor, so I don't know what that angle is, but just eyeballing it I'd guess that it is NOT 45 degrees. It is narrower than that, and obviously I'm talking "inside angles" here. Looks more like 30 or so. Does anyone know if there even is such a thing as a "standard angle" for "naturally occuring plasma pinches", and if so, what it is, and what governs or determines it?
Thanks!
Shelgeyr
Sometimes I feel like a tiger’s got my leg...
Sometimes I feel like a tiger’s got my leg...
- Shelgeyr
- Posts: 178
- Joined: Tue Oct 14, 2008 1:36 pm
- Location: Texas
Re: Requesting wisdom regarding electric force laws
This is not the best "Cathode/Anode with Spiral" example there is, but it is one I have handy...
Again, what I'm trying to understand is this:
Picture a double-opposing-cone-shaped plasma column, with a mighty current flowing in a specific direction (we'll worry about completing the circuit some other time), which intersecting the planet would likely leave oval or teardrop-shaped EDM marks, depending on several things - mostly "angle of attack" from what I can tell.
According to what I understand of the "Right Hand Rule"... (with credit to whomever posted this first here at thunderbolts.info - thanks!)
...any resulting spiral magnetic field would be perpendicular to the direction of the current, so that "live" it would probably resemble something vaguely like a tiny active galaxy chewing into the planet surface. Shades of that big ol' gash on Mars, for instance. At least that's my vote for how it got there - from a pole-to-pole discharge... I digress...
On "Cartoon World" it might look like this:
However, that's not what I'm finding... or to be more accurate I'd say that far and away that's mostly not what I'm finding. Instead, the spirals - whether clockwise or counterclockwise - occur in the ground plane, centered at the pinch point, seemingly indicating a vertical current (up or down).
So what caused the teardrop-shaped marks? They have to be related because the center of the spirals (so far) always seem to be the "roughly exact" (if you'll forgive the term) mid-point between the centers of each lobe. Is this a quad-pole discharge with the forces at right-angles to each other?
I'm really begging for help here - I have something of a pact with myself on this... I've got several clear mind-blowing examples, but I don't want to really "go public" with them unless I can actually explain them in concrete terms, backed up by accepted electrical or electromagnetic force laws. I would be most appreciative to anyone who can help me understand these relationships. It might be like talking to a wall, but if you know the answer, I'll eventually wise up. You can even speak slowly and use small words if you like, I won't mind.
Again, what I'm trying to understand is this:
Picture a double-opposing-cone-shaped plasma column, with a mighty current flowing in a specific direction (we'll worry about completing the circuit some other time), which intersecting the planet would likely leave oval or teardrop-shaped EDM marks, depending on several things - mostly "angle of attack" from what I can tell.
According to what I understand of the "Right Hand Rule"... (with credit to whomever posted this first here at thunderbolts.info - thanks!)
...any resulting spiral magnetic field would be perpendicular to the direction of the current, so that "live" it would probably resemble something vaguely like a tiny active galaxy chewing into the planet surface. Shades of that big ol' gash on Mars, for instance. At least that's my vote for how it got there - from a pole-to-pole discharge... I digress...
On "Cartoon World" it might look like this:
However, that's not what I'm finding... or to be more accurate I'd say that far and away that's mostly not what I'm finding. Instead, the spirals - whether clockwise or counterclockwise - occur in the ground plane, centered at the pinch point, seemingly indicating a vertical current (up or down).
So what caused the teardrop-shaped marks? They have to be related because the center of the spirals (so far) always seem to be the "roughly exact" (if you'll forgive the term) mid-point between the centers of each lobe. Is this a quad-pole discharge with the forces at right-angles to each other?
I'm really begging for help here - I have something of a pact with myself on this... I've got several clear mind-blowing examples, but I don't want to really "go public" with them unless I can actually explain them in concrete terms, backed up by accepted electrical or electromagnetic force laws. I would be most appreciative to anyone who can help me understand these relationships. It might be like talking to a wall, but if you know the answer, I'll eventually wise up. You can even speak slowly and use small words if you like, I won't mind.
Shelgeyr
Sometimes I feel like a tiger’s got my leg...
Sometimes I feel like a tiger’s got my leg...
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- Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2008 6:59 pm
Re: Requesting wisdom regarding electric force laws
Hi shelgyer,
May be missing the mark here, but if it is a "mighty current" that is interacting with the sphere, although approaching from a distance at an oblique angle, why must it strike at that angle?
Lightning does not.
Considering, as you did, both current tip and sphere to be electrodes, we know from middle school electrostatic experiments {or home microwave oven disasters} that a current will seek to enter or exit at a prominence,
at a critical distance, relative to 'charge' magnitude.
Now viewing both current 'head' and sphere as 3D radial charge fronts, they would connect at nearest common tangent points.
So, regardless of the initial relative travel direction of the approaching (linear) plasmoid,
connection would be in the shortest path- straight up and down.
O-O
^
?
wisdomnot
May be missing the mark here, but if it is a "mighty current" that is interacting with the sphere, although approaching from a distance at an oblique angle, why must it strike at that angle?
Lightning does not.
Considering, as you did, both current tip and sphere to be electrodes, we know from middle school electrostatic experiments {or home microwave oven disasters} that a current will seek to enter or exit at a prominence,
at a critical distance, relative to 'charge' magnitude.
Now viewing both current 'head' and sphere as 3D radial charge fronts, they would connect at nearest common tangent points.
So, regardless of the initial relative travel direction of the approaching (linear) plasmoid,
connection would be in the shortest path- straight up and down.
O-O
^
?
wisdomnot
- Shelgeyr
- Posts: 178
- Joined: Tue Oct 14, 2008 1:36 pm
- Location: Texas
Re: Requesting wisdom regarding electric force laws
Good points. The short and unsatisfactory answer is "I don't know".seasmith wrote: May be missing the mark here, but if it is a "mighty current" that is interacting with the sphere, although approaching from a distance at an oblique angle, why must it strike at that angle?
Lightning does not.
The reason I have the "force cones" (sounds like something from a bad sci-fi novel, right?) drawn the way I do is because the "teardrop" and spiral markings are already visibly there in the geography, and plasmas reducing to or expanding from a pinch form conical shapes, judging from things like planetary nebulas and active galaxies. But mostly I've drawn it this way because cones intersect spheres with teardrop-shaped boundaries (depending on the angle of attack of course). Granted, so do columns, but if the "teardrops" are different sizes, you've got cones, which pinches form regardless.
I think we're dealing with something larger than lightning, and probably "slower" as well. If you could see it live from above, I'm betting it would resemble sunspots more than anything else.
Shelgeyr
Sometimes I feel like a tiger’s got my leg...
Sometimes I feel like a tiger’s got my leg...
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Re: Lichtenberg figures: yin yang, tree and more
here are some really nice examples of lichtenberg figures. the sahara desert is full of these:
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 40326&z=13
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 40326&z=13
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 40326&z=13
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 22607&z=10
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 22607&z=10
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 61304&z=11
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=1 ... 4&t=h&z=11
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=2 ... 6&t=h&z=13
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=2 ... 2&t=h&z=12
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=2 ... 4&t=h&z=11
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=2 ... 4&t=h&z=11
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=2 ... 4&t=h&z=11
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 845215&z=9
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 61304&z=11
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 40326&z=13
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 40326&z=13
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 40326&z=13
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 22607&z=10
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 22607&z=10
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 61304&z=11
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=1 ... 4&t=h&z=11
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=2 ... 6&t=h&z=13
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=2 ... 2&t=h&z=12
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=2 ... 4&t=h&z=11
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=2 ... 4&t=h&z=11
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=2 ... 4&t=h&z=11
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 845215&z=9
http://www.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&t=h& ... 61304&z=11
- StefanR
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- Location: Amsterdam
Re: Lichtenberg figures: yin yang, tree and more
These are very small
Simultaneous Penetration of Flux and Antiflux Dendrites in MgB2 rings
http://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/forum/phpB ... 4783#p4783
Simultaneous Penetration of Flux and Antiflux Dendrites in MgB2 rings
http://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/forum/phpB ... 4783#p4783
The illusion from which we are seeking to extricate ourselves is not that constituted by the realm of space and time, but that which comes from failing to know that realm from the standpoint of a higher vision. -L.H.
- GaryN
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Re: Lichtenberg figures: yin yang, tree and more
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
- junglelord
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Re: Lichtenberg figures: yin yang, tree and more
We live in a fractal universe. Nice Lichtenberg figures. I like it. Just beautiful and inspiring to the mind.
If you only knew the magnificence of the 3, 6 and 9, then you would have a key to the universe.
— Nikola Tesla
Casting Out the Nines from PHI into Indigs reveals the Cosmic Harmonic Code.
— Junglelord.
Knowledge is Structured in Consciouness. Structure and Function Cannot Be Seperated.
— Junglelord
— Nikola Tesla
Casting Out the Nines from PHI into Indigs reveals the Cosmic Harmonic Code.
— Junglelord.
Knowledge is Structured in Consciouness. Structure and Function Cannot Be Seperated.
— Junglelord
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Re: Lichtenberg figures: yin yang, tree and more
Thought I would post a screencap from a video I saw of new HIRISE images from Mars. Squatting Man-like figures all over.
Here's the video (1:57)
Here's the video (1:57)
- tolenio
- Posts: 244
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Re: Lichtenberg figures: yin yang, tree and more
Question...
When we see lightning during a storm are we simply seeing the secondary discharges and not seeing the primary discharge?
When we see lightning during a storm are we simply seeing the secondary discharges and not seeing the primary discharge?
"The Pharisees and the scholars have taken the keys of knowledge and have hidden them. They have not entered nor have they allowed those who want to enter to do so. As for you, be as sly as snakes and as simple as doves." Gospel of Thomas http://www.gnosis.org/naghamm/gthlamb.html
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Good looking Earth Spiders
Because I like the common sense plasma cosmology evidence I have spent a lot of time browsing google earth and I just saved some of the best spiders I have found here on earth..
I don't remember the image restrictions in attachments so I'm just going to link my facebook albums. enjoy!
United States: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2 ... 63a0bc32ea
Australia: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2 ... 29c4fce654
Various Countries: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2 ... 2cad299851
I don't remember the image restrictions in attachments so I'm just going to link my facebook albums. enjoy!
United States: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2 ... 63a0bc32ea
Australia: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2 ... 29c4fce654
Various Countries: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2 ... 2cad299851
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Re: Good looking Earth Spiders
This is a really good, amazing collection. I noticed that a lot of the radial lines are rather straight, rather than dendritic, although they exhibit a few branches. It's also interesting that the focal ara seems to be depressed in elevation, as a good percentage appear to have water collected in them, whether in man-made ponds or just in the natural terrain I usually can't tell at that scale. One has to wonder, is this still going on today, and if so, what observations might exist that support it? Are these formed by 'ordinary' lightning strikes or precisely what other natural phenomenon?
Nice work. Keep it coming!
Jim
Nice work. Keep it coming!
Jim
- davesmith_au
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Re: Good looking Earth Spiders
Perhaps before we get too carried away, and not wanting to throw cold water on anyone's work, having perused most of the images concerned, I do not see any which could not be explained as man-made dams and water troughs (complete with windmill pumps in some cases) for cattle. The radial lines are likely the tracks all cattle leave when walking to/from their waterholes. As I said, I don't want to throw cold water on ideas, but likewise I don't want to see things posited to be signs of electrical scarring when there are pretty clearly much more mundane explanations for them.
Cheers, Dave.
Cheers, Dave.
"Those who fail to think outside the square will always be confined within it" - Dave Smith 2007
Please visit PlasmaResources
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Please visit PlasmaResources
Please visit Thunderblogs
Please visit ColumbiaDisaster
- Shelgeyr
- Posts: 178
- Joined: Tue Oct 14, 2008 1:36 pm
- Location: Texas
Re: Requesting wisdom regarding electric force laws
Links point to larger versions offsite.
http://www.technogizmo.net/eu/1.jpg
http://www.technogizmo.net/eu/2.png
http://www.technogizmo.net/eu/3.png
http://www.technogizmo.net/eu/4.jpg
http://www.technogizmo.net/eu/5.jpg
http://www.technogizmo.net/eu/6.jpg
Kanglog, Tibet - Lake Tuz, Turkey - Richat, Mauritania, and Lake Victoria, Tanzania/Uganda/Kenya
http://www.technogizmo.net/eu/1.jpg
http://www.technogizmo.net/eu/2.png
http://www.technogizmo.net/eu/3.png
http://www.technogizmo.net/eu/4.jpg
http://www.technogizmo.net/eu/5.jpg
http://www.technogizmo.net/eu/6.jpg
Kanglog, Tibet - Lake Tuz, Turkey - Richat, Mauritania, and Lake Victoria, Tanzania/Uganda/Kenya
Shelgeyr
Sometimes I feel like a tiger’s got my leg...
Sometimes I feel like a tiger’s got my leg...
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