Flammable gas from water

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archivus
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Flammable gas from water

Unread post by archivus » Mon Aug 10, 2020 12:55 am

In this video I use a carbon arc torch to rapidly produce a flammable gas from water that is not Oxy/Hydrogen. The patent this process comes from can be found here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zX6cQ1ian14

Patent#: US5159900A
A method and means of generating gas from water for use as a fuel wherein a pair of spaced-apart carbon electrodes are positioned in a reaction chamber having water therein. Electrical current is supplied to the carbon electrodes to create an electrical arc therebetween causing the electrodes to burn and oxidize to form carbon monoxide and hydrogen. The gas is generated on an on-demand basis.
https://patents.google.com/patent/US5159900A/en

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D_Archer
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Re: Flammable gas from water

Unread post by D_Archer » Tue Aug 18, 2020 7:50 am

I forgot the name, been search a few minutes but can not find it.

There was a company or person working to get the gas from an arc in water (indeed with carbon) and you get a specific gas (carbon monoxide and hydrogen combination), that can be used in a gas car.

Aaargh, can't get the name...

Regards,
Daniel
- Shoot Forth Thunder -

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SeymorOnion
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Re: Flammable gas from water

Unread post by SeymorOnion » Fri Aug 21, 2020 5:03 am

Is the energy required (to produce and sustain the Arc) more than is output from the combustion engine's alternator?

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JP Michael
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Re: Flammable gas from water

Unread post by JP Michael » Sat Aug 22, 2020 4:30 am

SeymorOnion wrote:
Fri Aug 21, 2020 5:03 am
Is the energy required (to produce and sustain the Arc) more than is output from the combustion engine's alternator?
Car alternators are between 60-120 A. Larger vehicles with more electrical systems (e.g. buses, trucks) will have 300 A. The bloke said he had a 150-250 A plasma arc, so you're looking at heavy vehicle range.

I wonder if it is possible to produce enough CO+H2 to fuel a combustion engine large enough to run the alternator to run the arc to produce the fuel to run the alternator... Yeah. I'm thinking the same thing!

If one were going to make this a vehicle, they would need a more reliable arcing system to produce enough fuel to run itself. But the fuel is cheap: water and carbon rods.

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Brigit
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Re: Flammable gas from water

Unread post by Brigit » Sat Aug 22, 2020 4:14 pm

What about the flame color?

It is interesting that he used water that had a Sodium contamination.

It actually looked orange to me, which got me thinking. With more amps and pure water, could you get Calcium?

I know that is unconventional to suggest but I have a very great interest in extreme temperatures from arcs blowing water molecules apart, and what might happen next.
“Oh for shame, how these mortals put the blame upon us gods, for they say evils come from us, when it is they rather who by their own recklessness win sorrow beyond what is given…”
~Homer

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JP Michael
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Re: Flammable gas from water

Unread post by JP Michael » Sun Aug 23, 2020 6:35 am

Brigit wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 4:14 pm
What about the flame color?

It is interesting that he used water that had a Sodium contamination.

It actually looked orange to me, which got me thinking. With more amps and pure water, could you get Calcium?

I know that is unconventional to suggest but I have a very great interest in extreme temperatures from arcs blowing water molecules apart, and what might happen next.
The sodium was not produced by the reaction. It was already in the water (he said he was using dirty rain water). This is not to say you can't get an arc powerful enough to do that, but it would need to be some monstrous discharge like interplanetary scale.

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Brigit
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Re: Flammable gas from water

Unread post by Brigit » Sun Aug 23, 2020 7:42 pm

Yes, the Sodium was from using rain water from a container that had wood ash in it at some point.

Water contamination is an interesting variable. I am glad it was Sodium, because most of our planet is covered with salt water, and it was fun to see the color of the flame was not as expected, but that it was traceable to water contamination.

If you ran it with genuine ocean water you would also see the Chlorine and Bromine escape into the gasometer which was used to collect the CO and the H2.

This would be an imitation on a microscopic scale of what happens all of the time when lightning strikes the earth's oceans.

Therefore, the presence of the halogens in our atmosphere are almost entirely from natural sources, not from manufacturing, fire retardants, transformer oils, or from refrigeration and air conditioning; it is from arcs in sea water and from volcanoes, and that in unquantifiable amounts.
“Oh for shame, how these mortals put the blame upon us gods, for they say evils come from us, when it is they rather who by their own recklessness win sorrow beyond what is given…”
~Homer

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Brigit
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Re: Flammable gas from water

Unread post by Brigit » Sun Aug 23, 2020 7:52 pm

The Biggest Boys


https://i.ibb.co/1vjQtXJ/s-l300.jpg


"Weld.com came by the WeldTube set to have some fun with the worlds largest welding electrode! It is huge! it runs at 1000 amps and stands at 39" and has a diameter of 3/4"!"
“Oh for shame, how these mortals put the blame upon us gods, for they say evils come from us, when it is they rather who by their own recklessness win sorrow beyond what is given…”
~Homer

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Brigit
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Re: Flammable gas from water

Unread post by Brigit » Sun Aug 23, 2020 7:57 pm

Now we just need about 30 of these! :D

(Although I don't know how to get more than two in the set-up, lol)
“Oh for shame, how these mortals put the blame upon us gods, for they say evils come from us, when it is they rather who by their own recklessness win sorrow beyond what is given…”
~Homer

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D_Archer
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Re: Flammable gas from water

Unread post by D_Archer » Sat Nov 14, 2020 10:38 am

I think i found it, it is called MagneGas... seems to be a legit company now.

This was many years ago that i saw the experimental start up.... not 100% sure...

The company has invented a process to convert liquid waste into its hydrogen-based fuel, known as MagneGas, which involves the flow of carbon-rich liquid feedstock through a 10,000 degree Fahrenheit electric arc between two carbon electrodes.
Regards,
Daniel
- Shoot Forth Thunder -

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Brigit
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Re: Flammable gas from water

Unread post by Brigit » Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:13 pm

"The company has invented a process to convert liquid waste into its hydrogen-based fuel, known as MagneGas, which involves the flow of carbon-rich liquid feedstock through a 10,000 degree Fahrenheit electric arc between two carbon electrodes."

As usual, this requires hydrocarbon feedstock and enormous additional material and energy input, to get hydrogen fuel. Hydrogen fuel is much more difficult to handle safely than the original hydrocarbon feedstock. For example, LH2/LOX is very nice if you want to add a little spark to the Hydrogen/Oxygen, because you can put a rocket into orbit.

Space Shuttle Launch Audio - play LOUD (no music) HD 1080p
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OnoNITE-CLc
The Space Shuttle external tank (ET) was the component of the Space Shuttle launch vehicle that contained the liquid hydrogen fuel and liquid oxygen oxidizer. During lift-off and ascent it supplied the fuel and oxidizer under pressure to the three RS-25 main engines in the orbiter.
Engines: 3 RS-25 mounted on the orbiter
Fuel: LH2/LOX
Thrust: 1,254,000 lbf (5,580 kN)
Whereas, I don't want to go into orbit, so CH3-CH2-CH2-CH2-CH2-CH2-CH3 is just fine for me.
Last edited by Brigit on Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
“Oh for shame, how these mortals put the blame upon us gods, for they say evils come from us, when it is they rather who by their own recklessness win sorrow beyond what is given…”
~Homer

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Brigit
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Re: Flammable gas from water

Unread post by Brigit » Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:18 pm

"The company has invented a process to convert liquid waste into its hydrogen-based fuel, known as MagneGas, which involves the flow of carbon-rich liquid feedstock through a 10,000 degree Fahrenheit electric arc between two carbon electrodes."

Another problem is the economic model. Every time someone wants to add a bunch of rube-goldberg steps to an already developed product, my prices go way way up.

And one more thing. Germany lost WWI, so why would we be adopting their hydrogen fuel obsession.

ref: zeppelins
“Oh for shame, how these mortals put the blame upon us gods, for they say evils come from us, when it is they rather who by their own recklessness win sorrow beyond what is given…”
~Homer

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Brigit
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Re: Flammable gas from water

Unread post by Brigit » Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:51 pm

And one more thing. Germany lost WWII also, so why would we adopt their obsessive hydrogen fuel mania.

Jet fuel made from water, based on Nazi science, may be the answer to carbon neutral flying
via stuff co nz
The solution to flight shaming may hinge on a modernised version of a synthetic jet fuel that was honed by Adolf Hitler's Luftwaffe.

German scientists and business leaders are working to create what they hope will be the first viable market for a carbon-neutral version of the kerosene that already powers most modern aircraft.

The science is still based on chemical reactions pioneered in Germany in 1925, but instead of converting coal and other fossil fuels like the oil-starved Nazis did during World War II, green kerosene is derived from water and actually pulls carbon dioxide out of the air during creation.

The process, which requires huge amounts of electricity generated from renewable resources to ensure carbon neutrality, fractures water into oxygen and hydrogen, which is then combined with carbon.
“Oh for shame, how these mortals put the blame upon us gods, for they say evils come from us, when it is they rather who by their own recklessness win sorrow beyond what is given…”
~Homer

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