Electric Weather (cont.)

Historic planetary instability and catastrophe. Evidence for electrical scarring on planets and moons. Electrical events in today's solar system. Electric Earth.
User avatar
JP Michael
Posts: 372
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2019 4:19 am

Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by JP Michael » Wed Feb 12, 2020 2:12 am

This thread is continued from here.

I wanted to reintroduce this discussion because the radical weather Australia has been experiencing of late has had me frequently visiting the Australian Bureau of Meterology site in addition to the global current mapping site, https://earth.nullschool.net/

I have noticed that surface updraft currents occur in what meterology calls "high pressure" regions, and surface downdrafts occur in "low pressure" regions. These are easily noticed especially when cyclone/hurricane events are present.

I am also noticing some of Andy Hall's fractal patterning at surface and higher altitudes: 'crab claws', 'foot prints' and other telltale signs of ionic wind fractals.

I am also noticing significant day-night cycles, especially with the sudden emanation of surface 'mushrooms' (I do not know what else to call them!) during evening cycles in the Australian central regions.

I will post images later as I have run out of time today.

User avatar
paladin17
Posts: 279
Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2014 2:47 pm
Contact:

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by paladin17 » Wed Feb 12, 2020 12:54 pm

JP Michael wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 2:12 am
I have noticed that surface updraft currents occur in what meterology calls "high pressure" regions, and surface downdrafts occur in "low pressure" regions. These are easily noticed especially when cyclone/hurricane events are present.
But this is exactly the reverse of what is observed: downward current (both in electrical sense and in the sense of motion of air masses) corresponds to high pressure, and upward current - to low pressure.

User avatar
JP Michael
Posts: 372
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2019 4:19 am

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by JP Michael » Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:06 pm

Why does meterology call them "highs" and "lows" then?

My comments were based on what the Bureau marks on their own weather maps. I will post examples tomorrow as i do not have time today.

crawler
Posts: 545
Joined: Sun Oct 28, 2018 5:33 pm

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by crawler » Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:46 pm

Gerald Pollack talks of electric weather (updrafts etc, day-night stuff, charge stuff), & some of his stuff might apply here.

User avatar
paladin17
Posts: 279
Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2014 2:47 pm
Contact:

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by paladin17 » Thu Feb 13, 2020 10:34 am

JP Michael wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:06 pm
Why does meterology call them "highs" and "lows" then?

My comments were based on what the Bureau marks on their own weather maps. I will post examples tomorrow as i do not have time today.
"High" and "low" refers to pressure.
High pressure = anticyclone = downward motion of air masses + clockwise rotation in Northern hemisphere. Low pressure = cyclone (including strong cyclones - hurricanes etc.) = upward motion of air masses + counter-clockwise rotation in Northern hemisphere.
In the Southern hemisphere the rotation is reversed.

At the same time in lows the electric current (defined as the motion of positive charges, as usual) is moving upwards, charging the positive ionosphere, and in highs it's moving downwards, discharging it (so-called "fair weather return current"). As you can see, the current direction is correlated with the direction of motion of air masses, which is indeed what is observed (Burns' effect).

There are some hypotheses of how it can be governed electrically - e.g. see my talks at OTF2017 ("Turning the Magnetic Key") and OTF2018 ("Atmospheric structures in the Global Electric Circuit") conferences. Though so far they are exactly that - only hypotheses.

User avatar
JP Michael
Posts: 372
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2019 4:19 am

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by JP Michael » Fri Feb 14, 2020 12:45 am

Thanks Eugene @paladin17.

These are the kinds of things I'm comparing:

Figure 1. Meterological Weather Map (courteousy of bom.gov.au)
Image

Figure 2. Surface Wind Current Map (courteousy of earth.nullschool.net; 11:00 AEST on 14/02/2020)
Image

The yellow arrows represent wind current associated with "low" pressure regions. Of especial interest is ex-Tropical Cyclone Uesi, off the east coast of Australia, and two smaller systems in the Indian ocean far off the west coast.

The red arrows represent wind current associated with "high" pressure regions. There are two notable systems of this kind in the example, one south of New Zealand and a second south of Western Australia.

Blue lines represent surface troughs (I think?).

Orange lines represent areas winds are repelled from (I do not know the meteorological term for this).

I am still trying to incorporate "shear zones", but that will have to wait for an increase in my understanding of meteorology and ionic wind patterning.

For comparison, I will increase the altitude from surface to 850, 700 and 500 hPa just so it is evident that these updraft-downdraft regions extend well beyond the surface:

Figure 3. 850 hPa
Image

Figure 4. 700 hPa
Image

Figure 5. 500 hPa
Image

I still do not know what to make of all of this and how atmospheric electric current directions (proton and electron movement) is to be factored into wind direction and high-low pressure regions and their interactions, not just horizontally but also vertically.

User avatar
JP Michael
Posts: 372
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2019 4:19 am

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by JP Michael » Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:34 am

@paladin17

They say the Coriolis effect is what causes the flow of particles from pole to equator, but what if it is fractal magnetism, that is, the particles are attempting to follow the Earth's magnetic fields but, the earth being a sphere, the particles are forced to flow according to surface topography and interactions with other particles in the atmosphere?

Figure 1. Digital Representation of Fractal Magnetic Field Lines (courteousy of Ken Wheeler).
Image
Each hemiphere of the diagram above should be considered 3D and toroidal, with a cone that funnels material back into the poles. Ejection at equator, funnelling at the poles in an eternal loop.

Simply overlay the earth as a sphere on that fractal representation, with the earth's core at the centre, and you have the essence of magnetic flow directions applied to the atmospheric surface of a sphere. Moreover, the intersection of the sphere and the fields would correspond exactly to where the auroras form at north and south poles respectively.

Ironically, this magnetic field pattern is incredibly similar to that developed by David LaPoint.

User avatar
Woodbeef
Posts: 9
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2020 6:55 pm
Location: Trondheim

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by Woodbeef » Sat Apr 11, 2020 2:14 pm

Having neither a meteorological nor a physics background (- biology it is -), some thoughts have nevertheless been given to weather up through the years - always the feeling that only half of the story is told about it all. A classic (not a quote): "Weather is simply reestablishing equilibrium in local air pressure. And precipitation is just a consequence of that." Hence, tracking and predicting behavior of pressure systems is a topic in this. And it is logical; when you have a low pressure spot, then air will flow into the system and smooth out the differences. Cause and effect. But how the low pressure system is generated is poorly explained beyond the casual "local differences in radiation and heating." There's got to be more to that story. A lot more.

Water has properties which still are not well understood. It is slightly conductive, even if it is deionized. And its cohesive properties give rise to agglomerations, which most likely are more stable than most students tend to think. Lately, the "fourth phase" has been described, having different electric properties than what is traditionally grasped of 'ordinary' liquid water. In this, the EU perspective is truly fascinating, particularly how the dynamics in the atomic nucleus give rise to gravity. Please forgive my ignorance to your obvious expertise here - but could the behavior of air-masses on earth be explained from equally fundamental causes? Whenever I see some of those thin cloud formations in the air, I can't help but to associate them with what I understand as structures of plasma...

User avatar
JP Michael
Posts: 372
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2019 4:19 am

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by JP Michael » Thu Apr 30, 2020 1:59 am

Got video today of rain falling in columnar vortices, similar to mini-tornadoes, drifting across from the right of screen. This is about the 5th time I have seen this from my balcony, but only the second time I managed to record it on video. This one was much better than my previous one, although I could really use a tripod!

Note that these are not distortions or reflections from glass. The only glass present in this video is the camera lens.

hlg
Posts: 45
Joined: Mon Mar 04, 2019 2:31 am

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by hlg » Fri May 15, 2020 10:49 am

very interesting thread closely similar to that one:
https://thunderbolts.info/forum3/phpBB3 ... =2134#p852

@paladin17
High pressure = anticyclone = downward motion of air masses + clockwise rotation in Northern hemisphere. Low pressure = cyclone (including strong cyclones - hurricanes etc.) = upward motion of air masses + counter-clockwise rotation in Northern hemisphere.
In the Southern hemisphere the rotation is reversed.

At the same time in lows the electric current (defined as the motion of positive charges, as usual) is moving upwards, charging the positive ionosphere, and in highs it's moving downwards, discharging it (so-called "fair weather return current"). As you can see, the current direction is correlated with the direction of motion of air masses, which is indeed what is observed (Burns' effect).
wow, what expertise, thanks. i still have to learn a lot from duckduckgo-university ;-)

a) why do you think that in lows H+ are moving upwards, or do you think electrons are moving downwards in lows?

i think that lows are caused by H+ rushing in and up to keep the negativly charged EZ droplets of the clouds suspended, if i interpreted jerry pollacks speeches right...

(of course i know that parts of watermolecules likely always cling to the charges)

b) do you think that these currents upwards in lows give rise to magnetic forces, when interacting with earths magnetic field? would this give the explanation for the direction of rotation?

sorry for my lacking knowledge, both in precise english and physics, since i am only an interested electrician...

Cargo
Posts: 399
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2010 2:02 am

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by Cargo » Sat May 16, 2020 2:28 am

a.
Because it's an extension of the currents entering and exiting the planet. If we could see it, the entire planet has an aurora, all the time, from the poles to the equator.
b.
If there are currents, there are magnetic fields.

(edit: I may have completely missed you're actual question or thought;) )
interstellar filaments conducted electricity having currents as high as 10 thousand billion amperes

hlg
Posts: 45
Joined: Mon Mar 04, 2019 2:31 am

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by hlg » Sat May 16, 2020 6:24 am

Cargo wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 2:28 am
a.
Because it's an extension of the currents entering and exiting the planet. If we could see it, the entire planet has an aurora, all the time, from the poles to the equator.
b.
If there are currents, there are magnetic fields.

(edit: I may have completely missed you're actual question or thought;) )
thanks for your reply!

a) of course i think of earth wired to the sun via birkeland currents as dr donald scott describes them, like shown in the green and black picture above, i kind of "see" it with my mind...

but to get more specific, we have to theorize what to search as an proof for our vision...

therefore i asked, are these charges making up these currents positive ones (=(excess) protons?) or electrons?

and b) is this consistent with the right hand rule for magnetic forces on these currents?

c) i think we have to find out if earths magnetic field has something to do with ferromagnetism at all, since the core ( if it exists at all) should be liquid and hence non magnetic

User avatar
JP Michael
Posts: 372
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2019 4:19 am

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by JP Michael » Sat May 16, 2020 7:55 am

If I can also ask, what about the role of airglow in the overall earth circuit? To me it seems like a kind of lesser aurora, forming similar filamentary 'ribs' or 'ripples'.

I would also love to point out that I see many, many cloud formations having the same ribbed/rippled pattern as seen in some auroras and in airglow (all the below images are my own. There was no chemtrail spraying on any of these days, so these are entirely natural cloud formations):

Example 1.
Example 2.
Example 3.

I am fully cognisant of the fact that electrical currents can flow in sheets or filaments without being visible. SAFIRE dark mode proved that. Question is whether it applies to earth's entire atmosphere. I believe it does, but I cannot express the degree to which it does so (yet). I think terrestrial circuit theory is far more interesting than cosmic circuits. Easier to study and they have direct impacts on our daily lives.

In terms of the Coriolis effect, I believe it is 100% the result of current interacting through water clouds with the Earth's magnetic field. Billy Yelverton demonstrates that flow directions reverse based on the magnetic polarity, north or south, otherwise known as the Lorentz Force in liquids. I reckon we would see the same thing in gases if we could dye the gas and run a similar experiment as Billy has done here.

Interestingly, both the traditional Coriolis Effect and the Lorentz Force have the same prediction about the equitorial regions. We will not expect to find rotation in storms in the equitorial region because that region of the earth represents the zone of magnetic/rotational reversal (and 90 degree angle from point of rotation for Coriolis effect = no rotation at equator).

Cylconic storms coming south from the northern hemisphere will cease to rotate because the Earth's magnetic field reverses at the equator. And vice versa. You will never get a cyclone hitting Indonesia or PNG, because cyclonic storms cannot exist in this area of Earth where its magnetic field reverses from north-south. There are still plenty of electric currents and thunderstorms, but you will never find cyclonic storms at Earth's equator because the current cannot coherently spin in response to Earth's magnetic fields either north or south.

hlg
Posts: 45
Joined: Mon Mar 04, 2019 2:31 am

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by hlg » Sat May 16, 2020 11:51 am

JP Michael wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 7:55 am


I am fully cognisant of the fact that electrical currents can flow in sheets or filaments without being visible. SAFIRE dark mode proved that. Question is whether it applies to earth's entire atmosphere. I believe it does, but I cannot express the degree to which it does so (yet). I think terrestrial circuit theory is far more interesting than cosmic circuits. Easier to study and they have direct impacts on our daily lives.

In terms of the Coriolis effect, I believe it is 100% the result of current interacting through water clouds with the Earth's magnetic field. Billy Yelverton demonstrates that flow directions reverse based on the magnetic polarity, north or south, otherwise known as the Lorentz Force in liquids. I reckon we would see the same thing in gases if we could dye the gas and run a similar experiment as Billy has done here.

Interestingly, both the traditional Coriolis Effect and the Lorentz Force have the same prediction about the equitorial regions. We will not expect to find rotation in storms in the equitorial region because that region of the earth represents the zone of magnetic/rotational reversal (and 90 degree angle from point of rotation for Coriolis effect = no rotation at equator).

Cylconic storms coming south from the northern hemisphere will cease to rotate because the Earth's magnetic field reverses at the equator. And vice versa. You will never get a cyclone hitting Indonesia or PNG, because cyclonic storms cannot exist in this area of Earth where its magnetic field reverses from north-south. There are still plenty of electric currents and thunderstorms, but you will never find cyclonic storms at Earth's equator because the current cannot coherently spin in response to Earth's magnetic fields either north or south.
😉 indeed: the video shows that in lows the H+ are flowing up and therefore the rotation fits to the patterns seen on earth.

(btw: on the equator the speed of the rotation is minimum only from a planetary fixed standpoint... in fact the speed corresponds roughly to speed of sound times 1.42...

perhaps this is a hint, how the rotation of earth itself is caused by those currents... )

your pictures show the interactions of multiple electric effects, to my opinion, in addition to the fast changes of density when condensation and evaporation takes place

User avatar
paladin17
Posts: 279
Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2014 2:47 pm
Contact:

Re: Electric Weather (cont.)

Unread post by paladin17 » Thu May 28, 2020 3:20 pm

hlg wrote:
Fri May 15, 2020 10:49 am
a) why do you think that in lows H+ are moving upwards, or do you think electrons are moving downwards in lows?
This isn't really what "I think". This is a "mainstream" idea that can be found in any textbook on atmospheric electricity or any relevant scientific paper.
hlg wrote:
Fri May 15, 2020 10:49 am
b) do you think that these currents upwards in lows give rise to magnetic forces, when interacting with earths magnetic field? would this give the explanation for the direction of rotation?
Yes, there are hypotheses (with some very interesting evidence) which suggest that this is what's happening.
I've given a couple of talks on the subject (available on YouTube): "Turning the Magnetic Key" (OTF2017) and "Atmospheric Structures in the Global Electric Circuit" (OTF2018).

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest