EmDrive

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allynh
Posts: 1115
Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2008 12:51 am

EmDrive

Unread post by allynh » Sat Nov 18, 2023 3:21 am

This is the first page from Forum v2.0

EmDrive (on Forum v2.0)
http://thunderbolts.info/wp/forum/phpBB ... 0a#p115675

This is a related article about a system that has just been put into orbit. We will have to keep track of events.

EXCLUSIVE: The ‘Impossible’ Quantum Drive That Defies Known Laws of Physics was Just Launched into Space
https://thedebrief.org/exclusive-the-im ... nto-space/
Podcasts
Quantum Drive
A controversial new electric propulsion system, which physicists say defies Newton’s Laws of Motion, was launched into space this weekend aboard a Space X rocket.

Developed by electronics prototyping company IVO Ltd, the Quantum Drive took flight Saturday morning, November 11th, aboard SpaceX’s Transporter 9 mission. This flight included over 80 separate payloads destined for Low Earth Orbit (LEO).

quantum drive
The Quantum Drives hopped a ride on SpaceX’s Transporter 9 mission. Image Credit: SpaceX
“Launch and deployment were successful!” IVO’s owner and founder, Richard Mansell, told The Debrief in a Sunday email. “We’re getting the satellite’s ‘heartbeat.’ Next step is to establish communication with the satellite.”

In that same email, Mansell said that once communication is established with “Barry-1”, the Rogue Space Systems satellite that is carrying the pair of Quantum Drives (hopefully sometime in the next 24 hours), the satellite will begin going through several steps before the Quantum Drives are actually put to the ultimate test. This includes gathering data in Low Earth Orbit for several weeks to set a baseline for when the drives are engaged.

“Rogue Space Systems and IVO are working closely together to collect a solid baseline of orbital data before firing up the Drives for the first time,” Mansell told The Debrief. “This will help substantiate the thrust results of the Quantum Drives.”

UPDATE: On Monday, November 13th, Rogue Space Systems officially contacted Barry-1.

“Rogue Space Systems has made positive contact with the satellite, and LEOP has begun!” Mansell told The Debrief. “We appreciate them allowing us to be a payload on their first satellite, and so far, it has been great working with them.”

Inventing the Quantum Drive

Earlier this summer, The Debrief spoke with Mansell at length about his company IVO, Ltd, the planned launch of the Quantum Drive, the controversy behind the technology his drives are based on, and what exactly caused him to pursue building something that nearly all mainstream scientists say should not work.

“We began playing around with the idea of ‘what is gravity’ and ‘what is inertia,’” Mansell told The Debrief at the time. “Then I came across the work of Professor Mike McCulloch at Plymouth University.”

On his website, McCulloch notes that Newton’s First Law defines inertia with the observation that “Objects move in straight lines at constant speed unless pushed on.” McCulloch further notes that although Newton defines inertia in these simple terms, the 17th-century genius never quite explains what precisely inertia is.

To explain the true nature of inertia, McCulloch developed his Quantized Inertia (QI) theory, which looks to the strange and mysterious properties of the quantum world for answers. Perhaps unsurprisingly, his efforts to explain inertia have led to wide-ranging criticisms since his proposal seems to defy the laws of motion first set down so many centuries ago, laws that have proven highly reliable for rocket scientists and engineers alike.

Still, Mansell says McCulloch’s work intrigued him. Unlike others who believed the Plymouth University professor might be on to something, he was uniquely positioned to act on it.

In fact, after receiving a patent for a capacitor used in the wireless transmission of power, a primary market for IVO’s commercial endeavor that includes the CBAT wireless transmission system currently undergoing strict FCC safety testing for certification, Mansell realized that his facilities were well equipped to do the initial prototyping of drives built using McCulloch’s theories.

“What if we start off by trying to replicate other people’s work and see if there is any merit (to QI)?” Mansell told The Debrief.

quantum drive
https://thedebrief.b-cdn.net/wp-content ... 0x1029.jpg
IVO Ltd.’s Quantum Drive. Image Credit IVO LTD.

Soon, Mansell and his team were working at their North Dakota Headquarters and a Virginia facility he calls “IVO East,” testing and refining ways to tap into the power of QI. This work was followed by over 100 hours of testing a prototype in a simulated space environment, resulting in their thrust-producing model. The team also recently completed a successful 1,000-hour “stress test,” which the Quantum Drive passed with flying colors.

So, while science said it shouldn’t work, his IVO’s drive seemed to produce the predicted amount of thrust in lab tests. At this point, Mansell said they knew that there was only one thing left to do.

“We got to the point where our third-party inspectors said, ‘At this point, there’s nothing we can do to debug what you’re doing,’” said Mansell. “It’s just got to go to space. It’s really got to go to space.”

Regardless of Results, the Quantum Drive’s ‘Do or Die’ Flight is a First

In another follow-up communication with The Debrief, Mansell noted the significance of the Quantum Drive successfully reaching space, making it the first in its class to move from lab experiments to real-world orbital testing.

“I don’t know of any other purely electric drives ever tested in space,” Mansell told The Debrief, including the controversial EMDrive, which, he noted, relies on a completely different technology but also claims to produce thrust without propellant. “If so, this will be the first time a purely electric, “non-conventional” drive will have ever been tested in space!”

Mansell also believes that whatever happens, his team has shown their customers and colleagues that they can move potentially revolutionary ideas from concept to product in record time.

“Whether or not the Quantum Drives produce the expected thrust, IVO will have shown again that we are capable of not only trying hard experiments, we can do them efficiently and in record time,” said Mansell, noting that his company was ready to go back in June before a glitch with something else on the satellite caused that flight to be canceled.

“In fact,” he added, “we were able to produce the final flight versions of the Quantum Drives in two months!”

How Science and Technology Can Take Big Leaps Forward

Following this past weekend’s successful launch, the tests are only a few weeks away. Then, once the drives are turned on, they will either successfully change the orbit of the Barry-1 satellite, rewriting the physics textbooks, or they will fail, and Sir Isaac Newton will be able to rest easy.

“Our goal is to raise the orbit,” said Mansell. “We would like to do several demonstrations. We’re going to do several orbits of just no thrust whatsoever to get a baseline set of data so we know what the background noise is. And then we’ll turn on the thrusters, the Quantum Drives, and raise the orbit. Then, the goal is to lower the orbit and be able to do this predictably, back and forth, and see if we can change the inclination of the orbit. That would be fantastic.”

Either way, Mansell says he is proud of his team’s efforts to reach this real-world test of their controversial drive. He also notes that in this business, there comes a time when theory must end, and practical testing must take over.

“IVO is always working to push the boundaries in any field it touches, and space is no exception,” he said. “We are not afraid to try difficult experiments–because this is how science and technology can really take big leaps forward. It is imperative not to rely on conjecture or the hypothetical, but real, hard data. This is why we have sent the Quantum Drives to space.”

Christopher Plain is a Science Fiction and Fantasy novelist and Head Science Writer at The Debrief. Follow and connect with him on X, learn about his books at plainfiction.com, or email him directly at christopher@thedebrief.org.

Cargo
Posts: 698
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2010 2:02 am

Re: EmDrive

Unread post by Cargo » Sat Nov 18, 2023 7:32 am

WHoa! This is Tesla.

'get a baseline set of data so we know what the background noise is. And then we’ll turn on the thrusters'

The 'thruster' is more like catching the wave, but in this case, the plasma/electric waves that consume 99% of the universe. The background 'inertia' of space. It's so Tesla and Star Trek. Also, they mention Virginia as one of their sites. Does anyone else remember the story of those Tesla Towers by I-95 some time ago.
interstellar filaments conducted electricity having currents as high as 10 thousand billion amperes
"You know not what. .. Perhaps you no longer trust your feelings,." Michael Clarage
"Charge separation prevents the collapse of stars." Wal Thornhill

Maol
Posts: 467
Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2011 8:40 pm

Re: EmDrive

Unread post by Maol » Tue Nov 21, 2023 2:42 pm

Cargo wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 7:32 am WHoa! This is Tesla.

'get a baseline set of data so we know what the background noise is. And then we’ll turn on the thrusters'

The 'thruster' is more like catching the wave, but in this case, the plasma/electric waves that consume 99% of the universe. The background 'inertia' of space. It's so Tesla and Star Trek. Also, they mention Virginia as one of their sites. Does anyone else remember the story of those Tesla Towers by I-95 some time ago.
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Tesla+Towers+ ... tsa&ia=web

Image

allynh
Posts: 1115
Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2008 12:51 am

Re: EmDrive

Unread post by allynh » Wed Mar 27, 2024 7:49 am

The test satellite failed. The drive never got tested.

Breaking: Satellite Failure Scuttles First-of-Its-Kind In-Space Test of Physics-Defying Quantum Drive
https://thedebrief.org/breaking-satelli ... tum-drive/
Podcasts
quantum drive
Rogue Space Systems has announced the failure of its Barry 1 satellite, which occurred before the company could test a controversial quantum drive propellantless propulsion system.

In a posted statement, the company said Barry 1 was able to complete a portion of its primary mission, including tests of their Scalable Compute Platform (SCP). Unfortunately, they lost contact with the satellite before they could perform any tests of IVO Ltd.’s Quantum Drive.

“Rogue’s Barry-1 satellite didn’t make it all the way through LEOP (Launch and Early Orbit Phase),” said IVO founder and President Richard Mansell in an email to The Debrief. “Sadly, we never even got to turn on the Drives!”

Power System Issues Haunted Quantum Drive Host Satellite Since Launch

According to the Rogue Space Systems statement, Barry 1 experienced ongoing power-system issues on the satellite’s bus immediately after its November 11th, 2023 launch and all throughout LEOP. Then, after two months of operations, the company said on February 9th, 2024 that they lost all communication with the satellite.

“Rogue Space Systems operations team is announcing the suspension of the active phase of our first on-orbit mission,” the company explained. In that same statement, Rogue says they are currently investigating the cause of the failure and are also trying to reestablish communications with Barry 1.

There has been no statement from Rogue on whether or not the bus failure was related to the original third-party equipment failure that delayed the mission’s original launch last October. However, the company did note their frustration at not being able to complete the Quantum Drive test, as well as their intent to pursue future launch opportunities with IVO.

“I’d like to take the opportunity to praise IVO for being a great customer,” said company CEO Jon Beam, “and we are in discussions on a second attempt during one of our upcoming new missions.” This includes a slate of Rogue hosting missions scheduled for some time in 2025.

In an email to The Debrief, IVO’s Mansell confirmed they are exploring future launch opportunities with Rogue. However, they are also exploring other potential options that may get their Quantum Drive to space as soon as possible.

“We have appreciated all that Rogue has done for us and look forward to hitching another ride with them,” Mansell said. “At the same time, they know that the sooner we can obtain a ride to space, the better. Therefore, we are also exploring additional opportunities to get to orbit.”

“The more Quantum Drives we can get into space, the better,” he added.

Drive Part of Controversial Class of Propulsion Systems

Unlike a conventional satellite propulsion system that uses some form of propellant, the Quantum Drive is part of an emerging yet controversial class of experimental propulsion systems that claim to generate measurable thrust without any propellant. Such claims go against the conventional understanding of momentum and inertia by directly violating Sir Isaac Newton’s second laws of motion.

More than one of these experimental propellant-less propulsion systems has appeared to create thrust in a lab environment, including the controversial EMDrive, whose thrust was confirmed both by Chinese scientists and NASA Eagle Works lab boss Harold G. Sonny White.

Still, before the Quantum Drive, none of these concepts had the opportunity to be tested in the vacuum of space, and all of their claims of thrust produced in the lab are still hotly debated by conventional physicists. As such, the failure of Barry 1 to perform the Quantum Drive test has been met with a combination of frustration and hope in the Alternative Propulsion Community.

“The new era of space exploration is characterized by pushing technology to the limits, failing fast, and learning from mistakes,” Tim Ventura, host of the bi-weekly Alternative Propulsion Engineering Conference (APEC), told The Debrief. “I would compare IVO’s setback to the countless Starship prototypes that exploded on the pad during testing – a small loss today in pursuit of larger gains for all humanity tomorrow.”

Fortunately for supporters of the controversial propulsion concept behind these types of drives, the Quantum Drive itself did not fail, but was simply unable to be tested.

For future test flights, Mansell said that IVO will be using the same basic design of the Quantum Drive that showed thrust in the lab. However, they do expect to include some recent improvements as well as any customizations needed to conform the drives to their host satellites.

“The overall configuration of the Drives will not change,” Mansell told The Debrief. “While waiting for the Barry-1 tests, we have been continuously working to improve the Drives. Those improvements will be part of the next set that goes to space.”

Christopher Plain is a Science Fiction and Fantasy novelist and Head Science Writer at The Debrief. Follow and connect with him on X, learn about his books at plainfiction.com, or email him directly at christopher@thedebrief.org.

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