Biological Action Potentials & Stellar Circuits

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Solar
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Biological Action Potentials & Stellar Circuits

Unread post by Solar » Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:33 am

Between the two of them Jacmac and Paladin have brought up an interesting topic. Perhaps the Natural Philosopher would say that the Sun and planets are a living system and that if one wants to understand how electrodynamics in living systems work; then clearly one needs to study the electrodynamics of a living system:
jacmac wrote: I am suggesting to change the viewing angle.
Perhaps the sun is the nucleus of a massive cell we call the Heliosphere ?
That is, a cell structure of plasma similar to a cell in biology.

Eric Dollard called the sun an antennae, and a collector.
That is a different view than a load, or discharge, in a circuit.

Plasma might be condensing and "self organizing" about a massive inner solar body,
building up a high voltage on and around that body,
and isolating the result via it's double layer ability.

A second double layer out at the heliopause would complete the cell structure to isolate the cell from the interstellar medium.

This seems to fit what we observe. IMO
When looking for an externally driven current are we forgetting the self organizing abilities of Plasma ? - Source
I very much agree with this viewing angle and have been correlating, and analogously applying, some of the concepts of Saltatory Conduction of “Action Potentials” in nerves, cells, and heart to what might be called ‘The Celestial Solar Circuit’. For my taste there is far more rewarding complements to be garnered from this approach and the dynamics of Ions as opposed to mechanical circuit analogies (although the later can be useful to some extent). This comparison has been mentioned before [here for example, and elsewhere]. In relation to this idea Paladin17 has asked a relevant question:
paladin17 wrote:... it is still not clear how exactly does this plasmoid keep magnetically repolarizing itself. And what stabilizes it thermally/gravitationally. - Source
To start the discussion I will offer the concept that biological Saltatory Conduction is an orders of magnitude smaller ("As above; so below") reflection of The Solar Cycle. In other words: The Solar Cycle is the Sun’s way of “depolarizing” and then “repolarizing” via the electrodynamics of Ion 'transport' into and out of its 'cellular membrane' (the Heliopause) in order to maintain its “resting potential”. This relationship can be viewed in either of two ways:

1- The Sun as a ‘cell’ in the galactic body of the Milky Way
2- The Sun as the ‘heart’ of this solar system

In the human body the dynamic of depolarization-resting potential-repolarization occurs at several scales as well for the heart is far larger than a cell. Yet, despite the difference in scale, both undergo this function. In both cases, like the Sun, I’m honestly not seeing a better, and perfectly natural way, to rhythmically (or cyclically) induce regular complete polarity reversals.

Study something like: Depolarization & Repolarization of the Cell and/or Heart

Then make comparisons to the ion 'transport' relationship(s) for the Sun and Heliopause. It appears that this dynamic reveals another Cosmic Function.
"Our laws of force tend to be applied in the Newtonian sense in that for every action there is an equal reaction, and yet, in the real world, where many-body gravitational effects or electrodynamic actions prevail, we do not have every action paired with an equal reaction." — Harold Aspden

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JP Michael
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Re: Biological Action Potentials & Stellar Circuits

Unread post by JP Michael » Tue Nov 26, 2019 7:51 pm

That last article on cellular/cardio depolarisation was a fascinating read: membrane electrical potential.

The problem I see is how does the sun's inorganic plasmasheath 'membrane' control the in-out flow of charged particles? A neuron has specific proteins coded, constructed and placed in the cell membrane by the DNA which control the access of charged atoms (eg. Na+, K+, Cl-, Fl-) in both directions as required by the cell at any given moment in time. What mechanism/location is performing this function in the plasma-membrane of the sun's plasmasheath (heliopause)?

The Voyager probes have demonstrated the existence of the heliopause ('membrane boundary'), but obviously the comparison breaks down in that the heliospheric membrane does not consist of a 'solid' barrier of carefully and precisely assembled proteins that cells have. What mechanisms of electromagnetohydrodynamics permit the controlled passage of plasma-charge in both directions through the sun's overarching plasmasheath, so that the sun itself experiences polarity reversal every 11.7 years?

I would say the organic study needs to go further: what is the intracellular relationship of charge potential between the nucleus and the membrane? How does the nucleus of a neuron change in polarity when its membrane exhibits 'rest', that is, changes its charge potential in context to the environment outside the cell's membrane?

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paladin17
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Re: Biological Action Potentials & Stellar Circuits

Unread post by paladin17 » Wed Nov 27, 2019 6:37 am

An interesting subject to think about.
Not only is the Sun similar to a living organism in its cyclical behavior, but it's also similar in the sense that it exports entropy (as I mention e.g. here, the Sun sustains its structure - it has layers of different temperature, it produces complex elements through fusion; and it also demonstrates emission of the most disorganized - black-body - photons outwards, kind of like waste etc.). Also, James Jeans had an idea that stars might divide (by rotating and splitting in two), which is pretty reminiscent of mitosis.
In general, if we're looking for analogies, I would say that the solar cycle resembles breathing more than anything else. Though heartbeat is also not far from this.
JP Michael wrote: The problem I see is how does the sun's inorganic plasmasheath 'membrane' control the in-out flow of charged particles?
I don't think the primal cause might be established at the moment (if it even exists), but we definitely might describe some obvious concurrent phenomena:
1) During solar maximum the cosmic ray flux is lower (which lowers the positive charge intake) - at least in the lower latitude area;
2) During solar maximum the charge exchange with the interstellar medium is lower (which lowers the positive charge outflow) - as evidenced by diminished ENA emissions from the heliospheric boundary;
3) During consecutive minima the direction of radial current in the heliospheric current sheet is reversed;
4) Long-term dynamics of cosmic ray flux during consecutive minima are slightly different (at minima which correspond to beginning of even cycles they are sharper, while at the beginning of odd cycles they are more flat);
5) The elemental composition of the fast and slow solar wind is different;
6) During solar maximum more of the fast wind comes out - at least in the lower latitude area;
7) During solar minimum more of the slow wind comes out - at least in the lower latitude area;
8) Total energy output at solar maximum is slightly (~ 0.1%) higher.

So it would seem that there are simultaneously changes in the elemental outflow and in the current direction between maximum and minimum. From some angle that does resemble some sort of metabolism.
Perhaps the elemental composition of cosmic rays also varies between the maximum and the minimum? That wouldn't be very surprising.

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Solar
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Re: Biological Action Potentials & Stellar Circuits

Unread post by Solar » Wed Nov 27, 2019 9:45 am

JP Michael wrote: The Voyager probes have demonstrated the existence of the heliopause ('membrane boundary'), but obviously the comparison breaks down in that the heliospheric membrane does not consist of a 'solid' barrier of carefully and precisely assembled proteins that cells have. What mechanisms of electromagnetohydrodynamics permit the controlled passage of plasma-charge in both directions through the sun's overarching plasmasheath, so that the sun itself experiences polarity reversal every 11.7 years?

I would say the organic study needs to go further: what is the intracellular relationship of charge potential between the nucleus and the membrane? How does the nucleus of a neuron change in polarity when its membrane exhibits 'rest', that is, changes its charge potential in context to the environment outside the cell's membrane?
In considering the Solar Cycle as the Sun’s regular ‘stellar depolarization' activity (it's stellar pulse or heartbeat) this was also one of my first questions. Notice this:
The picture of the heliopause (HP) -- the boundary between the domains of the sun and the local interstellar medium (LISM) -- as a pristine interface with a large rotation in the magnetic field fails to describe recent Voyager 1 (V1) spacecraft data. Magnetohydrodynamic (MHD) simulations of the global heliosphere reveal that the rotation angle of the magnetic field across the HP at V1 is small. Particle-in-cell simulations, based on cuts through the MHD model at the location of V1, suggest that the sectored region of the heliosheath (HS) produces large-scale magnetic islands that reconnect with the interstellar magnetic field and mix LISM and HS plasma. Cuts across the simulation data reveal multiple, anti-correlated jumps in the number densities of LISM and HS particles at the magnetic separatrices of the islands, similar to those observed by V1. A model is presented, based on both the observations and simulation data, of the HP as a porous, multi-layered structure threaded by magnetic fields. This model further suggests that, contrary to the conclusions of recent papers, V1 has already crossed the HP. - A Porous, Layered Heliopause M. Swisdak, J. F. Drake, M. Opher
Video Summary of above doc based on V1 detections: Voyager at the edge of the Heliosphere
These magnetic bubbles should act as electron traps, so the spacecraft would experience higher than normal electron bombardment as they traveled through the bubbles.

(…)

“We thought heliopause would be a smooth surface and shield us from intergalactic cosmic rays,” she said. “It is not a shield but more like a membrane that is a sea of bubbles.” - Voyagers Find Giant Jacuzzi-like Bubbles at Edge of Solar System
LEAKING PARTICLES
If the heliosphere is like a ship sailing through interstellar space, it appears the hull is somewhat leaky. The LECP detector showed that a trickle of particles from inside the heliosphere is slipping through the boundary and into interstellar space. Voyager 1 exited the heliosphere close to the very “front” of the heliosphere, relative to the bubble’s movement through space. Voyager 2, on the other hand, is located closer to the flank, and this region appears to be more porous than the region where Voyager 1 is located.

“Voyager 2 crossed in an area where material from inside the solar bubble was leaking upstream, into the galaxy,” Krimigis said. - Voyager 2 Illuminates Boundary of Interstellar Space: NASA November 6, 2019
The “leaking” isn’t actually “leaking” of course for the relationship is one of an actual function. The Heliosphere “membrane” is more so ‘semipermeable’ in nature for this allows more specialized ‘transport’ processes - as needed. The so called “bubbles” form the analogous “pathways” (or “protein pumps” controlling access) through the ‘thickness’ of the Heliospheric membrane known as the Heliopause. This of course neglects larger structures such as the IBEX Ribbon etc but these dynamic "magnetic islands" (thus far) make decent analogs of protein pumps.
"Resting Potential": A Stable Voltage Condition
This term "resting potential" simply refers to constant stable voltage across the membrane. It does not mean that the membrane is inactive. There are any number of stimuli that can ‘trigger’ the activation of the signal to rebalance (repolarize). To use the analogy: The resting potential of the Sun simply means that the voltage is constant i.e. relatively undisturbed for some period of time as part and parcel of its normal function.

Action Potentials 1 - Resting Membrane Potential

Up next: What might possibly induce the "signal" to begin Stellar Depolarization?
"Our laws of force tend to be applied in the Newtonian sense in that for every action there is an equal reaction, and yet, in the real world, where many-body gravitational effects or electrodynamic actions prevail, we do not have every action paired with an equal reaction." — Harold Aspden

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Re: Biological Action Potentials & Stellar Circuits

Unread post by Solar » Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:44 am

In consideration of these ever changing "magnetic islands" detected by V1 at the Heliosphere-Heliopause and which seem to be analogous to the "porous" channels of the cell's semipermeable membrane notice the structures and configuration of the following rather curious "vent holes" from the SAFIRE Project:

Special Feature: SAFIRE PROJECT 2019 UPDATE

Did the SAFIRE Project manage to capture and freeze these ever-changing "porous" events that facilitate bidirectional "leaking", as needed, across the membrane - and are those formations analogous to the Heliosphereic "magnetic islands"? Do they perform a similar function?

This is what is meant by depolarization possibly being a Cosmic Function i.e. the dynamic scales over multiple orders of magnitude.
"Our laws of force tend to be applied in the Newtonian sense in that for every action there is an equal reaction, and yet, in the real world, where many-body gravitational effects or electrodynamic actions prevail, we do not have every action paired with an equal reaction." — Harold Aspden

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Re: Biological Action Potentials & Stellar Circuits

Unread post by jacmac » Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:53 am

Solar:
Study something like: Depolarization & Repolarization of the Cell and/or Heart

Then make comparisons to the ion 'transport' relationship(s) for the Sun and Heliopause. It appears that this dynamic reveals another Cosmic Function.
Yes. Good information. We might ask how biological life is plasmalike, instead of plasma lifelike..
The “leaking” isn’t actually “leaking” of course for the relationship is one of an actual function.
Yes, the heliopause lets in enough plasma to maintain the stable sun, and the chromosphere double layer must exchange energy to the photosphere side of the sun to maintain its characteristics.

paladin 17:
I would say that the solar cycle resembles breathing more than anything else. Though heartbeat is also not far from this.
Yes, and on a smaller scale the ebb and flow of the granules also.

I think of the sunspots as disturbances to the quiet sun; yet they too have a cycle.
And that cycle doubles with the magnetic polarity changes.......
And we think our lives are complicated !

paladin 17 again:
6) During solar maximum more of the fast wind comes out - at least in the lower latitude area;
7) During solar minimum more of the slow wind comes out - at least in the lower latitude area;
8) Total energy output at solar maximum is slightly (~ 0.1%) higher.
I think of the solar wind as the return flows of extra, or unconsumed, or restructured, plasma back out to the heliopause.

Happy Holidays

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JP Michael
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Re: Biological Action Potentials & Stellar Circuits

Unread post by JP Michael » Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:54 pm

The mention of 'electron bubbles' in the heliosphere intrigues me. Is that the other end (heliopause end) of possible dark-mode 'tufts' emanating from the corona?

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Re: Biological Action Potentials & Stellar Circuits

Unread post by jacmac » Thu Nov 28, 2019 9:04 am

JP Michael:
The mention of 'electron bubbles' in the heliosphere intrigues me. Is that the other end (heliopause end) of possible dark-mode 'tufts' emanating from the corona?
In this paper
http://lesia.obspm.fr/turbu/talks/Greco ... _turbu.pdf
The author describes magnetic discontinuities in the solar wind as indication of individual "flux tubes",
and these tubes of plasma are on the same size scale as granules on the solar surface.

The pdf will not let me copy/paste here ?? sorry

If these flux tubes continue out to the heliopause they could terminate there as electron "bubbles"
as they collide with the heliopause, or become the heliopause, or both.

I have read elsewhere(?) the solar wind described as like a "plate of spaghetti."

This could be a direct plasma connection between the chromosphere Double Layer and
the heliopause (double layer?)

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The Great Dog
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Re: Biological Action Potentials & Stellar Circuits

Unread post by The Great Dog » Thu Nov 28, 2019 2:29 pm

https://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/2019/0 ... s-bubbles/

It seems like the spaghettification of the solar wind plasma is inevitable, since field-aligned currents are formed by electric charge moving through ionized media.

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Stellar Depolarization

Unread post by Solar » Fri Nov 29, 2019 12:17 pm

To recapitulate, in a cell it can take milliseconds, in the heart approximately a minute, in the Sun 11-14 years, and yes; several tens of thousands to millions of years for the cyclic Active Galactic Nucleus (AGN) phase as galaxies interact with the Intergalactic Medium (IGM). To further, in similar fashion to the way stars interact with molecular clouds in the Interstellar Medium (ISM), each of these surrounding mediums establishing an external environment can be made analogous to scaled up versions of the Intracellular Fluid (IF) that surrounds all cells:
Action Potential: In response to the appropriate stimulus, the cell membrane of a nerve cell goes through a sequence of depolarization from its rest state followed by repolarization to that rest state. In the sequence, it actually reverses its normal polarity for a brief period before reestablishing the rest potential. - Hyperphysics
Complete polarity reversals and back again is characterized as if it occurs in stages; but at larger scales its a smooth transition:

Polarization - (a star is already polarized via the presence of its dipole moment)
Resting Potential - (the relatively stable, undisturbed, voltage condition)
Depolarization - (upon reaching a plateau a shift in electric charge distribution towards either more positive or more negative relative to the resting potential)
Hyperpolarization - (a shift in charge distribution that “overshoots” or "undershoots" the resting potential i.e. overly negative or overly positive)
Repolarization - (a change in membrane potential towards reestablishing the resting potential)

It is the Hyperpolarization phase that “overshoots” or “undershoots” (either overly positive, or overly negative) the critical range that subsequently initiates a “signal” to repolarize back and forth towards the resting potential (stellar quiescence). It's almost as if cells (stars) are trying to remain overall neutral relative to their surroundings.

Comparatively, like a cell, the Sun’s depolarization cycle (aka The Solar Cycle) infers that this star actively balances overages and underages relative to its resting potential as a regular functional part of its nature. Also, in like manner to a cell, bidirectional electrochemical adjustments across the heliopause membrane are one of the facets employed to do so.

Perhaps the simplest way to look at the concept is to give thought to the fact that the “solar wind” is considered to be “overall neutral”. Simultaneously the convergence of a myriad of external local, interstellar, galactic, and intergalactic potencies exert influences upon the Solar Nucleolus inside its heliosphere. Those external influences can’t all likewise be “overall neutral”.

Therein lay the comparison to the rubies Sir William Crookes placed into vacuum which underwent fluorescence because they do not want to “climb or fall to the electrical potential of the environment”. The Sun on the other hand induces an “overall neutral” environmental ‘structure’ of its own to modulate, or regulate, the input of that environment while simultaneously undergoing electrochemical Reactance inducing an electrochemical “output” to balance the overshoot and/or undershoot that might disrupt the balance of said ‘structure’ (self-regulates).

Whatsoever the resting potential of the Sun may be depolarization and repolarization is the “heartbeat” that replenishes and sustains the supposedly “overall neutral” environment of the inner heliosphere relative to the symbiotic bidirectional input-output (“leaking”) that occurs between environments of different polarity via charge separation & charge exchange. Needless to say across a semipermeable membrane (heliopause. The under/over swings in voltage known as "Hyperpolarization" relative to the resting potential initiates the "signal" to return to a stable voltage condition.
"Our laws of force tend to be applied in the Newtonian sense in that for every action there is an equal reaction, and yet, in the real world, where many-body gravitational effects or electrodynamic actions prevail, we do not have every action paired with an equal reaction." — Harold Aspden

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