The Large Hadron Collider (LHC) - The grander the better ?

[rangerover777]

Science have it’s own gimmicks from time to time. This one is one of the
larger gambles ever done, in order to figure out the atom’s structure and how
the universe was created (among other new particles that most likely will be
discovered in order to justify 6 billion dollars…).

Like Edward Leedskalnin claimed and demonstrated (through $50 dollars tests),
that the North and South pole individual magnets are the building block of the
universe, together with the NPM (Neutral Particle of Matter).
Since Ed’s notes are too long to publish, I will just bring one section :

“We have North and South pole magnets, positive and negative electricity,
protons, and electrons, positrons and mesons and alpha, beta and gamma rays.
Now why such a confusion? Does nature really need so many things in the
perpetual transformation of things, on building up the matter and again taking
it into parts? I think all that nature needs is three things, the North and South
pole magnets and the neutral particles.
Each kind of those three things can act differently with different speed and
different combinations, and so they can accomplish different results. I believe
the prospective physicists first should learn what magnets and electricity are,
then they will have a sound base for their experiments and their calculations“.

If Ed was right, then all the particles that make the atoms are three types only.
When you thinks for a moment that all these new “discovered” particles, including
the electron ( http://www.leedskalnin.net/elect-1.htm ) are nothing else but
combinations of N & S pole magnets, then a whole industry of “inventing nature”
is being revealed in it’s naked form.

The LHC is the next one to “complicated life”. But this time it was built to
such an extent with such publicity, that no one will stand a chance in front of
this “washing head machine”, that came to reinforce the fact that science was
right all along about “how nature is complicated” and made only for scientists
who belong themselves to main-stream and able to repeat the laws of physics
even if you wake them at 3 Am….

For some reason, there is a thread or a theme since the beginning of the industrial
revolution of “overcoming nature” and not necessarily by sending man to the moon,
or driving a car on a gasoline engines (which belong to the “brute power” side), but
more in the lines of “exploring nature in the name of advanced society”, that must
be fed by science on a daily basis. In other words, we cannot say “we don’t know
why we have rain or mountains or other phenomenas”, we have a ready made
answer, straight from Wikipedia or other sources literally on everything. The only
thing that left to discover are the Atom and heavens.

Science like many other industries (movies, cars, fashion. etc.) is under a great
pressure to feed the beast, to achieve further, to come up with new products, to
supply new inventions and to cover the bills (all this game cost, as you know…).

The LHC remind me the movie “Titanic” for some reason (though they spent
only 1 billion on production). Same grand opening, same publicity, great expectations
(will they find the Higgs Boson , or not ?), same glamour and “selebriticity” (the
personal involved directly w/ the project).

Think for yourself, what if Ed Leedskalnin was right ? Then the whole stunt is
the best comedy ever made, and instead of Titanic we will get the Marx Brothers…

Enjoy the show.

[Osmosis]

If the LHC does not find anything new, then more funding must be expended. It works for gravity wave detectors. Besides, think of all the construction jobs created in this current world of economic problems.

[Zonei]

Personally I believe the Grand Hadron Collider will only bring more questions and no answers. If particle physicists are anything like mainstream astrophysicists, then new theories will be invented to compensate for the lack of empirical evidence for already posed hypotheses.

Meanwhile, I've already placed bets that Higgs boson will not be found.

[substance]

Personally I believe the Grand Hadron Collider will only bring more questions and no answers. If particle physicists are anything like mainstream astrophysicists, then new theories will be invented to compensate for the lack of empirical evidence for already posed hypotheses.

Meanwhile, I've already placed bets that Higgs boson will not be found.

Yup, of course they`ll think of new theories to explain the lack of results.
They even do rap songs happily dancing! No, seriously check it out!
I`ll have to wait to 2010 when the collider is in full power to able to laugh my ass off, when they find absolutely nothing. 6 billion dollars thrown away, imagine if someone gave even 1/10 of this budget for plasma research!

[MalOK]

Can i just have 1/10 of the budget to blow on personal things?

But seriously, where does this kind of stuff end? There is nothing to be found, yet more and more funding is given to these people, so they can continue to smash atoms together, hoping to find something that doesn't exist. I'll be in my bunk, watching firefly...

[MattEU]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/u ... 547511.ece

Higgs suggested that all space is permeated by a “field” that interacts with the particles within it, giving them mass....
Higgs predicted that some types of particle would react more strongly with the field than others. Others such as photons, the particles that make up light, would not interact at all. That is why they have no mass and hurtle around the universe unimpeded.

Finally, said Higgs, his invisible field should create particles of its own – the famous boson – that could be spotted with sufficiently powerful equipment. But at the time, none was available.

If it (LHC) finds the tiny particles he predicted, it will confirm that our understanding of the structure of the universe is on the right track. If it fails, it will raise even greater questions.
Higgs is excited at either prospect. “It will almost be a relief when they find it,” he said. “It could even be more exciting if they don’t because it means all our ideas are wrong and we have to start again.”

[redeye]

I know it's juvenile but I couldn't resist

New York Times

Apparently they are lighting it up for the first time tomorrow.

Cheers!

[Solar]

Physicists will use the LHC to recreate the conditions just after the Big Bang...

Ah. The "quark-gluon" plasma assumed to have existed during that non-electrical moment. Does anyone know why the assumption that the Universe had a "beginning" has such a prevalence in big bang science?

Only experimental data using the higher energies reached by the LHC can push knowledge forward, challenging those who seek confirmation of established knowledge, and those who dare to dream beyond the paradigm. - The Large Hadron Collider

Sounds to me like they're just extending the existing paradigm of established knowledge. There's nothing "challenging" in that.

[redeye]

It worked...well at least it didn't blow up when they switched it on this time. It will take till next year before they have it running at full capacity though.

Not that they're likely to find what they're looking for. John Dalton created the modern atomic model back in the days where it was thought to be impossible to visualise an atom. He based his model on the Solar System but it was never supposed to be a description of reality, simply a visual model to enable better understanding and discussion of atomic theories. This inconvenient truth is almost as big a battleground on wiki as eu theory.

Cheers!

[Solar]

It's this "particle" concept that's so pervasive dispite the fact none have ever been found.

We know that three of the fundamental forces result from the exchange of force carrier particles, which belong to a broader group called ‘bosons’. Matter particles transfer discrete amounts of energy by exchanging bosons with each other. Each fundamental force has its own corresponding boson particle – the strong force is carried by the ‘gluon’, the electromagnetic force is carried by the ‘photon’, and the ‘W and Z bosons’ are responsible for the weak force. Although not yet found, the ‘graviton’ should be the corresponding force-carrying particle of gravity. - The standard package

These supposed "particles" exist for what... like.. 10^-12 seconds (thanks Dave Thompson) in accelerated smash-ups and then poof; gone, winking out of existance? Quickly afterwards every nuance of residue is given a new "particle" name. Sounds like another never ending fiasco.

The most amazing feature of this $6 billion experiment is the confused and illogical thinking behind it.

Of course, particle physicists operate by smashing atoms in violent collisions. But if normal matter is composed of subunits of charge in some resonant state of equilibrium (the simplest picture), then smashing particles together will merely generate new unstable (short lived) resonant systems of charge, which will be interpreted as members of a weird zoo of new particles. The LHC Collider can do no more than that.
- The $6 billion LHC Circus @ Holoscience

If you venture into the subatomic world in an attempt to unveil its inner workings, possession of all the knowledge in the world is not enough. Instead, invite your imagination to serve as a guide, because many rules as we know them no longer apply. Just like the story of Alice In Wonderland, this new world may look familiar but it is not fully comprehensible. Scales shift and matter transforms. Transitory twins appear and extra dimensions hide. - A subatomic venture

Yeah... right.

[BullSchmutz]

Does anyone know why the assumption that the Universe had a "beginning" has such a prevalence in big bang science?

The Vatican.

[mague]

Physicists will use the LHC to recreate the conditions just after the Big Bang...

Ah. The "quark-gluon" plasma assumed to have existed during that non-electrical moment. Does anyone know why the assumption that the Universe had a "beginning" has such a prevalence in big bang science?

We should prepare to find the truth somewhere inbetween. Maybe there was a beginning, but no big bang ?

The beginning isnt the problem, the bang is. The picture that the whole expansion is based on a single source is the wet dream of any god king. Vatikan is only one of many. Rome was there before christs birth. No big bang, no emperor, no hirarchy, no taxes

[chasingdragons]

Most powerful man made magnetic array this age is now humming. Powered up an hour or two before a couple of 6 point something earthquakes in Japan and Indonesia. Many of the world’s science heavyweights and earthly powers that made them so, are gathered under the cuckoo clock like a bunch of cuckoo birds.

They do not have the liability insurance to pay for loss of life and earthquake damage, never mind the 9.6 hit to their reputations if their magnets attract, repulse or flip around earths natural forces.

This will be covered up so quick and deep most humans will feel safely tucked under a cozy baby blanket, and all is well. Not that all will necessarily end well, but there you are. Science on the march. Teflon. Tang. Bidda bidda boom bang.

[bdw000]

Most powerful man made magnetic array this age is now humming. Powered up an hour or two before a couple of 6 point something earthquakes in Japan and Indonesia.

Is that true?

That is definitely not a good sign

I believe the author Bruce Cathie used to CLAIM that he could predict major earthquakes based on when (and where) certain countries did their nuclear bomb tests.

The problem for future analysis of the "LHC related to earthquakes" problem is that it stays on pretty much all the time right? So no more analysis is possible, since the thing is just running 24 hrs a day.

Maybe when they crank up the power every now and then we can look for earthquakes (or their absence)?

[StevenO]

Does anyone know why the assumption that the Universe had a "beginning" has such a prevalence in big bang science?

It's the only theory they could dream up to explain why the redshift of galaxies is proportional to their distance. Dah.

The Vatican.

Philosophical and religious interpretations of the Big Bang theory

The Big Bang is a scientific theory, and as such stands or falls by its agreement with observations. But as a theory which addresses, or at least seems to address, the origins of reality, it has always been entangled with theological and philosophical implications. In the 1920s and '30s almost every major cosmologist preferred an eternal universe, and several complained that the beginning of time implied by the Big Bang imported religious concepts into physics; this objection was later repeated by supporters of the steady state theory.[58] This perception was enhanced by the fact that Georges Lemaître, who put the theory forth, was a Roman Catholic priest.