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Thunderbolts Forum • View topic - EmDrive

EmDrive

Plasma and electricity in space. Failure of gravity-only cosmology. Exposing the myths of dark matter, dark energy, black holes, neutron stars, and other mathematical constructs. The electric model of stars. Predictions and confirmations of the electric comet.

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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby Zyxzevn » Mon Oct 31, 2016 3:57 pm

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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby upriver » Tue Nov 08, 2016 2:01 pm

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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby Zyxzevn » Tue Nov 08, 2016 4:30 pm

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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby willendure » Thu Nov 10, 2016 4:11 pm

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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby allynh » Mon Nov 14, 2016 2:02 pm

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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby kasim » Thu Nov 17, 2016 6:10 pm

You've all been blinded by science. The only law you need is the conservation of linear momentum. You see, nobody explains what happens when the photon is fired. In order for it to gain momentum as it's fired from the magnetron, the photon imparts a recoil on the magnetron in the opposite direction to the photon. That's what produces the thrust. When it reaches the back plate, it imparts momentum onto the back plate in the opposite direction to the nose of the cone thereby reducing the initial momentum gained. It would've been better not to have a back plate and all of the forward momentum would've been kept.

All that talk about F = ma and E=mc^2 is just baloney to blind unsuspecting people and convince them that it's all based on science. Shawyer is like a con artist who knows a little bit about science and uses it successfully to fool others.

But then, he's not the only one who had fooled governments into handing over hard earned cash over things that can't happen. What about the 10 billion euros spent to collect evidence to prove the existence of a particle that doesn't exist. It was just assumed to exist to give particles mass because the Standard Model equations would fail if they had mass. I mean why not just abandon the Standard Model rather than invent theories to make it work? Remember that God exists but the God Particle doesn't. I mean energy cannot be created, according to the energy conservation law, so how come we have energy. Either the energy conservation law is wrong or God created it.

My definition of the energy conservation law is: Only God can create and destroy energy; mere mortals can only change it from one form to another. I'm not religious but the science led me to God. In other words I'm still not religious, but now, I believe in a creator.

I've written a free to download book about the fallacies of science: It also gives an alternative Standard Model that doesn't need fixes...yet.
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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby allynh » Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:34 pm

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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby Keith Ness » Mon Nov 21, 2016 5:00 pm

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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby LunarSabbathTruth » Mon Nov 21, 2016 5:38 pm

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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby Keith Ness » Mon Nov 21, 2016 6:54 pm

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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby Keith Ness » Thu Nov 24, 2016 12:30 pm

So here's an example of a particle analogue of the effect I think they're seeing in their EM drive model, and how "equal and opposite" might be universally true, but still only in a limited sense.

Say you're in a spacesuit inside an enclosed cube with no engine in a Zero-g vacuum. You need to get moving somewhere, and all you have are 15 billiard balls which you either don't want to or can't just throw into space outside the cube; they must come with you one way or another. How do you get moving in one direction more than another? Well, you arrange 14 of the billiard balls in a certain way in the middle of the cube, put your back up against one wall near that wall's middle, and throw the 15th billiard ball at the other billiard balls in such a way that the ball pushes you against the wall, propelling the cube forward, while the ball travels to 2 of the other balls, hits them so it stops relative to where the other 2 balls were before it hit them, and sends each of them in 45 degree angles to the thrown ball's trajectory before it hit them. Then those two hit balls each hit two more balls each, each of which in turn also travels at 45 degrees to the former trajectory of the ball which hit it, and so on, until some of the balls are even travelling in the direction the cube is travelling. Assuming you threw the ball hard enough to give the cube enough momentum, the cube will slow down but not stop when it collects all of the balls on the far wall, because not all of the original counterthrust of the thrown ball is going in the opposite direction of the cube when the cube collects the balls bearing that counterthrust.

billiards 01.jpg


The general idea is to throw a finite number of particles into a numerically and voluminously larger but still finite group of particles, so the momentum of the thrown particles can scatter via the larger group into directions which are not exactly opposite in direction to the counter-momentum given to the vessel by the thrown particles before the particles bearing that momentum are recaptured by the vessel.

So a more advanced example might be an enclosed cylinder containing air. A fan with a diameter significantly smaller than the cylinder's diameter is fixed to the cylinder, close to and in the middle of one end of the cylinder, facing and blowing the air in the cylinder towards the other end of the cylinder, and we let some sort of convective system do it's work. I don't know what the optimal power/periodicity of fan use would be, nor the optimal temperature/pressure/chemistry/dimensions of the various components would be, but that's the basic idea. A heat source exciting particles instead of a fan blowing them might also suffice.

cylinder 01.jpg


It might even be that an astronaut stranded in space with nothing but a spacesuit could propel himself forward by simply tapping his finger to the front of his suit near his center of mass repeatedly.

What are your thoughts? Did I miss something?
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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby Zyxzevn » Thu Nov 24, 2016 4:59 pm

Because it is an "enclosed" system, there are 2 possible conventional causes:
1) forces caused by the transport of energy from the device.
2) forces caused by the transport of energy into the device.

1-> There are many possibilities for that. Where does the energy go, produced by the device?
It does not just function as a battery: the energy goes out somewhere.
The amount of force is so small, it could be anything. Heat is the most common,
but sound might also be possible.
Note: if there would be no leaking at all, the device would become hotter and hotter.

Because the force is measured when the frequency resonates with the "cover" of the system,
it looks to me that the electrical currents in the device will be resonating due to the EM-waves.
This means that the electrical currents that are common with EM-waves hitting a conductor,
will reach deeper levels than normal. Usually these are only surface currents, but if large enough
they will simply reach deeper. This will cause the shielding to fail.
And this will cause some leakage of the EM-waves to the outside.

2-> A study in Germany thought it might have been this after they did not measure any force when they put
the energy-source inside the device.

As I look at the "scientific" work of the device, I do not see proper analysis of the currents in the device.
Instead of a common EM-analysis that goes into the above points, they jump into quantum physics nonsense.

And this again shows that the NASA has a lack of people educated in common Electromagnetism,
as we also can see in their analysis of the sun.
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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby Keith Ness » Sat Nov 26, 2016 1:35 pm

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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby Keith Ness » Tue Nov 29, 2016 5:36 pm

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Re: EmDrive

Unread postby Keith Ness » Thu Dec 01, 2016 5:04 am

I continue posting on my explanation for the Emdrive in the New Insights and Mad Ideas sub-forum thread below, since my explanation suggests a significant limitation to Newton’s third law, and doesn’t explicitly refer to electric universe theory:

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=16544
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