Evidence of Ancient Global Cataclysm

[GaryN]

Lloyd

That flood did some major erosion.

s.

I think they actual referred to floods, plural.

Yet there isn't a single numerical simulation of ANY amount of water cutting through rock and creating anything at all like the observed features. Isn't science mostly about simulations these days, mathematical models? Can't be done.

[Lloyd]

Flood Water Erosion of Sedimentary Rock by Cavitation

Lloyd

That flood did some major erosion.

s. I think they actual referred to floods, plural.
- Yet there isn't a single numerical simulation of ANY amount of water cutting through rock and creating anything at all like the observed features. Isn't science mostly about simulations these days, mathematical models? Can't be done.

- None that we're aware of.
- The Glen Canyon dam concrete spillways were greatly cavitated by a minor flood in 1983. One spillway suffered a gap 32 feet (9.8 m) deep, 40 feet (12 m) wide, and 150 feet (46 m) long. The other had a bit smaller gap. See for details https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Risks_to_ ... Canyon_Dam. Here's a picture of the gap: https://www.icr.org/i/articles/af/cavitation_pic.jpg.
- A video, called Cataclysmic Floods and Cavitation Erosion, at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GvUxGWpjvlY shows cavitation from running water on metal and compares it to the erosion from the ice-age flood in Washington. We don't need simulations, if we have videos of actual cavitation. It says the flood waters were flowing at 30 meters per second and were 100 meters deep.
- I assume that cavitation is caused by vacuum forces, but it's conceivable that electrical forces could be involved, just as Charles Chandler has explained with regard to tornadoes.
- See images regarding flood cavitation at https://www.google.com/search?q=flood+c ... 4e157RM%3A .

[Grey Cloud]

I remember watching a documentary some years ago about either the Hoover or Grand Coulee dam. After heavy rains and a massive build-up of water behind the dam they opened all the stops to ease the pressure. When the waters had receded they found that the reinforced concrete of the 'emergency release tunnels' (don't know the technical term) had been shredded by rocks carried by the water. There were boulders of considerable size dumped downstream of the dam.
The incident took place in the black and white age, not sure of the decade.

[seasmith]

Lloyd,
What do you think of Carlson's version of the "Cosmic Zodiacal Clock", for a possible sequence of catastrophic events?

Published on Mar 9, 2016
Part 5 of 6: “Drowning of the World during the Age of Leo”
Review the ‘Cosmic Zodiacal Clock’, identifying the winter of the Great Year as the Age of Leo, which was thoroughly catastrophic – drastic climate change and mass extinction, ...etc.

The more recent disaster, he proposes, was at the precessional 'Age of Taurus', from which the various surviving peoples were just recovering when the first modern civilizations, like Sumer, lifted off.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3sI-ty1slE8

[Lloyd]

Catastrophe Cycle
Seasmith, you said: What do you think of Carlson's version of the "Cosmic Zodiacal Clock", for a possible sequence of catastrophic events?

I don't see much good evidence for the clock, i.e. for the multi-millennial cycle of catastrophes.

Cataclysms
The so-called Taurus age may be the time when the Great Flood or the Supercontinent Breakup occurred, or both. In the early part of this thread I showed a lot of evidence that the Great Flood occurred over 4,000 years ago and that the Flood was the cause of nearly all sedimentary rock formation, which covers most of the continents to about a mile deep. So it seems unlikely that anything before the Great Flood remains, other than the bedrock itself. All remnants of former civilization would be found mostly under sedimentary rock, just like the fossils. And all of the fossils were of the same time, not thousands or millions of years apart.

Flood
Carlson seems to think the Great Flood was due to sudden melting of huge ice caps. My guess is that he thinks comets or something fell on the ice caps and melted them suddenly. But I think a lot of the evidence of great ice caps may be better evidence of the Great Flood itself, or of smaller floods. So I'm not yet confident that there were great ice caps much bigger than the present ones.

This is the best explanation of the Great Flood that I've read: Noah’s Flood: The Key to Correct Interpretation of Earth History https://www.socalsem.edu/2015/08/09/noa ... th-history.

Halloween Cycle
It's plausible that catastrophic cosmic cycles may exist, but it seems merely theoretical for now. Carlson's Halloween video did make a convincing case that great catastrophes did occur each year around Halloween and in late June or July, because the Earth was moving through the Taurid Meteor Stream twice a year and the stream likely had a lot of larger meteors or asteroids in it initially. So the cycle stopped being catastrophic after several decades apparently. It's possible that the cycle started with a Venus encounter.

[Lloyd]

Ice Cap
Afterthought. Considering former sea levels, which Carlson says were 400 feet lower than now, it is reasonable to suppose that the ice caps were much larger than now and that they melted, causing the sea level rise. It's also possible that water arrived from outside the Earth to cause the rise in sea level. And then there's the matter of rapid continental drift that likely had some effect on sea levels.

[seasmith]

Lloyd,
Thanks. Just a note on "Ice Cap".

When i was a kid in school, the last ice age 'cap' was depicted as covering the whole area of the Arctic Circle and protruding southward all around, down into the temperate latitudes.
Now it is a generally accepted fact that the ice and snow only drooped down on to N America, Greenland and NW Europe; while large swathes of Siberia and even to the Chukchi Peninsula were considerably warmer then than they are now. There is plenty of preserved floral and faunal evidence to support that view btw.

Surprising, i've learned, there are still quite a few folk even on the forum, who still still have that 20th century polar-centric icecap meme on their mind !

Besides possibly lending some credence to a (temporary) ~3oº axis of rotation shift (see earlier Electro-Static Gyrostat (ESG) posts for feasibility), and vast areas of prime coastal lands made available for habitation by sea-level drops; the newer data also makes some sense of the Greek legends about an advanced ancient race of Hyperboreans. IMO

Are you familiar with Vedic and other mythologies about a Great Mount Meru of the North with its four cardinal rivers, and/or also its N-S dual-version called Sumeru=superMeru, with its magnetospheric suggestive "hourglass" shape ?

https://www.nps.gov/nr/feature/indian/2003/park.htm

[moses]

Seasmith, I wonder whether the North Pole pointed in the same direction as today when the North Pole was in North America. You say that the Pole was only temporarily in North America but it must have taken a long time for those warm-liking creatures to inhabit Siberia. And then there is the alignment of ancient temples as marking the ancient equator which puts the North Pole in North America :

http://coolinterestingstuff.com/mysteri ... -the-world

A major issue is that this indicates that the North Pole was in North America in the previous configuration of planets. This stuffs up the theory that the similarity of tilt of some of the planets indicates that these planets were in the same stellar/brown dwarf system. Because it is really hard to believe that the Pole could shift through the Earth that much and yet the North Pole would point in the same direction. And electrical interaction beween Earth and Mars might easily cause the axes to point in the same direction, or have the same tilt.

Very few people would survive that shift of the axis through the Earth. After that would come the glaciers but the survivors would find a bountiful Earth after that.

Cheers,
Mo

[seasmith]

Mo,

It's not my theory, but the scenario usually put forth displaces the N pole only ~30º, to somewhere between Spitsbergen and Greenland, which would not effect much of a declination in say Egypt: where there are in fact several different temple alignments present. "Temporary" would only be the period when the ice cap was forming.
Also, if ~Siberia were temperate for a long time Before the last ice age, then the flora & fauna would reflect that case.

Yes, an Electro-Static Gyrostat model for precessions of a spinning magnetic planet Is an "electrical interaction".
Have you seen those little toy globes that spin in in a magnetic field unattached to anything?

[GaryN]

Lloyd:

Thanks, GC. I just watched one of them regarding the ice age flood in Washington state.

I too have watched videos and read reports about the Scablands, and everything I've seen could be explained by large scale electrical phenomena. I agree with Steve Smith and his TPODS.

The Channeled Scablands
https://www.thunderbolts.info/tpod/2008 ... blands.htm

Sudbury
https://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/2016/12/14/sudbury/

The magnitude of electrical events that must have occurred is staggering, but that is only because we are so tiny and insignificant, our reality is incommensurate with that of the planets and solar system, and even the very largest features we can observe on Earth are really only minor scuffs and scrapes to Mother Earth.

[Grey Cloud]

Gary,
I'm awarding you a point for using the word 'incommensurate'.

[moses]

<Also, if ~Siberia were temperate for a long time Before the last ice age, then the flora & fauna would reflect that case. seasmith>

The evidence is hard to find but certainly there are a lot of fossils in Siberia suggesting better conditions in the past, and then there is the cooler conditions in Florida in ancient times.

I still look at the past as there being a different configuration of planets in very different electrical conditions to today. Mainly because I think that the evidence for planetary interaction in the past is immense, and to think that the planets returned to about the same positions before these interactions, is fanciful. Therefore I hunt for clues about this past configuration.

So I put the Earth's axis in North America in the past. Which suggests a massive event to move the pole to it's present position. The ice age was when the Earth was in a temporary orbit after this massive event.

But lately I still have the theory that Earth and Ganymede interacted every few hundred to a few thousand years and consider what configuration could produce this. Perhaps the Sun was a lot brighter back then and Earth and Ganymede orbited somewhere near the present asteroid belt. Then it might take a long time until Earth and Ganymede interacted. Then side by side but with one inverted, there could have been an electrical current flowing through and around the Earth from north to south completing the circuit by flowing in and around Ganymede.

Cheers,
Mo

[Lloyd]

I too have watched videos and read reports about the Scablands, and everything I've seen could be explained by large scale electrical phenomena. I agree with Steve Smith and his TPODS.

So you deny the reality of cavitation by flooding, or rapid water movements, as occurred in the Glen Canyon dam and as demonstrated in the video I linked? So far there isn't any largescale evidence for the EU theory on that.

[Lloyd]

Ice Cap

Lloyd, Now it is a generally accepted fact that the ice and snow only drooped down on to N America, Greenland and NW Europe; while large swathes of Siberia and even to the Chukchi Peninsula were considerably warmer then than they are now. There is plenty of preserved floral and faunal evidence to support that view btw. ... the newer data also makes some sense of the Greek legends about an advanced ancient race of Hyperboreans. IMO
Are you familiar with Vedic and other mythologies about a Great Mount Meru of the North with its four cardinal rivers, and/or also its N-S dual-version called Sumeru=superMeru, with its magnetospheric suggestive "hourglass" shape ? ...

We've discussed the evidence before here that Siberia was warm and inhabited by many mammals before the ice age. The mammals were frozen suddenly, apparently because rapid continental drift caused by a large asteroid impact off eastern Africa pushed Eurasia and North America northward into the frigid zone. The impact may have caused movement of the warmer air mass southward suddenly, causing much colder air to move over northern Siberia, causing the sudden freezing of animals. I referenced Mike Fischer's site, http://NewGeology.us, and the Frozen Mammoths chapter of Walter Brown's online book, probably here: http://www.creationscience.com/onlinebo ... moths.html.

Sumeru
- Regarding Mount Meru, the EU team has rather thoroughly shown that such myths, including Atlantis, the Garden of Eden, etc, referred to the ancient enduring conjunction of the planets, Saturn, Venus and Mars, above the north pole. The four rivers were possibly a plasma formation above the face of Venus, as they were sometimes called water, and sometimes fire. The hyperboreans were likely the Atlanteans, figures that appeared on a celestial plateau above the horizon. Have you seen TPODs on that?

[seasmith]

Have you seen TPODs on that?

Yes, here is one, illustrated with a fine piece of ancient rock-cut art, though somewhat damaged.

http://www.thunderbolts.info/tpod/2005/ ... ingods.htm

The accompanying description is lacking a bit however, on several features.