Recovered: Iron Sun Theories

[bboyer]

Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:30 am Post subject: Reply with quote
OP "upriver"

The question that graduate student Hai Fu and astronomer Alan Stockton tried to answer is, "Where is the gas coming from?"

To answer the question, Fu and Stockton used a telescope-mounted spectroscope to find out what the gas is made of. "We found that the gas that is spiraling into the black hole is almost pure hydrogen and helium, whereas the stars and other material in the surrounding giant galaxy are heavily contaminated by other elements such as carbon and oxygen," said Fu.

This difference implies that the infalling gas has recently come from outside the galaxy, most likely from another galaxy that is merging with the giant one. Fu and Stockton also see a chaotic distribution of fast-moving patches of relatively pure hydrogen and helium scattered around the quasar, implying that black holes not only swallow things, but can also expel a large portion of their meal out to thousands of light-years away, likely through an energetic blast that happened millions of years ago.

http://www.spaceflightnow.com/news/n0709/04blackholes/
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[bboyer]

Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 10:30 pm Post subject: Reply with quote
OP "upriver"

This ought to interest Arp proponents. An iron rich "young" quasar.

Meaning a high redshift iron rich quasar.

Iron stars are ejected from a variety of objects?
Galaxies eject iron quasars.
Pulsars ejects G size stars.
Supernova eject giant stars.

The HR diagram reflects that trend as there is a smaller population of giant and supergiant stars.

The most distant object ever to be studied confirms that the Universe's expansion is accelerating. But its iron-rich nature poses new questions for astronomers.

The object, more than 13.5 billion light years from Earth, was observed using the European Space Agency's XMM-Newton Spacecraft. The previous record was held by Hubble Space Telescope astronomers.

The HST team imaged a galaxy 13.0 billion light years away while another galaxy was moving in front of it, like a gravitational magnifying glass. The new object - a young quasar called APM 08279+5255 - was also seen through a gravitational lens.

ESA astronomers have caught glimpses of even more distant objects, but could not gather enough light to study them properly. But X-rays collected from the new quasar show it contains a huge proportion of iron, more than three times that of our solar system.

This means it must be at least 1.5 billion years old, in order for enough time to have passed for several generations of iron-spewing supernovae explosions to pollute the area.
Surprise result

"We were not even planning to look for iron when we found such a surprising result," says Norbert Schartel of the Max Planck Institute for Extraterrestrial Physics in Garching, Germany.

Adding the minimum age of the quasar to the time its X-rays took to reach us - given by their redshift - gives the age of the universe as at least 15 billion years old.

Contrary to recent reports, this is not older than most astronomers already believe, says Schartel's colleague Stefanie Komossa, in work published on Wednesday.
Heavy metal

Instead, the calculation provides independent confirmation that the Universe is expanding ever faster - something already suggested by the apparent dimness of distant supernovae. If the Universe's expansion was not accelerating, it would have taken only 10 billion years to reach its present size. But why the quasar contains so much more iron than our Sun remains a mystery. Iron is the most stable element, meaning that although it is easily made in supernova explosions, it is almost impossible to destroy.

So on average, astronomers expect to see less iron when they look at similar, younger objects in the early Universe. "We now hope to look at several distant quasars," says Schartel.
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn2562.html

Here is another link.
Mysterious iron factory in the Early Universe
http://www.mpe-garching.mpg.de/Highligh ... 20708.html
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[bboyer]

Thread recovered.

- 30 -

[MGmirkin]

This could probably be merged with the regular Iron Sun thread... Yeah? Just a thought...

~Michael Gmirkin

[bboyer]

This could probably be merged with the regular Iron Sun thread... Yeah? Just a thought...

~Michael Gmirkin

That's true. Consider it done.

[Lloyd]

- I think this thread was one of our best discussions on this forum. I started a debate on the subject at http://linc.lefora.com/2008/07/11/iron-sun.
- Anyone can go there and post without registering or signing in first, if you don't want to.
- I'm starting the debates informally, but I hope to get some experts with differing views to debate semi-formally as soon as they may be ready at a pre-arranged time & date.
- So, if anyone can contact the experts, please try to persuade them to arrange either a formal or informal debate. Okay?
- Oliver Manuel would be the main one to contact, and David Russell. Brant and Michael Mozina also seem to be experts. Does anyone know who else may be?

[Xuxalina Rihhia]

Would quasars be balls of solid iron like planets, the sun and the stars are?

Anyway, I am convinced that the sun has a solid iron/iron-calcium surface and is powered by external electricity

[upriver]

July 11, 2011: On June 7, 2011, Earth-orbiting satellites detected a flash of X-rays coming from the western edge of the solar disk. Registering only "M" (for medium) on the Richter scale of solar flares, the blast at first appeared to be a run-of-the-mill eruption--that is, until researchers looked at the movies.

"We'd never seen anything like it," says Alex Young, a solar physicist at the Goddard Space Flight Center. "Half of the sun appeared to be blowing itself to bits."

NASA has just released new high-resolution videos of the event recorded by the Solar Dynamics Observatory (SDO). The videos are large, typically 50 MB to 100 MB, but worth the wait to download. Click on the arrow to launch the first movie, then scroll down for commentary:
Dark Fireworks (splash, 558px)
A close-up of the June 7th eruption shows dark blobs of plasma falling ballistically toward the surface of the sun. [99 MB Quicktime] [more]

"IN terms of raw power, this really was just a medium-sized eruption," says Young, "but it had a uniquely dramatic appearance caused by all the inky-dark material. We don't usually see that."

Solar physicist Angelos Vourlidas of the Naval Research Lab in Washington DC calls it a case of "dark fireworks."

"The blast was triggered by an unstable magnetic filament near the sun's surface," he explains. "That filament was loaded down with cool1 plasma, which exploded in a spray of dark blobs and streamers."
Dark Fireworks (guided, 200px)
Plasma blobs are funneled toward sunspots by magnetic fields. [67 MB Quicktime] [more]

The plasma blobs were as big as planets, many larger than Earth. They rose and fell ballistically, moving under the influence of the sun's gravity like balls tossed in the air, exploding "like bombs" when they hit the stellar surface.

Some blobs, however, were more like guided missiles. "In the movies we can see material 'grabbed' by magnetic fields and funneled toward sunspot groups hundreds of thousands of kilometers away," notes Young.

SDO also detected a shadowy shock wave issuing from the blast site. The 'solar tsunami' propagated more than halfway across the sun, visibly shaking filaments and loops of magnetism en route. [91 MB Quicktime]

Long-range action has become a key theme of solar physics since SDO was launched in 2010. The observatory frequently sees explosions in one part of the sun affecting other parts. Sometimes one explosion will trigger another ... and another ... with a domino sequence of flares going off all around the star.

"The June 7th blast didn't seem to trigger any big secondary explosions, but it was certainly felt far and wide," says Young.
Dark Fireworks (circular wave, 558px)
This 13 MB extreme ultraviolet movie of the explosion shows a 'solar tsunami' wave billowing away from the blast site. [13 MB Quicktime] [more]

It's tempting to look at the movies and conclude that most of the exploded material fell back--but that wouldn't be true, according to Vourlidas. "The blast also propelled a significant coronal mass ejection (CME) out of the sun's atmosphere."

He estimates that the cloud massed about 4.5 x1015 grams, placing it in the top 5% of all CMEs recorded in the Space Age. For comparison, the most massive CME ever recorded was 1016 grams, only a factor of ~2 greater than the June 7th cloud.2 The amount of material that fell back to the sun on June 7th was approximately equal to the amount that flew away, Vourlidas says.

As remarkable as the June 7th eruption seems to be, Young says it might not be so rare. "In fact," he says, "it might be downright common."

Before SDO, space-based observatories observed the sun with relatively slow cadences and/or limited fields of view. They could have easily missed the majesty of such an explosion, catching only a single off-center snapshot at the beginning or end of the blast to hint at what actually happened.

If Young is right, more dark fireworks could be in the offing. Stay tuned.


Author: Dr. Tony Phillips | Credit: Science@NASA
More Information

Footnotes:

1"Cool" has a special meaning on the sun: The plasma blobs registered a temperature of 20,000 K or less. That is relatively cool. Most of the surrounding gas had temperatures between 40,000 K and 1,000,000 K.

2Containing some 1015 grams of matter, coronal mass ejections aren't as massive as they sound. It would take a hundred of the June 7th CMEs to make a decent-sized comet; e.g., the nucleus of Halley's Comet masses about 2 x 1017 gm. "Remember that this is just a magnetized cloud of gas leaving from the quite tenuous corona," notes Vourlidas. "The cloud is big, but really not very massive compared to things like comets, moons, and planets."

http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/sc ... fireworks/