
A neanderthal in the woodpile?



sorry, nick...

Sparky wrote:Sorry to hear that Pye has died....![]()
Why Neanderthals went extinct...![]()
Notice the satisfied grin.
viscount aero wrote:This is my favorite Pye lecture on human origins, before he became singularly obsessed with the "star child":
Lloyd Pye Everything You Know Is Wrong:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdG6-6_vxEU
tholden wrote:viscount aero wrote:This is my favorite Pye lecture on human origins, before he became singularly obsessed with the "star child":
Lloyd Pye Everything You Know Is Wrong:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdG6-6_vxEU
The idea is to watch that thing up to the point where he starts talking about "Annunaki(TM)", and then turn it off.
He came to the same conclusion which Troy, I, and others have come to in that humans could not plausibly have arisen on this planet, but then he goes off on the normal scify assumption that humans must have come from some other star system. Troy and I rule that out given the immense difficulty of physically crossing stellar distances, particularly since it can be demonstrated that a near perfect human origin world (Ganymede) existed within our own system a few tens of thousands of years ago. Occam's principle demands that the simpler solution be preferred.
viscount aero wrote:
The problem with the purple dawn Ganymede scenario is that the only mechanism implied for transport is panspermia upon a "Birkeland current."
tholden wrote:viscount aero wrote:
The problem with the purple dawn Ganymede scenario is that the only mechanism implied for transport is panspermia upon a "Birkeland current."
That isn't really right. Troy and I deliberately leave that question a bit up in the air since we weren't really there and don't really own a time machine. There are several possibilities which we could mention and we do mention one (splash saltation) which isn't really that implausible. The book mentions Dwardu Cardona's claim that the gigantic muck deposits in Alaska and Siberia arose as the polar Birkeland current came unmoored and sucked material up and that material was subsequently splashed randomly as the Birkeland current fizzled out; the idea of animals transferring from one body to another via such a current isn't totally insane.
The problem is that an author starts to look like a whack-job when he talks about anything like that and nobody should ever mention any more than one such possibility in a book. Again there are several other possibilities as for a means of transfer but Troy and I see that as less than a major problem. What we have demonstrated is that humans could not plausibly have arisen on this world, that humans would need a number of things from an original home world, and that Ganymede would have provided all such things.
viscount aero wrote:tholden wrote:viscount aero wrote:
Well splash saltation is the panspermia/Birkeland current I'm referencing per the interview with the Collisions authors. They said it not me.
But we both agree more than we disagree actually. I tend to believe we are an engineered species. But we were engineered for Earth, not Ganymede.
Sparky wrote:Occam says, "God Did It."....
Sparky wrote:Occam says, "God Did It."....
tholden wrote:viscount aero wrote:tholden wrote:viscount aero wrote:
Well splash saltation is the panspermia/Birkeland current I'm referencing per the interview with the Collisions authors. They said it not me.
But we both agree more than we disagree actually. I tend to believe we are an engineered species. But we were engineered for Earth, not Ganymede.
There's another cute little piece of the picture which you might not have noticed, particularly if all you've seen/read about the Ganymede thesis is that Red-Ice interview or the first half of it which is on Youtube.
There were two major saltations of humans on this planet and the two saltations were some thousands and probably a few tens of thousands of years apart. For reasons outlined in the book, there is no way to believe that the people of Genesis were descended from Cro Magnons, the cultural and technological differences were too great. The explanation which the book offers is that the Uranus/Saturn/Neptune/Mars/Earth system, prior to being captured outright, had approached the Sun/Jupiter/Mercury system on a spiral course and there had been at least one near pass of the two systems on this spiral approach before the final near pass which resulted in capture.
That is, there was a near approach at which time the transfer of Cro Magnon people took place; then the Southern system (us) swung back out into deep space again; and then some thousands or tens of thousands of years later, the next near pass occurred resulting in the people of Genesis coming here. The multi-thousand year gap between the two events explains the gulf in cultures and technology between the two groups.
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