Electric Clouds

Historic planetary instability and catastrophe. Evidence for electrical scarring on planets and moons. Electrical events in today's solar system. Electric Earth.

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flippinrocks
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by flippinrocks » Tue Nov 22, 2011 7:57 am

meteor caught on video,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nf45GuIw ... re=related

looks like it gathered quite the charge (blue/white) until the discharge happened in the same fashion as space shuttle columbia? Wherein the ionized 'trail' becomes the conduit between charge layers in the atmosphere.

Obviously there is a difference in approach and last I heard, meteors don't carry fuel. But I can still (in my mind) see a scaled resemblence based on approach. Going straight to the cloud layer, wonder how much didn't get vaporized.

Also, after looking at the cloud classification system, It looks like we've manage to identify different charge qualites of the sky associated with the production of a certain type of cloud.

I need to read most of this thread, and I shall...

call me crazy...but it seems hurricanes are giant charge 'vacuums' because there is so much water, 2 barren strips of land above the equator, a moon, a star and magnetic fields.

food for thought; are clouds a 'milky substance'
http://www.youtube.com/user/Lidmotor#p/ ... WFodIFFOOU
wow, look how bright that star is!

seasmith
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by seasmith » Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:54 am

PBL
[Planet Boundary Layer]

Image
Cloud Streets

http://www.flickr.com/photos/gsfc/63784 ... otostream/

seasmith
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by seasmith » Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:54 pm

CharlesChandler » Sun Nov 20, 2011 5:39 pm

Hey Mike,

mharratsc wrote:
...wherein photons striking one surface of the water will cause polarization and charge separation.

I can understand polarization within a particle due to mechanisms such as Dr. Pollack describes, but I don't understand how this is going to result in a charge separation between particles.

One existing theory is that photons (especially high-energy cosmic rays) knock electrons loose. Such free electrons might then fall back into the same molecule, resulting in no charge separation, or they might hit a larger particle in the vicinity, in which case they might get lost in the electron cloud of the larger particle, and a charge separation between the two particles will have occurred. This would account for heavier particles that fall (eventually to the ground) having a net negative charge (because their electron clouds could absorb a few extra electrons), and smaller particles lingering in the anvil of the storm having a net positive charge.
Charles,

~ so here’s a KISS scenario:
Weather forms mainly in the troposphere, the dielectric layer between the ionospheric stratosphere (‘ozone layer’) and the PBL (Planetary Boundary Layer). Primary polarizations occurs on the nucleon level, driven largely by photonic radiations (homogenous nucleation from the gas phase) and ion induced nucleation (from sea salt sulfates, ozones, aerosols, etc and even biological sources). That polarization of flux is further projected through space by growing droplets, formed on the ions with condensing water vapor and adiabatic cooling.
[At that stage, I believe the ‘drops’ qualify as Dr.Pollack’s “tensile bodies”. ]
As the above cloud formation progresses, the cloud mass itself likely becomes an realm of influence by larger EM/ES forces.
[see “Water’s response to ultralow magnetic fields comes as a surprise”]
http://www.physicstoday.org/daily_editi ... a_surprise
Located as it is between the capacitor ‘plates’ of ionosphere/stratosphere and PBL, with their differing potentials, Charge Separation is the natural response.
At the scale of weather, flow of charge take forms from EM flux dynamics to thermal gradients. The tropospheric cloud-mass so organized as electric capacitor can now discharge sparks of lightning ( which has its own threads ).

In other words it may be said that all starts out with nucleation processes~
and scales up as global rebalancing of local ground potentials; with energetic SS influx, imo.

note: the ionospheric side could be its own system of shells, but I think the net effect to PBL would be the same potential

S

seasmith
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by seasmith » Sat Nov 26, 2011 10:38 am

:ugeek:
Upon review, the previous post may have appeared a trifle terse.
Should have explained that the last S in KISS stands for Smith...


" Who knows what mysteries are hidden within the nucleus of an atom, which, although a million million times smaller than the smallest living thing, is yet a universe in itself? "

Louis de Broglie, “Matter and Light – the New Physics”, W.W. Norton, 1939, p. 10

mharratsc
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by mharratsc » Mon Nov 28, 2011 7:44 am

That right there is a most logical and plausible explanation, bud. Now that we have an idea how the capacitance originates, and possibly where the charge features are, is there any way we can put the hypothesis to the test with some data?

I swear, it really feels like we're on the verge of discovery, at least in the meteorological and geological realms. If only we could say the same for astronomy and astrophysics, sigh... :\
Mike H.

"I have no fear to shout out my ignorance and let the Wise correct me, for every instance of such narrows the gulf between them and me." -- Michael A. Harrington

seasmith
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by seasmith » Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:19 pm

Image
GROUND CURRENTS IN NORWAY:
A solar wind stream is buffeting Earth's magnetic field and this is causing electrical currents to flow in the earth itself at high latitudes. Rob Stammes sends this report from the Polarlightcenter in Lofoten, Norway: "Today, a magnetic disturbance began around 12.00 UTC. The [shaking of Earth's magnetic field] induced a ground current around our observatory: data. This is a good sign that we will see Northern Lights tonight."
Shunting past the atmospheric capacitor plates,
though the poles
:?:

Dotini
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by Dotini » Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:44 pm

Interesting. Here is some of the ground current and magnetometer data associated with the event.: http://spaceweather.com/submissions/lar ... 668463.jpg

The spaceweather.com archive of Nov 30, 2011 suggested that this is a case of magnetosphere to lithosphere coupling. In the past, NASA has hinted that these "spacequakes" could be related to earthquakes.

Respectfully submitted,
Steve

Osmosis
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by Osmosis » Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:18 pm

I wonder if this event was seen at the Jasper Ridge magnetometer station, above Stanford University? :?: :?:

seasmith
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by seasmith » Fri Dec 02, 2011 9:08 am

capacitor leakage not just at the poles

"Lightning-made Waves in Earth's Atmosphere Leak Into Space

http://www.nasa.gov/images/content/6063 ... ce-670.jpg
At any given moment about 2,000 thunderstorms roll over Earth, producing some 50 flashes of lightning every second. Each lightning burst creates electromagnetic waves that begin to circle around Earth captured between Earth's surface and a boundary about 60 miles up. Some of the waves – if they have just the right wavelength – combine, increasing in strength, to create a repeating atmospheric heartbeat known as Schumann resonance.
The waves created by lightning do not look like the up and down waves of the ocean, but they still oscillate with regions of greater energy and lesser energy. These waves remain trapped inside an atmospheric ceiling created by the lower edge of the "ionosphere" – a part of the atmosphere filled with charged particles, which begins about 60 miles up into the sky. In this case, the sweet spot for resonance requires the wave to be as long (or twice, three times as long, etc) as the circumference of Earth.
predicted in 1952, Schumann resonances were first measured reliably in the early 1960s. Since then, scientists have discovered that variations in the resonances correspond to changes in the seasons, solar activity, activity in Earth's magnetic environment, in water aerosols in the atmosphere, and other Earth-bound phenomena.
http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/sunea ... waves.html

mharratsc
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by mharratsc » Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:31 am

So much supporting data, yet they can't see the forest for the trees... :roll:
Mike H.

"I have no fear to shout out my ignorance and let the Wise correct me, for every instance of such narrows the gulf between them and me." -- Michael A. Harrington

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webolife
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by webolife » Mon Dec 05, 2011 6:05 pm

Yet, the aurora seems to be illuminating the forest and trees quite well ;)
Truth extends beyond the border of self-limiting science. Free discourse among opposing viewpoints draws the open-minded away from the darkness of inevitable bias and nearer to the light of universal reality.

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CharlesChandler
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Jumping Sundogs Over Thunderclouds

Unread post by CharlesChandler » Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:27 am

Corona wrote:This video is really mind blowing... recorded in August this year it shows what seems to be ice crystals changing to electric fields just above a thundercloud...
Here's Bill Beaty's page on the topic:
http://amasci.com/amateur/sundog.html
Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and he'll spend the rest of the day sitting in a small boat, drinking beer and telling dirty jokes.

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The Electromagnetic Nature of Tornadic Supercell Thunderstorms

mharratsc
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by mharratsc » Sun Dec 11, 2011 11:57 am

Basically, the visible effect of daytime ELVE's...? o.O
Mike H.

"I have no fear to shout out my ignorance and let the Wise correct me, for every instance of such narrows the gulf between them and me." -- Michael A. Harrington

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webolife
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by webolife » Sun Dec 11, 2011 8:41 pm

Elves, as I understand them, are electrical discharge stimulations of nitrogen and oxygen/ozone in[to] the upper troposphere and stratosphere above thunderclouds, whereas crown flashes are the electrical discharge realignment of electrically polar ice crytals at cloud tops. An interesting crossover of electrical discharge effects. And You-tube makes these otherwise hitherto unknown phenomena commonplace meteorology!! Pretty soon everyone will be saying "Electric universe? why not?"
Truth extends beyond the border of self-limiting science. Free discourse among opposing viewpoints draws the open-minded away from the darkness of inevitable bias and nearer to the light of universal reality.

mharratsc
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Re: Electric Clouds

Unread post by mharratsc » Mon Dec 12, 2011 7:23 am

So frosty ELVE's... Ho Ho Ho! :lol:
Mike H.

"I have no fear to shout out my ignorance and let the Wise correct me, for every instance of such narrows the gulf between them and me." -- Michael A. Harrington

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