Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby Steve Smith » Tue Feb 03, 2009 5:20 pm

My Imac didn't even blink.
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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby Wormwood » Sun Feb 08, 2009 7:39 pm

If I may interject a piece of no longer substantiated information that could have some bearing on the transmutation of elements: During the gas crisis of the 1970s, I read a newspaper article (that's why the information is no longer substantiated: I can't recall the author of the article or the newspaper that carried it) in which it was stated that researchers had no idea why blowing hydrogen across a field of platinum filings produced electricity. Now, I'm not too gifted in science, despite studies in zoology and geology, but it seems to me that information on such an unexpected result would raise some eyebrows and lead to further research on the phenomenon. While it has already been established that hydrogen exists in a nominal supply in the Earth's crust, platinum is considered to be scarce. While the initial article made me wonder whether high compression of hydrogen within the Earth could create platinum, I'm now left wondering if the hydrogen - platinum combination could produce sufficient electrical charge within the Earth to create some of the "underground lightning" effects mentioned in earlier posts. I'm now wondering, also, if, in addition to photosynthetic processes, electrical charges created within the Earth aid and abet the transmutations Kervran appears to have proven do occur. This also leads me to wonder if photosynthesis, a process we all know is set in motion by sunlight, has an electrical element to it, particularly since the Sun and its emanations are considered in the EU framework to be electrical in nature.

I hope I haven't taken this thread off course, and if I have, I apologize.
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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby Lloyd » Fri Apr 24, 2009 1:17 pm

* Hey folks, I hope anyone interested in transmutation and the subatomic model of atoms and molecules may like to read Allyn's latest post on another thread here:
http://thunderbolts.info/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=123&p=20145#p20103
* I think it may provide very helpful insights for developing further understanding of subatomic structure etc.
* I'd like to see what David's APM might have to add to it, or vice versa. Junglelord, do you have anything to say on that? And do you know if Dave is interested discussing on this forum any more?
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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby Lloyd » Sat May 09, 2009 2:45 pm

* I posted info in these 2 posts early last year about how neutrinos and biological cyclotrons [particle accelerators inside plants] are used for biological transmutation:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=209&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=15#p2299
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=209&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=15#p2300
* Today I found more info about neutrinos for transmutation at this site
http://www.life-enthusiast.net/ormus/or ... ansmut.htm , which says:
- All transmutations proposed by Kervran have two traits in common: (1) The initial and final nuclei differ by the addition or subtraction of a piece of matter, e.g., a proton (a hydrogen nucleus...), an alpha particle (a helium nucleus), a nucleus of oxygen or one of its isotopes, or perhaps some other familiar nuclei; (2) There is an energy excess or deficit in the order of 0.01 atomic mass units (a.m.u.)... or 20 electron masses, or 10 MeV, or 1.6 x 10^-12 joules. The mass equivalent of this energy gap is of course needed in order to have the Lavoisier principle safe...
- [In energetic terms, such flux would be equal to 10^15 MeV/cm2/second, or 160 watts/cm2.] Can we then imagine some sort of quasi-occult form into which the 'Kervran power gap" may be radiated (or ... absorbed ...)? No reasonable answer was available until... a bold theoretical assumption, due to Weinberg in 1967, turned out as experimentally true. Due to this "neutral current hypothesis" we are llowed to write such nuclear reactions as:
... p + v « p' + v'; or: p + -v « p' + -v'; or: p « p' + v + -v
where p denotes a proton, v a neutrino, and -v the anti-neutrino. We even have two sorts of neutrinos to play with: the electronic and the muonic one.
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Deuteron Theory of Cold Fusion

Unread postby Lloyd » Mon Oct 05, 2009 5:25 pm

Deuteron Theory of Cold Fusion Proposed in Rome
* Note: a deuteron is the nucleus of a deuterium atom, which is a proton and a neutron, an isotope of hydrogen. The common nucleus of hydrogen is just a proton. Heavy water contains deuterium atoms, instead of hydrogen.
http://larouchepac.com/node/11997
October 5, 2009 (LPAC)--A new theory of cold fusion is being proposed at an international conference currently underway in Rome, according to an advance report from radiochemist and materials expert Dr. Edmund Storms.

Dr. Storms believes that clusters of deuterons (the nuclei of the naturally occurring isotope of hydrogen) are able to penetrate the nucleus of palladium, transmuting it into a heavier element and releasing energy in the form of heat. The deuteron clusters, perhaps similar to Rydberg clusters, are charge-free configurations that are not repelled by the positive charge of the palladium nucleus. According to Storms' research, the reaction occurs not within the palladium crystal lattice, but in nano-particles of palladium mixed with other elements that form at the surface of the palladium cathode.

There is no unstable intermediate nucleus, and thus no radioactivity, released in the reaction. The absorption of deuterons produces an element of higher atomic number and mass, each deuteron releasing about 12 MeV of energy due to the mass defect.

According to Storms, who has been pursuing cold fusion since his retirement from Los Alamos National Laboratory in the early 1990s, his theory can explain all the known phenomena reported in cold fusion experiments to date. He believes it may also be the explanation for nuclear transmutation in biological systems first documented by Louis Kevran and subsequently pursued by researchers in Japan and Russia. Recently the Japanese have detected biological transmutation using nuclear magnetic resonance (NMR) techniques that are more reliable than chemical analysis, Storms says. Russian researchers have shown transmutation by bacteria capable of reproducing in 100% heavy water (deuterium in place of the hydrogen).

Storms's idea also has implications for the theory of nucleosynthesis. According to prevailing theory, the heavy elements must be produced in a neutron star, such as is hypothesized to be associated with a supernova. However, a process of cold fusion by incorporation of deuteron clusters could account for the production of heavier elements from lighter ones, without the need for highly energetic systems which would likely be detrimental to life. Such a process might even be occurring within the Earth's crust.


* Note that the last paragraph suggests that heavy elements can be created on planets without the need for neutron stars. Also, whether electrical transmutation necessarily requires mediation by deuterons doesn't seem to be considered at all, since that would not involve "cold" fusion, but "hot".
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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby allynh » Tue Oct 06, 2009 10:07 am

That's neat.

Look at the isotope list of palladium and remember that there is no such thing as "pure" palladium there is always a mix of isotopes within the metal making "cold fusion" hard to replicate.

As LLoyd mentioned in his April 24 2009 post above, look at the discussion on transmutation to help make things clear. You can see how the proton and neutron in deuterium are constantly swapping places.

Think of the paladium in the electrodes as a complex mix of different isotopes each nested within their shared electron shells. Those isotopes are in a constant dance as their own nuclei are busy swapping protons with neutrons within nested shells. Then along comes a deuterium atom that is constantly swapping its neutron and proton, and its no wonder that it can slip in changing the isotopes.

I wish that there was some way to image what goes on in the palladium electrodes, so we could see what was happening. The process we have now is simply too crude to show us what is happening right before our eyes.

Where is my Star Trek style tricorder when I need it.
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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby Lloyd » Tue Oct 06, 2009 2:05 pm

* Allyn, your idea of neutrons and protons transforming into each other is interesting, but that would mean that normal hydrogen turns into a neutron and back into hydrogen several times every hour, wouldn't it? And, if so, wouldn't that be detectable, such as by a magnetic field? What evidence is there for your theory?
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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby allynh » Wed Oct 07, 2009 11:40 am

Lloyd, you need to remember the conversation in the earlier thread you mentioned above where we discussed transmutation.

The neutron decays in about 15 minutes, the proton is stable, so a single hydrogen atom--which is just a proton--would be stable. The article you posted discusses deuterium which is a proton and neutron. The neutron decays in 15 minutes becoming a proton and emitting an electron and neutrino, they are absorbed by the existing proton changing it into a neutron.

Thus the proton and neutron in the deuterium atom swap places every 15 minutes.

It's all in the dance.

As an aside:

Deuterium is stable, i.e., not radioactive, because there is a balance between the proton and the neutron swapping places. Tritium, which is a proton and two neutrons, is radioactive because now and then both neutrons try to swap places with the single proton, thus becoming Helium-3, which is two protons and a neutron. Helium-3 is stable because the single neutron can decay changing either of the protons.
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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby Lloyd » Thu Oct 08, 2009 9:12 am

* Allyn, I didn't remember in your original posts that you regarded protons as stable. In that case, I can understand how your model would work. I don't care for anthropomorphisms, giving inanimate things human attributes. Can you call the neutron and proton transformations something besides a dance? How about a cycle?
* Did you mention a "mechanism" that causes the electron from the neutron to move to an adjacent proton, instead of escaping the nucleus? Do you think there's an electric or magnetic field that prevents its escape?
* Is there a diagram or a video clip that would depict the model well, that would explain all atomic isotope behaviors?
* Here's a symbolic representation of a deuteron's cycle in 5 stages or frames.
1. pe * p, 2. p>e * p, 3. p * ep, 4. p * e<p, 5. pe * p
p = proton, e = electron, pe = ep = neutron
* So a proton can only hold on to an electron and act as a neutron for about 15 minutes. Then, if there's a proton adjacent to it, the electron is forced by a field to move to that proton. And so on.
* This implies that the electron captured by a proton goes through some kind of typical motion for about 15 minutes before the motion takes it away from the proton. Would that motion be an orbital motion around the proton? If so, what kind of orbital motion?
* Let's see if I can do tritium too.
1. pe * p * ep, 2. p>e * p * e<p, 3. p * ep * ^e * p, 4. p * ep * p
At 3, the left neutron becomes a proton, the central proton becomes a neutron, and the right neutron is too late for its electron to hit the central proton, so the electron escapes from the nucleus, leaving [at stage 4] two protons and one neutron, which is helium-3.
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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby allynh » Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:34 am

Lloyd, go ahead and read through the thread where we talked about transmutation, everything you are asking is discussed there. I can't duplicate it all in this thread, the posts were quite long.

Re: Mummified Dinosaurs / electric fossilization...?
http://thunderbolts.info/forum/phpBB3/v ... 145#p20103

Everything that happens is about elementary particles trading places and interacting with each other. The atom is far more fluid than the simple models we were taught in school. It is dancing M&Ms all the way down.
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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby flyingcloud » Tue Oct 20, 2009 12:03 pm

Geologists Point To Outer Space As Source Of The Earth's Mineral Riches

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 141608.htm

ScienceDaily (Oct. 19, 2009) — According to a new study by geologists at the University of Toronto and the University of Maryland, the wealth of some minerals that lie in the rock beneath the Earth's surface may be extraterrestrial in origin.


"The extreme temperature at which the Earth's core formed more than four billion years ago would have completely stripped any precious metals from the rocky crust and deposited them in the core," says James Brenan of the Department of Geology at the University of Toronto and co-author of the study published in Nature Geoscience on October 18.

"So, the next question is why are there detectable, even mineable, concentrations of precious metals such as platinum and rhodium in the rock portion of the Earth today? Our results indicate that they could not have ended up there by any known internal process, and instead must have been added back, likely by a 'rain' of extraterrestrial debris, such as comets and meteorites."

Geologists have long speculated that four and a half billion years ago, the Earth was a cold mass of rock mixed with iron metal which was melted by the heat generated from the impact of massive planet-sized objects, allowing the iron to separate from the rock and form the Earth's core. Brenan and colleague William McDonough of the University of Maryland recreated the extreme pressure and temperature of this process, subjecting a similar mixture to temperatures above 2,000 degrees Celsius, and measured the composition of the resulting rock and iron.

Because the rock became void of the metal in the process, the scientists speculate that the same would have occurred when the Earth was formed, and that some sort of external source – such as a rain of extraterrestrial material – contributed to the presence of some precious metals in Earth's outer rocky portion today.

"The notion of extraterrestrial rain my also explain another mystery, which is how the rock portion of the Earth came to have hydrogen, carbon and phosphorous – the essential components for life, which were likely lost during Earth's violent beginning."

The research was funded with the support of the Natural Sciences and Engineering Research Council of Canada and a NASA Cosmochemistry grant.
***
got the origination correct, but not the source or the method.

complete electrical transmutation still an elusive concept
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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby allynh » Tue Oct 20, 2009 2:33 pm

Awesome. The very fact that they can see the problem, that the ore bodies are literally there, yet all their theories don't explain the real world.

I love it.
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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby allynh » Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:02 am

I've added a post to pop this thread to the top. It goes along with the discussion in the Antartica thread.
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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby Lloyd » Fri Sep 10, 2010 6:07 pm

... a rain of extraterrestrial material – contributed to the presence of some precious metals in Earth's outer rocky portion today.

* I think it's more likely that electric currents within the Earth produced these precious metals, not a rain of material from above.
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Re: Recovered: Transmutation on Stars, Planets etc

Unread postby Lloyd » Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:18 pm

* Having learned more about Cardona's Saturn Theory since my previous post here, I'm more inclined now to agree that precious metals etc probably did rain down on Earth, in this case from Saturn, periodically.
Kanarev on Cold Fusion
* See http://guns.connect.fi/innoplaza/energy/story/Kanarev/coldfusion.
* Kanarev has developed excellent explanations of atomic structures, which help to explain transmutation processes. Here's just a short quote from the webpage.
As iron is the cathode material, the nuclei of its atoms are the targets of the atomic nuclei of potassium, alkaline metal. During the transmutation of the iron nuclei (Fig. 2, b), the atomic nuclei of chromium (Fig. 2 a) and the atomic nuclei of copper (Fig. 2, c) are formed [6].
http://guns.connect.fi/innoplaza/energy/story/Kanarev/coldfusion/index_tiedostot/image040.gif
Image
(Black and gray balls are Neutrons; White balls are Protons.)
a) Cr (24,28) ----------------- b) Fe (26,28) ----------------- c) Cu (29,34)
Fig. 2. Diagrams of the atomic nuclei of: a) chromium, b) iron, c) copper
- When the atomic nucleus of iron (Fig. 2, b) pass into the atomic nucleus of chromium (Fig. 2, a), two protons and two neutrons are released; two atoms of deuterium or one atom of helium can be formed from them. If the neutrons pass into the protons, four atoms of hydrogen are formed.
- It is easy to see (Fig. 2) that the atomic nucleus of iron (Fig. 2, b) should lose two upper protons and two neutrons in order to pass into the atomic nucleus of chromium (Fig. 2, a).
- Three additional protons and six neutrons (total 9 nucleons) are required for the formation of the atomic nucleus of copper (Fig. 2, c) from the atomic nucleus of iron. As there are chromium atoms, which, as we think, are formed from the atomic nuclei of iron, on the cathode surface (Table 3) 4fold than the atoms of copper, the solution is sure to have superfluous protons and neutrons of the destroyed atomic nuclei of iron, and we can determined their approximate relative quantity.
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