Help a poor bloke understand expansion....

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Help a poor bloke understand expansion....

Unread postby Michael Mozina » Fri Oct 13, 2017 11:22 am

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/fo ... p?t=323726

HansMustermann: Here's where I go off my meds though: doesn't it mean that you could look at Hubble's law as a function of TIME and red-shift instead of SPACE and red-shift?


The short (and the correct) answer to his question is: "Yes, photon redhsift could easily be a function of object movement and *time dilation*, rather than "space expansion".

https://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0601171

What I found to be most interesting about that specific ISF thread is the fact that they won't acknowledge that his question/idea is perfectly valid. Instead they keep trying to falsely assert that redshift cannot be a function of time dilation, when it fact that could certainly be the case.

It's amazing just how close minded the mainstream really is to *anything* which deviates from their invisible space expansion sky mythology. How very sad that they insist on misleading people who ask valid and important questions. Their answers are simply ignorant. The guy is absolutely correct and it's a very valid question.
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Re: Help a poor bloke understand expansion....

Unread postby Zyxzevn » Sat Oct 14, 2017 7:50 am

Michael Mozina wrote:.. the fact that they won't acknowledge that his question/idea is perfectly valid.
...


Reflects my experience with "sceptics" in all areas.

I believe that it is actually a severe cognitive problem that these people have:
the inability to see things in a different way.
With some psychology, you can see how inner fear and old traumas
are connected with their cognitive dissonance and severe bias.
I think that they need psychological help to overcome their fears.
But sadly our society does not yet recognize these people as cognitive disabled.
More ** from zyxzevn at: Paradigm change and C@
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Re: Help a poor bloke understand expansion....

Unread postby Webbman » Sat Oct 14, 2017 8:52 am

it will be YOU that is recognized as cognitive disabled for not going along with it.

Devils modus operandi is to attack the mental state of its victims.

besides what difference does it make what kind of bullshit you use to justify more bullshit.
The secret to the universe is a rubber band.
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Re: Help a poor bloke understand expansion....

Unread postby Michael Mozina » Sat Oct 14, 2017 11:38 am

Webbman wrote:it will be YOU that is recognized as cognitive disabled for not going along with it.

Devils modus operandi is to attack the mental state of its victims.

besides what difference does it make what kind of bullshit you use to justify more bullshit.


Ya, never mind the fact that they can't name a single source of dark energy, or that "space expansion" has never been shown to have any tangible effect on a photon. Just ignore the fact that their dark matter claims have been the single biggest money pit in the history of physics, and all their "predictions" in the lab have been falsified over and over again. Ignore the fact that their now infamous Bullet Cluster study was later falsified a half dozen different ways. It's somehow the fault of the skeptic for not "having faith" in their various metaphysical claims as to cause, and for not bowing down to the holy inflation creation deity. :)

Oh, and forget the fact that Guth never 'predicted' those hemispheric variation that we observe in the CMB, his mythical inflation entity did it anyway. :)

Guthanity is stupidest creation mythology every proposed by anyone. It even makes Scientology look "reasonable".
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Re: Help a poor bloke understand expansion....

Unread postby Michael Mozina » Mon Oct 16, 2017 7:20 pm

I think my favorite post of that ISF thread was this post:

Ziggurat The challenge is that sane people, even when constructing pure fantasy, still instinctively want internal consistency. It's OK if the idea doesn't match reality, but we still want it to fit together with itself. And that can be hard to do. Whereas for the true crackpot, there is no such requirement. Self-contradiction is no obstacle. It's actually quite difficult for ordinary people to get into that frame of mind, even for a joke.


LOL! That's a riot!

As is LCDM is even the *least* bit "internally consistent"? Do they really believe that their absurd claim that the whole universe was once "smaller than a proton" concept is even slightly "internally consistent"? The whole universe should have imploded into one gigantic singularity thingy if they were even the *least* bit "internally consistent". Hell, they even claim that the universe was smaller than a basketball *after* inflation! Holy cow. What a bunch of frigging crackpots. :)

I also hate to break it to them, but the paper I cited earlier is at least as "internally consistent" as anything they have to offer with "expanding space".
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Re: Help a poor bloke understand expansion....

Unread postby Cargo » Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:29 pm

I haven't touched that place since it was called JREF years ago. Nothing knows a black hole like a black hole.

You have to give modern astrophysics a break I suppose. The 1-deminsional super everything big bang and infinite z-dimension black holes, and now a 2-d world of a balloon skin universe. None of which is based on reality.

So here's how I help a bloke understand. Throw that word away, expansion. It's irrelevant and not based on reality. Things move, they always do, and always have. Space as we know it, is just what we see. The Universe, which we don't see well or at all in some places, simple is, and always has been.

Anyone who thinks we know the Age of the Universe, or believes that such an Age is even relevant, is full of crack.
imho
Cheers
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Re: Help a poor bloke understand expansion....

Unread postby Michael Mozina » Tue Oct 17, 2017 11:17 am

Cargo wrote:I haven't touched that place since it was called JREF years ago. Nothing knows a black hole like a black hole.

You have to give modern astrophysics a break I suppose. The 1-deminsional super everything big bang and infinite z-dimension black holes, and now a 2-d world of a balloon skin universe. None of which is based on reality.

So here's how I help a bloke understand. Throw that word away, expansion. It's irrelevant and not based on reality. Things move, they always do, and always have. Space as we know it, is just what we see. The Universe, which we don't see well or at all in some places, simple is, and always has been.

Anyone who thinks we know the Age of the Universe, or believes that such an Age is even relevant, is full of crack.
imho
Cheers


It's utterly amazing to me that the mainstream utterly ignores the fact that in the lab, photons transfer some of their momentum to the medium. Instead, they *assume* that ordinary processes in plasma somehow do *not* apply to magic plasma and magic photons in space. They believe that photons magically weave and dodge their way around every EM field gradient, every temperature gradient and every particle of dust/plasma in space to arrive on Earth in an utterly "pristine" condition, unscathed by traversing billions of light years of plasma.

Talk about irrational fantasies. The moment we toss out their fantasies of 'space expansion' as the 'cause' of redshift, the whole redshift process can be explained via empirical physical processes which we observe in the lab. The universe could be infinite and eternal for all we know. The mainstream simply cannot handle real physics from real labs however, so they simply make up metaphysical mumbo-jumbo and shove it down the throats of unsuspecting gullible "students" (of their supernatural dogma).
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