I Found My Thrill On Potbelly Hill

[StevenJay]

"A temple complex in turkey that predates even the pyramids is rewriting the story of human evolution."

Of course, they're jumpng the gun with their cherished beliefs and assumptions. But then, what else is new?

[Grey Cloud]

Hi StevenJay,
Fairly old news I'm afraid.
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history-a ... c=y&page=1
Dated November 2008.
Still the same speculative drivel as the Newsweek piece though. I also found it very confusing. For example, it states that no evidence of human habitation or occupation has been found (e.g. fire pits) yet at the same time mentions thousands of bone fragments which show evidence of having been butchered and cooked. Virtually every paragraph offers a statement which could be challenged.
Nonetheless, a very interesting find.

[Solar]

I have to agree with Grey on this. The traditional date given for the construction of the Pyramids at Giza has been disputed with evidence of water erosion along the sphinx enclosure for example. This was first noticed by Schwaller de Lubicz during the 1950's. The time frame that such water erosion could've occurred is commensurate with the supposed +11,000 yrs date given for Gobekli Tepe.

The article is par for the course when seeing the confusion produced via the din of "knowledge filters". It is also said that Tihuanaco is or was the oldest city in the world initially dated @ some 17,000 yrs then revised to 11,000 or so as well. All very interesting as the cyclical ages of mankind slowly reveals itself much to the chagrin of Archeology's 'standard model(s).'

On a personal note one of the ancient cities I find most intriguing is Pumapunku and it's massive interlocking stone work!

I don't believe in "aliens" and UFO's etc. These structures speak to the vast cyclical ages of mankind, the rise and fall of civilizations, catastrophic Earth events and "lost knowledge". An incorrect mindset has co-opted our great heritage.

[Grey Cloud]

Hi Solar,
Ah, the History Channel, they put the H in Hyperbole.
With all these ancient sites the problem boils down to reliable dating, or, more exactly, the lack thereof. Meanwhile at one end we have the scholars and academics with their knowledge filters and Cognitive Dissonance, at the other end are the whackos and fruitcakes and stuck in the middle are intelligent, discerning, open-minded people like us

It is hard to tell from the article, but I could not see what evidence they had to associate the builders of Gobekli Tepe and the people who left the bones etc.

I find it strange that these people, whoever they were, could produce exact likenesses of various creatures but, at least according to the 'expert's' theory, produced stylised, abstract human figures.

I would also like to know what evidence they have that the wildlife in the area today is the same as it was way back then.

My guess would be that the place was built by a pre-catastrophe people and that the 'hunter-gatherers' came later, i.e. post-catastrophe. As evidence I would point to South and Central America where virtually everybody originated from somehwere other than where they are today, and, at least in the case of the Inca, make no claim to the building of the cyclopean architecture.

And if anyone can point me at a contemporary hunter-gatherer society which builds anything other than simple housing and maybe pens for their livestock, I would be grateful.

[Solar]

My guess would be that the place was built by a pre-catastrophe people and that the 'hunter-gatherers' came later, i.e. post-catastrophe. As evidence I would point to South and Central America where virtually everybody originated from somehwere other than where they are today, and, at least in the case of the Inca, make no claim to the building of the cyclopean architecture.

Yes, "stuck in the middle" seems quite appropriate! Much like the kundalini of the Caduceus whilst the serpents writhe about. Your "guess" above is more accurate and a very good summary of what I think is actually the case. There is an apparent inability to separate the more rough hewn nature of subsequent 'hunter-gather' occupations of these locales when contrasted with the highly organized and sophisticated nature of the architects and builders. The contrast massively refutes the current notions.

So, you have some of the exact same piques in curiosity that struck me with regard to who left the bones and pondering the nature of the wildlife depictions and whether or not they can be said to be the same as found today and/or as would be currently indigenous to the local region.

After a dozen years of patient work, Schmidt has uncovered what he thinks is definitive proof that a huge ceremonial site flourished here, a "Rome of the Ice Age," as he puts it, where hunter-gatherers met to build a complex religious community.

It took this chap 12yrs to come to the standard conclusion? This idea has been tossed upon the find of EVERY ancient city that has been found. We could've e-mailed him photos and received the same results within minutes of the find without him looking at the photos. Yes, its that bad imho.

But yes, it infuriates me that Mankind is not given its just due to have cyclically gone through the ages 'gaining' and subsequently 'loosing' some form of 'higher knowledge/wisdom' to which the structures attest. It devolves into 'Someone or Something' else had to do it because we (always considering ourselves to be at the height of all knowledge - another flaw) cannot now duplicate and/or figure out how these things were done.

[Grey Cloud]

'Rome of the Ice Age': There were a million people living in Rome at the height of its pomp. And I accused the History Channel of hyperbole!

Solar wrote:

But yes, it infuriates me that Mankind is not given its just due to have cyclically gone through the ages 'gaining' and subsequently 'loosing' some form of 'higher knowledge/wisdom' to which the structures attest.

Plato wrote:

Athenian Stranger. Do you believe that there is any truth in ancient traditions?
Cleineas. What traditions?
Athenain Stranger. The traditions about the many destructions of mankind which have been occasioned by deluges and pestilences, and in many other ways, and of the survival of a remnant?

Cleineas. Everyone is disposed to believe them.

[...]

Athenian Stranger. Would not all implements have then perished and every other excellent invention of political or any other sort of wisdom have utterly disappeared?

[...]

Athenian Stranger. After the great destruction, may we not suppose that the state of man was something of this sort:-In the beginning of things there was a fearful illimitable desert and a vast expanse of land; a herd or two of oxen would be the only survivors of the animal world; and there might be a few goats, these too hardly enough to maintain the shepherds who tended them?

Plato Laws Book III
Also found this sensible article of Gobekli Tepe:
http://www.philipcoppens.com/gobekli.html

P.S. Let's not even mention the expert's 'death cult' theory.