"Voice of God"

What is a human being? What is life? Can science give us reliable answers to such questions? The electricity of life. The meaning of human consciousness. Are we alone? Are the traditional contests between science and religion still relevant? Does the word "spirit" still hold meaning today?

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"Voice of God"

Unread postby Roshi » Sun Feb 28, 2016 9:27 am

I am not religious, and I am not an atheist. I am kind of buddhist/animist. Maybe there is a "great spirit" that takes many forms. Mainly - I don't know, still I believe there is more than the material.

I got this idea when reading "Foundation" by Asimov (spoilers).

Golan Trevize is chosen by Gaia because of his "intuition". He must choose something, and they trust him. Why?
They (Gaia) had the power to influence any mind, but they specifically say they need his untouched mind to make the decision, even if it is a decision against them. They could make him say what they want but they don't. This is similar to "consulting the gods".

So - I am thinking about the ancients doing "divination", the Chinese and their I-Ching, they were not just throwing sticks on the ground, it was in fact an attempt to communicate with "God". How? By using random events only influenced by "forces of nature". I do not believe in "fate", and I do not advocate bowing to some "wizards" that would read the future using whatever they are using. It's just an interesting idea.

In "His Dark Materials" by Philip Pullman the same idea appears with the aelithiometer - that is in contact with "dust". "Dust" being something like a life essence for everything. Just ask your question - calm your mind, and the answer will come. Using the "aelithiometer". Or I-Ching, or stones thrown on the ground. Philip Pullman puts a lot of importance on - the calm mind, and the right intention when using the aelithiometer for an answer.
Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and you shall find; knock, and it shall be opened to you:


Why are places still untouched by man - so mesmerizing? There we can see "God" somehow. Everything in it's place, organized only by the "random" acts of the Universe.
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Re: "Voice of God"

Unread postby Roshi » Mon Feb 29, 2016 2:47 am

I quoted from the Bible, I am not a Christian - I see it as a collection of old stories.
Then there is Jesus - whoever he was, and generally he teaches things I agree with. Telling people to be good - is good. What happened later and the craziness of religion is people's fault. People will turn anything into a religion, as we see in science today. Special relativity is a religion, if people would actually read it and treat it as a scientific theory - it would be gone in a week.

My theory is that Jesus was a Buddhist:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edicts_of_Ashoka
Ashoka Maurya (IAST: Aśoka; /əˈʃoʊkə/; 304–232 BCE), commonly known as Ashoka[4] and Ashoka the Great, was an Indian emperor of the Maurya Dynasty who ruled almost all of the Indian subcontinent from c. 268 to 232 BCE

In order to propagate the Buddhist faith, Ashoka explains that he sent emissaries to the Hellenistic kings as far as the Mediterranean, and to people throughout India, claiming they were all converted to the Dharma as a result. He names the Greek rulers of the time, inheritors of the conquest of Alexander the Great, from Bactria to as far as Greece and North Africa, displaying a clear grasp of the political situation at the time.


The above quote from the Bible:
Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and you shall find; knock, and it shall be opened to you


is true. I agree with it. Whoever seeks an answer will find the answer. Concentrate long enough on a problem, even if the answer does not come right away, even if temporarily putting the problem aside, even years later the answer will come, and it will look like it was very simple... Somehow the "subconscious" or "God", keeps working on that problem.
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Re: "Voice of God"

Unread postby tholden » Fri Mar 04, 2016 1:32 am

The most fundamental reality about religions is that ANY religion is better than evolution and being an evoloser.

http://bearfabrique.org/Misc/evolution_rastafari.htm
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Re: "Voice of God"

Unread postby Roshi » Fri Mar 04, 2016 3:39 am

There were many practices in the ancient world, that were meant to "communicate with the gods", receive visions, etc. Look at the native american "vision quest". Organized religion destroyed a lot of these.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divination
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%85rsg%C3%A5ng
From Småland and Blekinge, the year walker was supposed to lock himself up in a dark room, without speaking to anyone nor taste food or drink. At midnight, he (or she) walked to the parish church – or a cluster of different churches – and circled it three times (or more), then he (or she) blew into the church’s key hole. With this the year walker temporarily lost his (or her) Christianity. When this happened, supernatural beings appeared and challenged the year walker. If the walker managed these tests, glimpses of the future could appear; either in vision or by sounds. These could be interpreted as glimpses of what would happen the following year. The phenomena could vary greatly regionally or even in the same district.

Year Walkers should not have seen the light of fire over the same time course. The person should have fasted and express deep earnestness. He or she did not greet an oncomer, nor did they speak or laugh. If the person saw graves thrown up in the cemetery, it meant that a plague was coming. If he or she saw small men (dwarves or elves) carry sheaves, or saw the person riding with mice pulling a hay cart, it was thought that one could expect a good harvest. If the person it was hewn in the woods or if they saw armed men riding on the roads, it meant that war should be expected.

If someone (in a regular manner) had gone Year Walking for seven years and on the last night, met a mounted man, who had a 'runkavle' in the mouth, and if the Year Walker was then brave enough and strong enough to snatch this, he or she became known as "wise". That is, he/she had gained knowledge of all hidden things and could see into the future, without ever again having to do a Year Walk.


Organized religion tells people that only the "authorithy" knows the truth, and they should not search it themselves.

Jesus said, "I am the light that is over all things. I am all: from me all came forth, and to me all attained.

Split a piece of wood; I am there.

Lift up the stone, and you will find me there

This Jesus guy did not bother explaining much, he liked talking in parables, and soon the disciples in their wisdom started worshiping him as a person, the rest is history... He should have said "we are", or "I found out what I am but you are also the same thing"...
In fact he did say it, but his disciples (now wealthy and powerful in the human realm) made sure to censor him, the gospel of Thomas was not included in the bible:

If your leaders say to you, 'Look, the kingdom is in the sky,' then the birds of the sky will precede you. If they say to you, 'It is in the sea,' then the fish will precede you. Rather, the (Father's) kingdom is within you and it is outside you.

When you know yourselves, then you will be known, and you will understand that you are children of the living Father. But if you do not know yourselves, then you live in poverty, and you are the poverty."
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Re: "Voice of God"

Unread postby Chan Rasjid » Fri Jul 15, 2016 8:09 am

Hello Roshi,

Roshi wrote: If your leaders say to you, 'Look, the kingdom is in the sky,' then the birds of the sky will precede you. If they say to you, 'It is in the sea,' then the fish will precede you. Rather, the (Father's) kingdom is within you and it is outside you.
When you know yourselves, then you will be known, and you will understand that you are children of the living Father. But if you do not know yourselves, then you live in poverty, and you are the poverty."


This quote of yours is one of the most powerful on Gnosticism in Christianity. I think the current four books do not contain any much Gnostic sayings that I recall.

Before I converted to Islam long ago, I did read the New Testament, the KJV version, not those modern trash versions. I think it is not without reason that much of the world have been won over by Christianity. Words have mystical power of influence. The KJV Bible probably was written by persons with wisdom.

The spiritual world exist. It is a world not of science, logic or rationality. The reality that one would experience when meeting with this other reality is usually not something which can be transcribed for people who have no such experience. It is the same with religion. A Christian will tell you that his faith in God is personal - it cannot be transferred to another at will. I have not really experienced much of this other spiritual reality except through faith as a Muslim, but I have read books of the experiences of others and who I have reason to believe in and trusts. It is like when we are told a strange story by a family member, we can accept it if we know our family very well.

There is a free pdf book about things and stories from the spiritual world by an Indonesian:
"Inner wisdom", Prior Hartono.
http://www.undiscoveredworldspress.com/iwisdomtwo.pdf

Best regards,
Chan Rasjid.
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