11,000 B.C. Extinction

Historic planetary instability and catastrophe. Evidence for electrical scarring on planets and moons. Electrical events in today's solar system. Electric Earth.

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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby Chromium6 » Sat May 26, 2012 10:04 pm

Of course "now" is a little bit relative.

All of the cycles are coming together
By Robert On May 24, 2012 · 18 Comments


“We are entering a Bond event right now.
All of the cycles are coming together

By F. Guimaraes

We know too little about the Sun, despite all our efforts since the XVII century, but one thing is strikingly evident from all these studies, i.e., the cyclic nature of the solar radiation and its obvious, direct influence on Earth’s climate, with scales from few years to many thousands of years.

It seems that these very cycles are telling us that the new Ice Age is coming.

“We are entering a Bond event right now, the 8th event since the Holocene climate optimum, all interglacial periods terminate on either the 7th or 8th event relative to the 5th eccentricity cycle. This is where we are heading right now…”
See:
http://www.westernusawx.info/forums/ind ... ntry591851)

All of the cycles are coming together.

22yr Hale
179yr barycentric
1450yr Bond
23,000yr precession
25,800yr plane
100,000yr ice age (when all solar-planetary cycles converge as they are now)…”
See:
http://www.westernusawx.info/forums/ind ... ntry592986

http://iceagenow.info/2012/05/cycles-coming/


Bond event
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Holocene Temperature Variations.png

Bond events are North Atlantic climate fluctuations occurring every ≈1,470 ± 500 years throughout the Holocene. Eight such events have been identified, primarily from fluctuations in ice-rafted debris. Bond events may be the interglacial relatives of the glacial Dansgaard–Oeschger events,[1] with a magnitude of perhaps 15–20% of the glacial-interglacial temperature change.

Gerard C. Bond of the Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory at Columbia University, was the lead author of the paper published in 1997 that postulated the theory of 1,470-year climate cycles in the Holocene, mainly based on petrologic tracers of drift ice in the North Atlantic.[2][3]

The existence of climatic changes, possibly on a quasi-1,500 year cycle, is well established for the last glacial period from ice cores. Less well established is the continuation of these cycles into the holocene. Bond et al. (1997) argue for a cyclicity close to 1470 ± 500 years in the North Atlantic region, and that their results imply a variation in Holocene climate in this region. In their view, many if not most of the Dansgaard–Oeschger events of the last ice age, conform to a 1,500-year pattern, as do some climate events of later eras, like the Little Ice Age, the 8.2 kiloyear event, and the start of the Younger Dryas.

The North Atlantic ice-rafting events happen to correlate with most weak events of the Asian monsoon for at least the past 9,000 years,[4][5] while also correlating with most aridification events in the Middle East for the past 55,000 years (both Heinrich and Bond events).[6][7] Also, there is widespread evidence that a ≈1,500 yr climate oscillation caused changes in vegetation communities across all of North America.[8]

For reasons that are unclear, the only Holocene Bond event that has a clear temperature signal in the Greenland ice cores is the 8.2 kyr event.[citation needed]

The hypothesis holds that the 1,500-year cycle displays nonlinear behavior and stochastic resonance; not every instance of the pattern is a significant climate event, though some rise to major prominence in environmental history.[9] Causes and determining factors of the cycle are under study; researchers have focused attention on variations in solar output, and "reorganizations of atmospheric circulation."[9] Bond events may also be correlated with the 1800-year lunar tidal cycle.[10]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bond_event
On the Windhexe: ''An engineer could not have invented this,'' Winsness says. ''As an engineer, you don't try anything that's theoretically impossible.''
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby Chromium6 » Sat May 26, 2012 10:49 pm

Sir Isaac Newton on Atlantis

from "The Chronology of Ancient Kingdoms"

The [308] Atlantides, a people upon mount Atlas conquered by the Egyptians in the Reign of Ammon, related that Uranus was their first King, and reduced them from a savage course of life, and caused them to dwell in towns and cities, and lay up and use the fruits of the earth, and that he reigned over a great part of the world, and by his wife Titæa had eighteen children, among which were Hyperion and Basilea the parents of Helius and Selene; that the brothers of Hyperion slew him, and drowned his son Helius, the Phaeton of the ancients, in the Nile, and divided his Kingdom amongst themselves; and the country bordering upon the Ocean fell to the lot of Atlas, from whom the people were called Atlantides. By Uranus or Jupiter Uranius, Hyperion, Basilea, Helius and Selene, I understand Jupiter Ammon, Osiris, Isis, Orus and Bubaste; and by the sharing of the Kingdom of Hyperion amongst his brothers the Titans, I understand the division of the earth among the Gods mentioned in the Poem of Solon.

For Solon having travelled into Egypt, and conversed with the Priests of Sais; about their antiquities, wrote a Poem of what he had learnt, but did not finish it; [309] and this Poem fell into the hands of Plato who relates out of it, that at the mouth of the Straits near Hercules's Pillars there was an Island called Atlantis, the people of which, nine thousand years before the days of Solon, reigned over Libya as far as Egypt; and over Europe as far as the Tyrrhene sea; and all this force collected into one body invaded Egypt and Greece, and whatever was contained within the Pillars of Hercules, but was resisted and stopt by the Athenians and other Greeks, and thereby the rest of the nations not yet conquered were preserved: he saith also that in those days the Gods, having finished their conquests, divided the whole earth amongst themselves, partly into larger, partly into smaller portions, and instituted Temples and Sacred Rites to themselves; and that the Island Atlantis fell to the lot of Neptune, who made his eldest Son Atlas King of the whole Island, a part of which was called Gadir (Cadiz like in Northern Spain--Chromium6) ; and that in the history of the said wars mention was made of Cecrops, Erechtheus, Erichthonius, and others before Theseus, and also of the women who warred with the men, and of the habit and statue of Minerva, the study of war in those days being common to men and women. By all these circumstances it is manifest that these Gods were the Dii magni majorum gentium, and lived between the age of Cecrops and Theseus; and that the wars which Sesostris with his brother Neptune made upon the nations by land and sea, and the resistance he met with in Greece, and the following invasion of Egypt by Neptune, are here described; and how the captains of Sesostris shared his conquests amongst themselves, as the captains of Alexander the great did his conquests long after, and instituting Temples and Priests and sacred Rites to themselves, caused the nations to worship them after death as Gods: and that the Island Gadir or Gades, with all Libya, fell to the lot of him who after death was Deified by the name of Neptune. The time therefore when these things were done is by Solon limited to the age of Neptune, the father of Atlas; for Homer tells us, that Ulysses presently after the Trojan war found Calypso the daughter of Atlas in the Ogygian Island (Ireland--Chromium6), perhaps Gadir; and therefore it was but two Generations before the Trojan war. This is that Neptune, who with Apollo or Orus fortified Troy with a wall, in the Reign of Laomedon the father of Priamus, and left many natural children in Greece, some of which were Argonauts, and others were contemporary to the Argonauts; and therefore he flourished but one Generation before the Argonautic expedition, and by consequence about 400 years before Solon went into Egypt: but the Priests of Egypt in those 400 years had magnified the stories and antiquity of their Gods so exceedingly, as to make them nine thousand years older than Solon, and the Island Atlantis bigger than all Afric and Asia together, and full of people; and because in the days of Solon this great Island did not appear, they pretended that it was sunk into the sea with all its people: thus great was the vanity of the Priests of Egypt in magnifying their antiquities.

The Cretans [310] affirmed that Neptune was the man who set out a fleet, having obtained this Præfecture of his father Saturn; whence posterity reckoned things done in the sea to be under his government, and mariners honoured him with sacrifices: the invention of tall Ships with sails [311] is also ascribed to him. He was first worshipped in Africa, as Herodotus [312] affirms, and therefore Reigned over that province: for his eldest son Atlas, who succeeded him, was not only Lord of the Island Atlantis, but also Reigned over a great part of Afric, giving his name to the people called Atlantii, and to the mountain Atlas, and the Atlantic Ocean. The [313] outmost parts of the earth and promontories, and whatever bordered upon the sea and was washed by it, the Egyptians called Neptys; and on the coasts of Marmorica and Cyrene, Bochart and Arius Montanus place the Naphthuhim, a people sprung from Mizraim, Gen. x. 13; and thence Neptune and his wife Neptys might have their names, the words Neptune, Neptys and Naphthuhim, signifying the King, Queen, and people of the sea-coasts. The Greeks tell us that Japetus was the father of Atlas, and Bochart derives Japetus and Neptune from the same original: he and his son Atlas are celebrated in the ancient fables for making war upon the Gods of Egypt; as when Lucian [314] saith that Corinth being full of fables, tells the fight of Sol and Neptune, that is, of Apollo and Python, or Orus and Typhon; and where Agatharcides [315] relates how the Gods of Egypt fled from the Giants, 'till the Titans came in and saved them by putting Neptune to flight; and where Hyginus [316] tells the war between the Gods of Ægypt, and the Titans commanded by Atlas.

The Titans are the posterity of Titæa, some of whom under Hercules assisted the Gods, others under Neptune and Atlas warred against them: for which reason, saith Plutarch, [317] the Priests of Egypt abominated the sea, and had Neptune in no honour. By Hercules, I understand here the general of the forces of Thebais and Ethiopia whom the Gods or great men of Egypt called to their assistance, against the Giants or great men of Libya, who had slain Osiris and invaded Egypt: for Diodorus [318] saith that when Osiris made his expedition over the world, he left his kinsman Hercules general of his forces over all his dominions, and Antæus governor of Libya and Ethiopia. Antæus Reigned over all Afric to the Atlantic Ocean, and built Tingis or Tangieres: Pindar [319] tells us that he Reigned at Irasa a town of Libya, where Cyrene was afterwards built: he invaded Egypt and Thebais; for he was beaten by Hercules and the Egyptians near Antæa or Antæopolis, a town of Thebais; and Diodorus [320] tells us that this town had its name from Antæus, whom Hercules slew in the days of Osiris. Hercules overthrew him several times, and every time he grew stronger by recruits from Libya, his mother earth; but Hercules intercepted his recruits, and at length slew him. In these wars Hercules took the Libyan world from Atlas, and made Atlas pay tribute out of his golden orchard, the Kingdom of Afric. Antæus and Atlas were both of them sons of Neptune both of them Reigned over all Libya and Afric, between Mount Atlas and the Mediterranean to the very Ocean; both of them invaded Egypt, and contended with Hercules in the wars of the Gods, and therefore they are but two names of one and the same man; and even the name Atlas in the oblique cases seems to have been compounded of the name Antæeus and some other word, perhaps the word Atal, cursed, put before it: the invasion of Egypt by Antæus, Ovid hath relation unto, where he makes Hercules say, Sævoque alimenta parentis Antæo eripui.

This war was at length composed by the intervention of Mercury, who in memory thereof was said to reconcile two contending serpents, by casting his Ambassador's rod between them: and thus much concerning the ancient state of Egypt, Libya, and Greece, described by Solon.

Atlanits
above, the lost continent of Atlantis was the way via other islands to the continent (Eurasia) surrounding the Ocean.

http://www.atlantisbolivia.org/isaacnewtonatlantis.htm
On the Windhexe: ''An engineer could not have invented this,'' Winsness says. ''As an engineer, you don't try anything that's theoretically impossible.''
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby Lloyd » Sun May 27, 2012 12:13 pm

Chromium6 said: This article mentions that a 12,000 year ago event likely destroyed Puma Punku.
- The [308] Atlantides, a people upon mount Atlas conquered by the Egyptians in the Reign of Ammon, related that Uranus was their first King, and reduced them from a savage course of life, and caused them to dwell in towns and cities, and lay up and use the fruits of the earth, and that he reigned over a great part of the world, and by his wife Titæa had eighteen children, among which were Hyperion and Basilea the parents of Helius and Selene; that the brothers of Hyperion slew him, and drowned his son Helius, the Phaeton of the ancients, in the Nile, and divided his Kingdom amongst themselves; and the country bordering upon the Ocean fell to the lot of Atlas, from whom the people were called Atlantides.

Clarifying Ancient Myths
* According to Cardona and possibly other EU team members, as I understand it, there were likely no civilizations before the Saturn System entered the Solar System about 10 to 14 thousand years ago. Entry into the Solar System was catastrophic for Earth and other bodies in the Saturn System, but there were likely no other catastrophic events until about 5,000 years ago, when the Saturn System broke up. So the catastrophic event/s 5,000 years ago is more likely what destroyed Puma Punku and Tiwanaku, and other civilizations etc.
* The continent of Atlantis was Saturn in the northern sky surrounded by a blue ring that looked like water, which was thought to be an ocean. The ancient rulers mentioned were planets and other apparitions in the sky, not humans, though plasma effects etc made them appear to be intelligent, human-like, and sometimes animal-like living beings. Some of the TPODs discuss such features above the Earth in ancient times. There was even at times a plateau-like structure above the horizon, possibly actually aurorae, that appeared to the ancients to be a land which they initially called the Earth with beings on it who were thought to be gods. When the upper "Earth" was no longer visible in later times, the name was then applied to the present Earth, which was formerly called the "underworld", because it was under the dazzling, seemingly ideal world/s in the sky.
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby Chromium6 » Sun May 27, 2012 5:52 pm

Lloyd wrote:
Chromium6 said: This article mentions that a 12,000 year ago event likely destroyed Puma Punku.
- The [308] Atlantides, a people upon mount Atlas conquered by the Egyptians in the Reign of Ammon, related that Uranus was their first King, and reduced them from a savage course of life, and caused them to dwell in towns and cities, and lay up and use the fruits of the earth, and that he reigned over a great part of the world, and by his wife Titæa had eighteen children, among which were Hyperion and Basilea the parents of Helius and Selene; that the brothers of Hyperion slew him, and drowned his son Helius, the Phaeton of the ancients, in the Nile, and divided his Kingdom amongst themselves; and the country bordering upon the Ocean fell to the lot of Atlas, from whom the people were called Atlantides.

Clarifying Ancient Myths
* According to Cardona and possibly other EU team members, as I understand it, there were likely no civilizations before the Saturn System entered the Solar System about 10 to 14 thousand years ago. Entry into the Solar System was catastrophic for Earth and other bodies in the Saturn System, but there were likely no other catastrophic events until about 5,000 years ago, when the Saturn System broke up. So the catastrophic event/s 5,000 years ago is more likely what destroyed Puma Punku and Tiwanaku, and other civilizations etc.
* The continent of Atlantis was Saturn in the northern sky surrounded by a blue ring that looked like water, which was thought to be an ocean. The ancient rulers mentioned were planets and other apparitions in the sky, not humans, though plasma effects etc made them appear to be intelligent, human-like, and sometimes animal-like living beings. Some of the TPODs discuss such features above the Earth in ancient times. There was even at times a plateau-like structure above the horizon, possibly actually aurorae, that appeared to the ancients to be a land which they initially called the Earth with beings on it who were thought to be gods. When the upper "Earth" was no longer visible in later times, the name was then applied to the present Earth, which was formerly called the "underworld", because it was under the dazzling, seemingly ideal world/s in the sky.


Thanks for the clarifications on Saturn and it's break up. After looking more closely at Isaac Newton's full work, it seems to be a collection of ancient stories compiled together from old Greek/Latin/Hebrew sources.

Since the Dixon relics according to Crichton Miller, allowed the Egyptians to plot most things in the stars, I'm curious that they focus so much on Zep-Tepi. Was that a great "re-setting?". This is likely not a completely EU only course to pursue, it's like stellar EU events and other events occurring on Earth such as a Pole-Shift (Gothenburg Reversal). http://redicecreations.com/article.php?id=13952

I kind of follow G. Hancock's and R. Bauval's theories that the Pyramids at Giza were likely a massive memorial to a global cataclysm around 10,500-11,000 B.C. that sunk Atlantis (at the Triple Azores Junction). The Pyramids could hold clues to when a pole-shift/ice-age/Plasma Discharges could happen again as well. The Egyptians knew the time and the place for 1000s of years on Earth and in the Stars.

Sorry, I didn't want to derail this thread from an EU perspective with too much Pole-Shift/Pyramids/Atlantis info but there is something to this and I don't know how much EU related it is at the moment in these aspects.

Image
Image

Image
This illustration demonstrates the ability of the Instrument to measure angles accurately.

1. The Instrument can be used to take remarkably accurate astronomical measurements.
2. Measuring distances for chart and map making including measuring the circumference of the Earth, to an accuracy of 3 arc minutes.
3. The Instrument can be used for Civil engineering projects such as surveying and construction.
4. Timekeeping and the calendar upkeep are possible with this instrument.
5. Navigation including latitude to an accuracy of 3 nautical miles on a handheld version.
http://www.hiddenmysteries.org/mysterie ... staff.html


(Full Book) The Chronology of Ancient Kingdoms - Issac Newton
http://www.gutenberg.org/files/15784/15 ... .htm#chron

Robert Schoch - Hour 1 - The Mystery of the Sphinx
March 25, 2012
Robert Schoch, a full-time faculty member at the College of General Studies at Boston University since 1984, earned his Ph.D. in Geology and Geophysics at Yale University. In the early 1990s, Dr. Schoch's geological analyses of the Great Sphinx of Egypt demonstrated that the statue is thousands of years older than the conventional dating of 2500 BCE, bringing him worldwide fame. In his new book Forgotten Civilization Robert reveals scientific evidence of advanced civilization predating ancient Egypt, Sumeria, and Greece, as well as the catastrophe that destroyed it nearly 12,000 years ago and what its legacy can teach us about our own future. In the first hour we discuss the weathering of the Sphinx, its origin, the chamber underneath and the mysterious Sphinx temple. We also discuss Edgar Cayce' s Association for Research and Enlightenment (ARE) and the current situation in Egypt.


http://rediceradio.net/radio/2012/RIR-1 ... ch-hr1.mp3

;)
http://www.catchpenny.org/chamber.html
On the Windhexe: ''An engineer could not have invented this,'' Winsness says. ''As an engineer, you don't try anything that's theoretically impossible.''
Chromium6
 
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby Chromium6 » Mon May 28, 2012 12:16 pm

Here's Robert Schoch's book on Plasma Discharges and related cataclysms. He puts EU events around 10,900 B.C. with a start of major events at 9,700 B.C. He mentions Anthony Peratt extensively in this book. Looks like he follows the Thunderbolts-EU theories (and I hope he gives proper credit where due). He mentions the anomaly of the Göbekli Tepe temple in Turkey which turns the clock back for "civilization" to just after the last ice-age. I didn't know he had this book out until I saw this page. Looks like he's trying to integrate EU and G. Hancock, R. Bauval, and Anthony West's work together but pushes the dates back since he believes the Sphinx to be much, much older like Göbekli Tepe is:
-------

http://www.robertschoch.com/articles/sc ... ly2010.pdf

Plasma, Solar Outbursts, and the End of the Last Ice Age

15,000 to 11,000 years ago Earth experienced a series of climatic fluctuations. It had been extremely cold, with continental glaciers extending much further than they do today, but the climate started to warm. However, temperatures suddenly reverted back and there was a short cold spell, known as the Younger Dryas, before the final warming and the official end of the last ice age.

Based on Greenland ice core data, the Younger Dryas began and ended very abruptly. Its start dates to 10,900 B.C., and its ending (the final warming) began circa 9700 B.C. and may have occurred within an incredible three years; given our inability to resolve the finest details of something that happened so long ago, it may have literally happened overnight.

How do we explain this pattern of abrupt climatic shifts? I once hypothesized that comets were responsible. A comet hitting the land or a shallow ocean, or exploding above the land's surface, scattering dust and debris into the atmosphere, would cause global cooling. Although the initial strike would happen in a flash, it would take some years for the cooling to reach its full extent. This pattern fits well with the cooling at 10,900 B.C. and there is evidence of a cometary explosion over North America at this time.

What about the warming event of circa 9700 B.C.? In years past I speculated that comets hitting deep oceans were responsible. A comet might break the thin oceanic crust, releasing heat from the hot magma beneath. Vaporized and displaced water would rain down on Earth, and tsunamis would wash across coastal areas, warming the planet. But even with a comet, or a series of comets, bombarding the oceans, could the warming happen as quickly as the Greenland ice cores indicate? I think not. But if not comets, what?

Oddly, the indigenous Easter Island rongorongo script may hold the answer. But first we have to consider the concept of the fourth state of matter--plasma. Plasma consists of electrically charged particles. Familiar plasma phenomena on Earth today include lightning and auroras, the northern and southern lights, and upper atmospheric phenomena known as sprites. In the past, much more powerful plasma events sometimes took place, due to solar outbursts and coronal mass ejections (CMEs) from the Sun, or possibly emissions from other celestial objects. Powerful plasma phenomena could cause strong electrical discharges to hit Earth, burning and incinerating materials on our planet's surface. Los Alamos plasma physicist Dr. Anthony L. Peratt and his associates have established that petroglyphs found worldwide record an intense plasma event (or events) in prehistory.

Dr. Peratt determined that powerful plasma phenomena observed in the skies would take on characteristic shapes resembling humanoid figures, humans with bird heads, sets of rings or donut shapes, and writhing snakes or serpents--shapes reflected in countless ancient petroglyphs. The Easter Island rongorongo script, recorded on antique wooden tablets, is composed of similar shapes as the petroglyphs. Studying them in detail (inspired by my wife, Catherine Ulissey, who first noticed the connection), I concluded that the Easter Island rongorongo tablets (the surviving tablets are copies of copies of copies . . . .) record a major plasma event in the skies thousands of years ago. This, I believe, was the event that brought a final close to the last ice age.

Plasma hitting the surface of Earth could heat and fuse rock, incinerate flammable materials, melt ice caps, vaporize shallow bodies of water creating an extended deluge of rain, and send the climate into a warming spell. The release of pressure that follows the melting of thousands-of-meters-thick ice sheets can induce earthquakes and even cause hot rock under pressure to melt and erupt to the surface as volcanoes. The world was in chaos, and this is the event recorded by petroglyphs and the rongorongo texts.

The plasma event of 9700 B.C. eradicated advanced civilizations and high cultures of the time, and the radiation emanating from the plasma may have affected mental and psychical abilities. This could be the basis for the nearly universal myth of a Golden Age, a time when beings on Earth had mental abilities far surpassing those of later times. The 9700 B.C. event may be the original basis for the Atlantis legends; the timeframe fits well with Plato's account.

Plasma and electrical discharges hitting the surface of Earth may have been responsible for the vitrification (melting into crude glass) of ancient stone structures seen in some parts of the world, such as various hill forts in Scotland (to the right are some photos showing vitrification at an ancient Scottish hill fort, along with the ground plan of such a fort--the vitrification is shown by the dark shading). People cowered for their lives; they sought shelter in caves, under cliffs, in dwellings built of thick stone or carved into mountainsides. Perhaps Göbekli Tepe was intentionally buried in an attempt to protect it from on-going plasma events, as I suggest in my new book. Humankind was thrown into a dark age for thousands of years, only to reemerge (amidst megalithic monuments belonging to a much earlier period) with scattered memories and nascent abilities.

- - - - -

Since February 2010 -- I have been publicly speaking and writing about the theories presented on this page. I have a new book covering these issues and much more, Forgotten Civilization: The Role of Solar Outbursts in Our Past and Future, available for pre-order from Amazon.com. In the meantime, if you find these ideas interesting, you might want to take a look at three articles I wrote for the Australian magazine New Dawn. (The links below are to PDFs of each article.) They are titled:

"An Ancient Warning, A Global Message, From the End of the Last Ice Age"

"The Mystery of Göbekli Tepe and Its Message to Us"

"Glass Castles & Fire from the Sky: A New Theory of Vitrification"


Schoch mentions this by Richard Proctor on Proclus which seems reasonable:

The British astronomer Richard Proctor, found a reference in the works of the Roman philosopher Proclus in his commentary on Plato's 'Timaeus'. In 1883 he published 'The Great Pyramid, Observation Tomb, and Temple', in which he suggested, more reasonably, that the Great Pyramid was used as an observatory before its completion. His proposition explains the 'Gallery' in terms of an observation point (thus the evenly spaced holes in the walls), for viewing the transit of the stars (sun). He claimed that the pyramid was used in that state then re-used as a funerary complex later. It has been since discovered that parts of the ascending passage were cut through existing masonry, which supports his theory.

Early Arab historians also support the idea that the Great Pyramid was built as an observatory and that it contained reproductions of the celestial spheres. For example:

Murtadi, in 1584, said that the magical priest Saiouph made his abode, at the time of the deluge, in the pyramid; which, he says "was a temple of the stars, where there was a figure of the sun, and one of the moon, both of which spoke." He mentions the great grandson of Noah, (Bardesi ?), who, as priest, "applied himself to the worship of the stars." He adds "It is reported that he made the great laws, built the pyramids, and set up for idols the figures of the stars".



---

An image of the size of the original Sphinx:

Image
On the Windhexe: ''An engineer could not have invented this,'' Winsness says. ''As an engineer, you don't try anything that's theoretically impossible.''
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby Chromium6 » Mon May 28, 2012 7:44 pm

Just another clip from "Finger Prints of the Gods". Bauval appears to push the dates back to 10,450 BC.

The signature of a distant date

It was almost midnight by the time that we reached Giza. We checked into the Siag, a hotel with an excellent pyramid view, and sat out on our balcony as the three stars of Orion’s belt tracked slowly across the southern heavens.

It was the disposition of these three stars, as archaeo-astronomer Robert Bauval had recently demonstrated, that served as the celestial template for the site-plan of the three Giza pyramids. This, in itself, was a remarkable discovery, suggesting a far higher level of observational astronomy, and of surveying and setting-out skills, than scholars had attributed to the Ancient Egyptians.

Even more remarkable, however—and the reason that I had arranged to meet him at Giza the next morning— was Bauval’s contention that the pattern traced out on the ground (in almost fifteen million tons of perfectly dressed stone) matched exactly the pattern in the sky during the epoch of 10,450 BC.

If Bauval was correct, the pyramids had been devised, using the changes precession effects in the positions of the stars, as the permanent architectural signature of the eleventh millennium BC


http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/egipt ... apter%2046
On the Windhexe: ''An engineer could not have invented this,'' Winsness says. ''As an engineer, you don't try anything that's theoretically impossible.''
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby Lloyd » Tue May 29, 2012 11:43 am

Chromium6 said: In his new book Forgotten Civilization Robert reveals scientific evidence of advanced civilization predating ancient Egypt, Sumeria, and Greece, as well as the catastrophe that destroyed it nearly 12,000 years ago and what its legacy can teach us about our own future.
- ... If Bauval was correct, the pyramids had been devised, using the changes precession effects in the positions of the stars, as the permanent architectural signature of the eleventh millennium BC

* Schoch gave a presentation at the EU Conference in Las Vegas last January, but the Thunderbolts team doesn't agree with his dating, I'm pretty sure. Schoch and the others don't seem to have studied ancient mythology sufficiently and haven't used comparative mythology techniques to come to the most sound conclusions.
No Civilization before 10,000 Years Ago
* My understanding is that humans were rather primitive before the Saturn System entered the Solar System about 10,000 years ago, because that was the Age of Darkness, when nothing was visible in the sky, except Saturn, which resembled a glow worm, not very bright. Since Saturn remained in one place in the sky nearly all the time, humans could not tell time and had little concept of time. The only times Saturn changed positions was when it flared and got very bright and rained catastrophe on the Earth.
No Constellations before 5,000 Years Ago
* Schoch and the others are likely unaware of the ancient Egyptian and other mythologies that stated that stars did not become visible until the Saturn System broke up about 5,000 years ago. So the positions of the stars were not observed until after 5,000 years ago. From 10,000 to 5,000 years ago, only Saturn, the Sun, Venus and Mars, and smaller moons of Saturn were visible. So there were no constellations that could be seen, but it was the beginning of telling time and of great advances in language and organization etc. There may have been civilizations that predated ancient Egypt and Sumeria, but none before 5,000 years ago would have been able to observe constellations.
No More Doomsdays
* The catastrophes of the past are likely to have no great lessons for us about warnings of future catastrophes, because we're no longer subject to Saturn flares. Humans have feared doomsdays since the Saturn System broke, if not earlier, but they've also had an urge to bring about doomsday themselves, as a sort of psychosis.
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby moses » Tue May 29, 2012 5:58 pm

"No Constellations before 5,000 Years Ago"
The map of the stars etched into an 'air shaft' in the Great Pyramid strongly suggests that this pyramid was not built anytime near 2,500 BC. It is most likely a depiction of the sky when the pyramid was built. This means that it was not built in a Saturn System separate from the Solar System, at least in a System where the stars were not visible.

Then again reversing the star movements using precession to be a date of around 11,000 BC discounts the possibility of the axis suffering a hit. If one relates the desertification of Northern Africa with a axis-moving event, then we can discount such reversals. So even with the extensive work of Velikovsky, Talbot, Cardona, Peratt, etc, the whole issue is still very open.
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby Chromium6 » Wed May 30, 2012 8:10 pm

Check the dates... makes one wonder if the "oldest" ruins are in the oceans all around the world... ;)
------

9,500-Year-Old City Found Underwater Off India

Discovery in Bay of Cambay Will Force Western Archaeologists to Rewrite History

4500-year-old Harappan

The civilization of Ancient Egypt occurred in a past so remote that today it seems mystical. The pyramids and other temples, with their hieroglyphics depicting a flourishing civilization, have a mysterious, almost magical appeal. It seems inconceivable that people of an advanced society could have walked those ancient streets.

Now, it was announced in January, a civilization has been uncovered that would have appeared just as ancient to the people who built the pyramids as the pyramids seem to us.

According to marine scientists in India, archaeological remains of this lost city have been discovered 36 metres (120 feet) underwater in the Gulf of Cambay off the western coast of India. And carbon dating says that they are 9,500 years old.

This news completely contradicts the position of most Western historians and archaeologists, who (because it did not fit their theories) have always rejected, ignored, or suppressed evidence of an older view of mankind's existence on planet Earth. Human civilization is now provably much more ancient than many have believed.

According to the BBC's Tom Housden, reporting on the Cambay find:

map showing siteThe vast city — which is five miles long and two miles wide — is believed to predate the oldest known remains in the subcontinent by more than 5,000 years.

The site was discovered by chance last year by oceanographers from India's National Institute of Ocean Technology, who were conducting a survey of pollution.

Using sidescan sonar, which sends a beam of sound waves down to the bottom of the ocean, they identified huge geometrical structures at a depth of 120 feet.

Debris recovered from the site — including construction material, pottery, sections of walls, beads, sculpture, and human bones and teeth — has been carbon dated and found to be nearly 9,500 years old (BBC article).

Several reports confirm this estimate. Housden added, "The whole model of the origins of civilisation will have to be remade from scratch."

Unheard-of Scope of Cambay Ruins

The BBC article tells us that the remains of this ancient city stand upon "enormous foundations." Marine archaeologists discovered them with a technology known as "sub-bottom profiling."

Author and filmmaker Graham Hancock, an authority on archaeological investigations of ancient civilizations, reportedly said that the evidence was compelling. For example, he said that the oceanographers had found two large blocks that were larger than anything that's ever been found. "Cities on this scale," Hancock told BBC Online, "are not known in the archaeological record until roughly 4,500 years ago when the first big cities begin to appear in Mesopotamia.

Theorists are postulating that the area where this city exists was submerged when the ice caps melted at the end of the last Ice Age.

"A month ago in mid-January [2002]," says Hancock on his website, "marine scientists in India announced they had sonar images of square and rectangular shapes about 130 feet down off the northwestern coast of India in the Gulf of Khambhat (Cambay). . . . [There are] sonar shapes with 90-degree angles. The Indian Minister of Science and Technology ordered that the site be dredged. What was found has surprised archaeologists around the world" (GrahamHancock.com/news.)

The Find Includes Human Remains

Linda Moulton Howe, who investigates occurrences of this type worldwide, interviewed Michael Cremo about this new discovery. Cremo is a researcher and author of the book Forbidden Archaeology. Cremo, Howe said, has visited India and attended local meetings about the Cambay site.

"Within the past few months," Cremo told her, "the engineers began some dredging operations there and they pulled up human fossil bones, fossil wood, stone tools, pieces of pottery, and many other things that indicated that it indeed was a human habitation site that they had. And they were able to do more intensive sonar work there and were able to identify more structures. They appeared to have been laid out on the bank of a river that had been flowing from the Indian subcontinent out into that area."

According to Howe:

Even if we don't know what the cultural background of the people is, if it does happen to be a city that is 9500 years old, that is older than the Sumerian civilization by several thousand years. It is older than the Egyptian, older than the Chinese. So it would radically affect our whole picture of the development of urban civilization on this planet.

Now, if it further happens that additional research is able to identify the culture of the people who lived in that city that's now underwater — if it turns out they are a Vedic people, which I think is quite probable given the location of this off the coast of India — I think that would radically change the whole picture of Indian history which has basically been written by Western archaeologists.

http://www.spiritofmaat.com/announce/oldcity.htm


Also:
Saturday, 19 January, 2002, 06:33 GMT
Lost city 'could rewrite history'
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/1768109.stm
To read about the previously most ancient finds in India, at Harappan, and their relationship to Vedic tradition, please see Linda Moulton Howe's article at her website EarthFiles.com.


Chronological problem

This, Mr Hancock told BBC News Online, could have massive repercussions for our view of the ancient world.

Harappan site in Pakistan, BBC
Harappan remains have been found in India and Pakistan

"There's a huge chronological problem in this discovery. It means that the whole model of the origins of civilisation with which archaeologists have been working will have to be remade from scratch," he said.

However, archaeologist Justin Morris from the British Museum said more work would need to be undertaken before the site could be categorically said to belong to a 9,000 year old civilisation.

"Culturally speaking, in that part of the world there were no civilisations prior to about 2,500 BC. What's happening before then mainly consisted of small, village settlements," he told BBC News Online.

Dr Morris added that artefacts from the site would need to be very carefully analysed, and pointed out that the C14 carbon dating process is not without its error margins.

It is believed that the area was submerged as ice caps melted at the end of the last ice age 9-10,000 years ago

Although the first signs of a significant find came eight months ago, exploring the area has been extremely difficult because the remains lie in highly treacherous waters, with strong currents and rip tides.

The Indian Minister for Human Resources and ocean development said a group had been formed to oversee further studies in the area.

"We have to find out what happened then ... where and how this civilisation vanished," he said.
On the Windhexe: ''An engineer could not have invented this,'' Winsness says. ''As an engineer, you don't try anything that's theoretically impossible.''
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby Lloyd » Thu May 31, 2012 5:16 pm

Mo said: The map of the stars etched into an 'air shaft' in the Great Pyramid strongly suggests that this pyramid was [built about 10,000 years ago.]

* I found a video on that at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbztRHBauV4. I'll try to see if Cardona has a reply.
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby webolife » Sat Jun 02, 2012 9:17 am

If my contention is correct that alleged radiocarbon dates of 50,000 BP to about 5000 BP may be compressed into a time frame of roughly 7000 BP to 5000 BP, then the 9000 BP estimation of the Cambay find may not be so remarkable... I think chromium has an interesting point about submerged sites, particularly if they are correlatable to the recession of the glaciers, which I suggest is coincident with the Peleg event.
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby kell1990 » Sun Jun 03, 2012 10:04 pm

webolife wrote:If my contention is correct that alleged radiocarbon dates of 50,000 BP to about 5000 BP may be compressed into a time frame of roughly 7000 BP to 5000 BP, then the 9000 BP estimation of the Cambay find may not be so remarkable... I think chromium has an interesting point about submerged sites, particularly if they are correlatable to the recession of the glaciers, which I suggest is coincident with the Peleg event.



Why do you think that humans have only been around for 7,000 years? Or 9,000 years. I don't think glaciers have anything to do with it, human population, that is. Density, maybe, but not population.

Humans, as we would recognize them, have been on this planet for at least 70,000 years and probably longer. Why do you think that we've been here such a short period of time? Is this a religious belief, or what?
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby webolife » Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:59 pm

What I said is that radiocarbon dates may be compressible to within that framework. Here's my thinking:
1. Fossil evidence [all of it] indicates a prevalent worldwide subtropical climate [from the beginning to the time of the Ice Age] in the "story of life". Mammoths were found with frozen undigested tropical plants in their stomachs;
coal is found in Antarctica, etc.
2. This infers [and I hold] that the atmosphere had more of a "greenhouse" chemistry and structure during most of Earth history. What would cause this different atmospheric functioning?
3. A [currently non-existent] layer of water vapor, say at the tropopause or lower stratosphere, would have significantly insulated the biosphere so that temperatures worldwide would have been more consistent and weather less turbulent than in our current world. Furthermore, significant continental shifting/drifting has occurred with our resultant mountainous microclimes that have no evidence of existing in that prior world.
4. This infers [and I hold] that the topography of the "fossilized world" was relatively flat.
5. Radioactive C-14 is created in the upper atmosphere [stratosphere] by the alteration of N through solar insolation of UV and/or cosmic radiation. This is mixed by our current turbulent global wind system with the constituents of the troposphere at a relatively steady and measureable rate, comensurate with the rate at which it is assimilated by living creatures at the surface, in a ratio of about 1 part C-14 to 1 million parts C-12. This led Libby a half century ago to propose a dating method... if living organisms stop assimilating radiocarbon when they die, then the time it takes for the C-14 to decay [half-life of ~5700 yrs] in the fossil remains should lead to our ability to clock the time of the organism's death in years before present [BP], very reasonable and ingenious and certainly Nobel worthy. He was able to correlate his method to known dates back to about 5000BP, within reasonable error margins.
6. There are a number of assumptions imbedded in the concept, but the one most relevant to this discussion is that the rate of mixing and assimilation has been at an equilibrium or near equilibrium level throughout the past 50,000 years of Earth history. Radiocarbon dating cannot be used for older dates [if there were any], because the infinitesmal amount of C-14 remaining in the sample. Which leads to...
7. What if, due to the likely lack of mixing prior to the atmosphere-collapsing Ice Age event, any samples obtained from organisms which survived that event would have little if any C-14 as the initial condition of the decay. In this case possible all dates yielded by this method would be too large, due to too small amounts of C-14. Assuming a couple centuries required to reach current near equilibrium levels...
8. All ages from say 50,000BP to perhaps 5000BP are reasonably compressible to just a few centuries between about the end of the Ice Age until about the time of historically verified records. This also repositions the end of the Ice Age to that same window of between say 4 to 7 centuries BC. Some examples... the oldest cities are dated in the 9000 BP range, but if they were built shortly following the cataclysm, their attendant C-14 levels would still be too low, and therefore their alleged ages too high. The mammoths are typical found in the 11,000BP-14,000BP range, which again, since many of these creatures predated or survived the Ice Age, would be compressed into a more recent timing. The only "sure" times you can stand upon are those with a correlated historical significance.

As for how long humans have been around... the only way this would be dated by radiocarbon is by assuming the atmospheric cataclysm which brought on the Ice Age had no affect on the rate of mixing, an unlikely scenario to me. Other methods of determining much older dates, such as hundred thousand year Nenderthals and few million year dates for Lucy and her relatives, are beset with greater problems and much deeper entrenched assumptions, one of which would be the assumption that uranium on earth was in pure form at the time life began to develop. Since throughout the solar system U is found in nearly 50/50 ratio with its Pb daughter element, a reasonable assumption might be that this is a normal mix (If one found pure uranium sans lead in any natural formation, this would be remarkable!) --- furthermore, if that mix is assumed to be the inital condition of Uranium decay, then all dates based on this method could yield solar system and earth origin times of, well... yesterday. Since reasonable error margins for U-Pb dating are often in the tens to hundreds of thousands of years or more, I don't find anything reliable about the alleged age of the earth, the beginning of life in the Pre-Cambrium, the extinction of the dinosaurs at the KT boundary, or any other supposedly "absolute" dates that are set in standard geological stone. Uniformitarian philosophy and misunderstood stratigraphic principles have led to a "religiously" entrenched paradigm that ignores and in some cases attempts to conceal the awesome likelihood that earth history has been framed [not just punctuated] by catastrophes and cataclysms.
IMHO ;)
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby moses » Mon Jun 04, 2012 5:52 pm

Well I can only agree with your assessment webo, but it seems to me that the temperature at the poles was similar to the temperature at the equator. So I think that there was much greater electrical conditions which, indeed, would have held a layer of water vapour in the upper atmosphere, but that would not be enough to get similar temperatures world-wide.

Therefore I consider that the Earth was in a different orbit, or perhaps better described as a different type of orbit. After all the formation of the mountains was very likely due to an interaction with another planet, not a comet. Thus it is quite likely that all the planets were in different orbits around that time. Probably randomly moving then, but a previous stable configuration most likely existed, and so this configuration has to be a part of the story.
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Re: 11,000 B.C. Extinction

Unread postby webolife » Tue Jun 05, 2012 2:19 pm

Possibly, but I hold first to current observations on the earth, eg. ongoing uplift of mt ranges such as the Himalayas, etc., which evidence [though at a much slowed rate] continental drift, leading back to a single continental form, leading back to [regardless of alleged changing earth radius] a joined and lower-topography pangean landmass, which may all have been equatorially or nearly so situated. I prefer my former suggestion, ie. that a H2O-vap induced [only a very few % greater water content would have been required] greenhouse atmosphere kept the entire earth, incl the poles, in a subtropical state, however this continental drifting and associated orogenies must have played a part in the transformation of the climate. Now if you invoke interplanetary or electrical spaceweather causation for any of these crust altering events, I'm game... as stated elsewhere, I am of the firm belief that the extent, range, and prevalence of large meteoric incidents throughout the geologic record are not just occasional astronomical punctuations to an otherwise tranquil and gradual uniformitarianism, but rather part and parcel of the catastrophic framework for all of earth history. Why this fits into this thread [for the benefit of kell1990], is that it is possible to view all of earth history as we currently know it, into a framework of thousands versus millions or billions of years. If this is true, then it may still take several lifetimes to shift the old uniformitarian paradigm. Regardless, the "11,000 B.C. Extinction" of this thread title is not just an isolated relatively recent happenstance if the entire timeline of geology is catastrophic.
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