Asteroids

Historic planetary instability and catastrophe. Evidence for electrical scarring on planets and moons. Electrical events in today's solar system. Electric Earth.

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Comet Asteroid P2013 P5 moves under its jets

Unread postby CCCstar » Sun Nov 10, 2013 6:15 am

Oh look another electrical object that changes course as it moves into our system by the power of its jets!
The paper is available from the link below
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/11/08/hubble_spots_lawnsprinkler_asteroid_that_has_boffins_baffled/

Could they be preparing the community for a change in theory? Article quotes
"In astronomy, where you find one, you eventually find a whole bunch more," said Prof Jewitt, whose study of the rock [PDF] was published in the Astrophysical Journal of Letters. "This is an amazing object and almost certainly the first of many more to come."
I Grok Pollack. Dr. Gerald Pollack is going to rock your universe in Vegas!
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Re: Comet Asteroid P2013 P5 moves under its jets

Unread postby Sparky » Sun Nov 10, 2013 7:29 am

"It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong."
"Doubt is not an agreeable condition, but certainty is an absurd one."
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Re: Asteroid P/2013 P5 -- An asteroid with six comet-like ta

Unread postby The Great Dog » Sun Nov 10, 2013 8:51 am

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Re: Asteroid P/2013 P5 -- An asteroid with six comet-like ta

Unread postby LongtimeAirman » Mon Nov 11, 2013 12:44 am

Sparky wrote:
how we can invoke birkland currents without the likely pressence of electrons.

It is suggested that electrons are stripped off the comet. The coma can grow quite large. The tail and coma provide a huge area to discharge into. Some videos show the tail twisting and writhing, suggesting to me a birkeland current.


Hello Sparky, Thanks for the reply. I have enjoyed your questions, enthusiasm and insights. I hope I didn't step on your toes. I'm an over educated EE without much to show for it. I watched, " the The Electric Comet | Full Documentary http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34wtt2EUToo yesterday, thanks viscount aero. And thanks Max Photon for the Ian Sefton's http://www2.warwick.ac.uk/fac/sci/physi ... sefton.pdf

The mainstream reaction to the data is becomming ever more ridiculous as this asteroid/comet discovery clearly shows.

I wish I could grasp the resistive, capacitive or inductive Cometary Models but I can follow those perspectives. I'm afraid that those terms themselves are too steeped in conventional thinking to make sense. I definitely believe that comets are part of the helio circuit. I recommend Mile's http://milesmathis.com/comet.pdf. His photon based charge field drives the electrons, protons and lighter ions which we see as the solar wind or electric field, while the photon spins deliver the magnetic component. The comet dissolves under the energy bombardment while its constituent parts reradiate the charge field back into the helio circuit. The charge field underlies and forms the EM field. I believe it also provides a stronger foundation to the Electric Universe.

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Re: Asteroid P/2013 P5 -- An asteroid with six comet-like ta

Unread postby pavlink » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:56 am

LongtimeAirman wrote:...
I wish I could grasp the resistive, capacitive or inductive Cometary Models but I can follow those perspectives. I'm afraid that those terms themselves are too steeped in conventional thinking to make sense. I definitely believe that comets are part of the helio circuit. I recommend Mile's http://milesmathis.com/comet.pdf. His photon based charge field drives the electrons, protons and lighter ions which we see as the solar wind or electric field, while the photon spins deliver the magnetic component. The comet dissolves under the energy bombardment while its constituent parts reradiate the charge field back into the helio circuit. The charge field underlies and forms the EM field. I believe it also provides a stronger foundation to the Electric Universe.

REMcB


It has to have something in common with:
Why we see the moon and the sun in the sky together, some times and ( mostly ) no other ( times ).
Earth has something in common with a comet.

The electrical currents are always present.
They are also visible under right external conditions.

When moon is "inside" such current, and right conditions, it is shinning and visible even in a bright sunny day.

Right condition would be increased incoming of antiphotons ( proto-electrical current ) that would bring the field closer to balance.
Balanced photon-antiphoton field increases the light through its interaction.
Balance it perfectly and it would reveal the "Eternal flame".
We live in a double star system.
We need to study double star systems.

Solar System as 4D energy vortex
http://files.kostovi.com/8835e.pdf
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Re: Asteroid P/2013 P5 -- An asteroid with six comet-like ta

Unread postby Sparky » Mon Nov 11, 2013 9:01 am

Airman:
I wish I could grasp the resistive, capacitive or inductive Cometary Models


Well, you probably have more of a background to do so than I do...

The capacitive model is Wal Thornhill's: Comet is charged by induction in the outer reaches of it's orbit. As it moves toward the sun it enters environments of differing charges and attempts to equalize by discharging into the increasing positive field.
Electrons are pulled off and they , along with the matter that the electrons took with them form the ion coma and tail. It is suggested that a comet, in an overstressed state, will flare and even explode.

Since I have only seen discreet components explode from and excess of current or component malfunction, I am developing a resistive comet hypothesis, just to exercise my mind. In short, the comet is electrically connected by plasma to where it was and to where it is going. I like circuits... ;)

Inductive comet is one that plays a part in it's charging as it moves through an electrical/magnetic field, setting it up to become a capacitive comet, or as it encounters magnetic fields along the way. Bumping into a cme with an iron comet would probably have an inductive component. ;) What say you.. :?
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Re: Asteroid P/2013 P5 -- An asteroid with six comet-like ta

Unread postby Maol » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:01 pm

Sparky wrote:Airman:
I wish I could grasp the resistive, capacitive or inductive Cometary Models


Well, you probably have more of a background to do so than I do...

The capacitive model is Wal Thornhill's: Comet is charged by induction in the outer reaches of it's orbit. As it moves toward the sun it enters environments of differing charges and attempts to equalize by discharging into the increasing positive field.
Electrons are pulled off and they , along with the matter that the electrons took with them form the ion coma and tail. It is suggested that a comet, in an overstressed state, will flare and even explode.

Since I have only seen discreet components explode from and excess of current or component malfunction, I am developing a resistive comet hypothesis, just to exercise my mind. In short, the comet is electrically connected by plasma to where it was and to where it is going. I like circuits... ;)

Inductive comet is one that plays a part in it's charging as it moves through an electrical/magnetic field, setting it up to become a capacitive comet, or as it encounters magnetic fields along the way. Bumping into a cme with an iron comet would probably have an inductive component. ;) What say you.. :?

No doubt. Iron and EMF in motion result in induction and once the inductor is saturated additional EMF generates heat.
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Re: Asteroid P/2013 P5 -- An asteroid with six comet-like ta

Unread postby LongtimeAirman » Mon Nov 11, 2013 6:44 pm

I wish I could grasp the resistive, capacitive or inductive Cometary Models


Well, you probably have more of a background to do so than I do...


My degrees served only as a prerequisite for positions. I can't say I needed the education to do my jobs.

The capacitive model is Wal Thornhill's: Comet is charged by induction in the outer reaches of it's orbit. As it moves toward the sun it enters environments of differing charges and attempts to equalize by discharging into the increasing positive field.


Again, I'm trying to describe Miles' model as I understand it. The comet is least charged in the outer reaches of its orbit. As it moves toward the sun the comet doesn't experience a more "positive" field but instead encounters an increased photon based charge field as per the inverse quad law distance (primarily) from the sun. Much of the charge field (photons) passes through the comet without interaction, though all the cometary matter is experiencing the increased charge field effects such as heating, ionization and breaking atomic bonds. The charge field also brings electrons, protons and small ions, but recognize that most of the work is being done by photons. Dust and ion tails are now forming. Each particle is recycling the increased charge field, physically driving neighboring particles away from each other through photon "pressure".

Electrons are pulled off and they , along with the matter that the electrons took with them form the ion coma and tail. It is suggested that a comet, in an overstressed state, will flare and even explode.


The comet experiences increased stress primarily in the form of heating - inductive as well as direct. After one or several thousand orbits the comets loose material, and the stresses build. Flares and explosions are no surprise.

Since I have only seen discreet components explode from and excess of current or component malfunction, I am developing a resistive comet hypothesis, just to exercise my mind. In short, the comet is electrically connected by plasma to where it was and to where it is going. I like circuits...


With each orbit, the comet goes through a severe electrical as well as heating and cooling cycle. It's a question of how well the materials which comprise the comet hold up.

Inductive comet is one that plays a part in it's charging as it moves through an electrical/magnetic field, setting it up to become a capacitive comet, or as it encounters magnetic fields along the way. Bumping into a cme with an iron comet would probably have an inductive component.


A CME event provides an increased number of highly charged (photon loaded) larger ions, adding to the stress.

The more spin aligned the charge field photons are, the stronger the magnetic effects. In his comet paper http://milesmathis.com/comet.pdf, Miles notes that the long "curving" of the dust tails Iindicates the cumulative impact of the majority of spinning protons. The charge field is a bit more complicated considering whether a proton has a clockwise or counterclockwise spin.

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Re: Asteroid P/2013 P5 -- An asteroid with six comet-like ta

Unread postby LongtimeAirman » Mon Nov 11, 2013 8:17 pm

I need to correct the last section, changing protons to photons. Tried to find edit -no joy.

In his comet paper http://milesmathis.com/comet.pdf, Miles notes that the long "curving" of the dust tails Iindicates the cumulative impact of the majority of spinning photons. The charge field is a bit more complicated considering whether a photon has a clockwise or counterclockwise spin. 

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Re: Asteroid P/2013 P5 -- An asteroid with six comet-like ta

Unread postby Sparky » Tue Nov 12, 2013 8:07 am

Airman:
Again, I'm trying to describe Miles' model as I understand it. The comet is least charged in the outer reaches of its orbit. As it moves toward the sun the comet doesn't experience a more "positive" field but instead encounters an increased photon based charge field as per the inverse quad law distance (primarily) from the sun. Much of the charge field (photons) passes through the comet without interaction, though all the cometary matter is experiencing the increased charge field effects such as heating, ionization and breaking atomic bonds. The charge field also brings electrons, protons and small ions, but recognize that most of the work is being done by photons. Dust and ion tails are now forming. Each particle is recycling the increased charge field, physically driving neighboring particles away from each other through photon "pressure".


You do have an unusual hypothesis, derived from Miles' "charge photon".
You do know that photons do not have a charge, except from bombardment effect.
And they are very small! And solar wind ions are big!
I see the charge that a comet experiences is that of induced negative from distant solar space, then discharging into the more positive sun. I propose an RCL circuit.

The comet experiences increased stress primarily in the form of heating - inductive as well as direct. After one or several thousand orbits the comets loose material, and the stresses build. Flares and explosions are no surprise.

How would loss of matter induce stress? :? Seems that would reduce any stress... The stress is an electrical stress, whether mechanically or directly electrically induced, isn't it?
Also, I really doubt that a comet gets and retains much heat from the sun. Not at distances near Saturn or farther. ANy heat would be internal from an electric source.
Do you agree that we are talking about a rock, not an ice :? ball?
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Any other events associated with P/2013P5's cometary display

Unread postby Max Photon » Tue Nov 12, 2013 11:35 am

If P/2013 P5 is a main-belt asteroid, that gives it a nearly circular orbit. That is, there is little radial component relative to its motion around the sun.

So, what caused the asteroid to display cometary effects?

    Have there been any recent CME's in that direction?

    Did the asteroid pass by some other significant object?

    Have any other asteroids misbehaved?

    Did any telescope spot a long electrical extension cord?

Why P/2013 P5?
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Re: Any other events associated with P/2013P5's cometary dis

Unread postby Dotini » Tue Nov 12, 2013 12:18 pm

Max Photon wrote:If P/2013 P5 is a main-belt asteroid, that gives it a nearly circular orbit. That is, there is little radial component relative to its motion around the sun.

So, what caused the asteroid to display cometary effects?

    Have there been any recent CME's in that direction?

    Did the asteroid pass by some other significant object?

    Have any other asteroids misbehaved?

    Did any telescope spot an long electrical extension cord?

Why P/2013 P5?



The authors of a very recent paper from Astrophysical Journal Letters have hypothesized rotational mass shedding, presumed due to torque imposed by solar radiation.
http://hubblesite.org/pubinfo/pdf/2013/52/pdf.pdf
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Why P/2013 P5?

Unread postby Max Photon » Tue Nov 12, 2013 2:43 pm

Dotini, I wonder why other asteroids are not experiencing torque by solar radiation and resultant mass shedding?

(Also, could you kindly edit or repost you last link.)
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Re: Why P/2013 P5?

Unread postby Dotini » Tue Nov 12, 2013 3:06 pm

Max Photon wrote:Dotini, I wonder why other asteroids are not experiencing torque by solar radiation and resultant mass shedding?

(Also, could you kindly edit or repost you last link.)


This is what I have, sorry if it no longer works.
http://hubblesite.org/pubinfo/pdf/2013/52/pdf.pdf

The authors seemed to think there are other active asteroids like this one, and seem to be planning to look for them. They suggested that certain shapes would be unstable and eventually spin and break up.
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Why P/2013 P5?

Unread postby Max Photon » Tue Nov 12, 2013 3:27 pm

Oh, thanks, the link does work! (I was the missing link.)

Ummm, is it just me, or is the DISCUSSION section kind of... bizarre.

The authors list four possible mechanisms for the cometary display:

1) sublimation of ice
2) electrostatic levitation of dust
3) impact
4) rotational instabilities

They then explain away #1 and #3, and say the only surviving hypothesis is #4.

Did I miss something? What about #2: electrostatic levitation of dust?
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