Help Us Explain Crater Formation!

Historic planetary instability and catastrophe. Evidence for electrical scarring on planets and moons. Electrical events in today's solar system. Electric Earth.

Moderators: MGmirkin, bboyer

Re: Help Us Explain Crater Formation!

Unread postby Sparky » Tue Sep 09, 2014 1:02 pm

"It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong."
"Doubt is not an agreeable condition, but certainty is an absurd one."
"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire
Sparky
 
Posts: 3517
Joined: Tue Jul 20, 2010 2:20 pm

Re: Help Us Explain Crater Formation!

Unread postby Metryq » Wed Sep 10, 2014 3:00 pm

"Something smacked the ground, and knocked me clear out of my chair."
—Farmer Wilmouth, Oct. 30, 1938
User avatar
Metryq
 
Posts: 405
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 3:31 am

Re: Help Us Explain Crater Formation!

Unread postby dahlenaz » Thu Sep 11, 2014 4:16 pm

Here is a link to the first photo made available of the
rubberband ball crater. The ball was almost 5 ft in diameter
and around a ton in weight. Upon impact it partially broke up.
People said that the remainder was hot to the touch.
I will trying to find a better photo that shows the whole crater. d...z

http://para-az.com/crater-types/rbbr-band-crtr-adjmu1.jpg
Original photo credits: Joe Jennings http://www.skydive.tv

...
User avatar
dahlenaz
 
Posts: 460
Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:58 am
Location: SD Arizona

Re: Crater chain south of Mt. Ararat ?

Unread postby Bomb20 » Tue Sep 16, 2014 7:28 am

Looks interesting, also the horseshoe on the right side!
User avatar
Bomb20
 
Posts: 173
Joined: Sun Sep 01, 2013 7:16 pm
Location: Germany

Re: Crater chain south of Mt. Ararat ?

Unread postby Frantic » Tue Sep 16, 2014 1:07 pm

Horseshoe shape, manmade perhaps? (or collapsed Caldera?) I don't know this area, I can't tell from the images how inhabited the area is.

Mostly everything here will be attributed to vulcanism and it would take serious proof to convince otherwise.

The craters are interesting, but I don't see anything that screams electrical, I think they are most likely caldera's but not sure
Frantic
 
Posts: 255
Joined: Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:49 am

Re: Crater chain south of Mt. Ararat ?

Unread postby viscount aero » Tue Sep 16, 2014 8:35 pm

bdw000 wrote:I am no EU expert, but this looks like it might be of interest.

This:

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Mt+Ararat,+I%C4%9Fd%C4%B1r+Province,+Turkey/@39.5820811,44.3232893,2189m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x4014d232638342ad:0xaaa6fa54b6b1247c?hl=en

looks to me like a crater chain here on Earth, with what might even be a "scooped out" area, like on Mars.

I have followed Thunderbolts here for years, and do not remember any items about crater chains here on earth. Perhaps I just missed them.

Could this just be a series of old sink-holes??

EDIT:
Actually, the scale is small enough that these could possibly be man-made, whether ancient or modern. There are actually buildings in and around the "craters." But it sure looks like a crater chain from Mars. Please debunk as needed.


That is a crater chain akin to structures on Mars and the Moon. It has been etched away.
User avatar
viscount aero
 
Posts: 2379
Joined: Mon May 12, 2008 11:23 pm
Location: Los Angeles, California

Re: Crater chain south of Mt. Ararat ?

Unread postby webolife » Wed Sep 17, 2014 11:43 am

Those are commonly referred to as fumaroles, and occur throughout the lava/ash flows as you trace them back toward the two peaks to the north. These are common around Crater Lake in Oregon as well as Mt. St. Helens in Washington, and are indeed volcanic in origin. Now to what extent electrical activity within the hot flows contributed to the "popping" out of gases and steam along these streams is a matter for anyone's conjecture. The horseshoe is a typical cinder cone formation, exploded out toward the southwestern side during its formation. If these are the same formations we observe in the canyons and rills of Mars, then that would diminish credence to the EDM-ic nature of the Martian formations, as the volcanic nature of the terrestrial features is historically known.
Truth extends beyond the border of self-limiting science. Free discourse among opposing viewpoints draws the open-minded away from the darkness of inevitable bias and nearer to the light of universal reality.
User avatar
webolife
 
Posts: 2370
Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 2:01 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: Crater chain south of Mt. Ararat ?

Unread postby viscount aero » Wed Sep 17, 2014 12:47 pm

webolife wrote:Those are commonly referred to as fumaroles, and occur throughout the lava/ash flows as you trace them back toward the two peaks to the north. These are common around Crater Lake in Oregon as well as Mt. St. Helens in Washington, and are indeed volcanic in origin. Now to what extent electrical activity within the hot flows contributed to the "popping" out of gases and steam along these streams is a matter for anyone's conjecture. The horseshoe is a typical cinder cone formation, exploded out toward the southwestern side during its formation. If these are the same formations we observe in the canyons and rills of Mars, then that would diminish credence to the EDM-ic nature of the Martian formations, as the volcanic nature of the terrestrial features is historically known.


These features often are seen among miles-long channels of geometrically consistent widths and depths. How do those form?
User avatar
viscount aero
 
Posts: 2379
Joined: Mon May 12, 2008 11:23 pm
Location: Los Angeles, California

Re: Crater chain south of Mt. Ararat ?

Unread postby Frantic » Wed Sep 17, 2014 3:09 pm

Well, would an analogy to the stars, "beads on a string" formation make sense. If lava flow is plasma and has developed a charge differential, and vulcanism can be attributed to explosive electrical activity. Than perhaps a discharge under the surface created multiple explosions along a path like beads on a string. I don't think a surface electrical event could be responsible.

I presume they are just part of the vulcanism, which is poorly understood phenomenon, and may be electrically influenced.
Frantic
 
Posts: 255
Joined: Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:49 am

Re: Crater chain south of Mt. Ararat ?

Unread postby viscount aero » Wed Sep 17, 2014 10:57 pm

“Collapse Pits” of Arsia Mons
http://www.thunderbolts.info/tpod/2005/ ... samons.htm

As high-tech capabilities have returned the most extraordinary images of the planet Mars, the “explanations” become increasingly far-fetched.

excerpt:

The ESA summary echoes the customary explanation. “The pits probably formed when lava erupted from the side of Arsia Mons. When lava, or molten rock, finds its way to the surface, it produces several veins and chambers. These slowly empty as the lava erupts and runs down the volcano flanks. Some of the lava reaching the surface cools down and becomes solid, often building a roof over the emptied chamber. The resulting voids collapse due to the weight of the overlying material”.

A closer look here discredits this explanation. The floors of these pits are clean and their edges are smooth. Collapsed roofs leave rubble on the floor and broken edges around the walls. The collapse of lava tubes on Earth produces irregular holes with debris heaped in the bottoms. Compare the pits of Arsia Mons with the famous “Big Tubes” area in New Mexico, here.
User avatar
viscount aero
 
Posts: 2379
Joined: Mon May 12, 2008 11:23 pm
Location: Los Angeles, California

Re: Crater chain south of Mt. Ararat ?

Unread postby Rossim » Thu Sep 18, 2014 5:02 am

This is a great example of "the boy who cried wolf (EU)". If we apply EU theories where we don't have sufficient evidence then we lose a lot of credence, especially when the process is historically documented. Same as the crater recently found; impact is an easier explanation to accept than electric discharge, even for us.
Rossim
 
Posts: 139
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:46 am

Re: Crater chain south of Mt. Ararat ?

Unread postby viscount aero » Thu Sep 18, 2014 8:45 am

Rossim wrote:This is a great example of "the boy who cried wolf (EU)". If we apply EU theories where we don't have sufficient evidence then we lose a lot of credence, especially when the process is historically documented. Same as the crater recently found; impact is an easier explanation to accept than electric discharge, even for us.


I didn't say the impact crater was electrical. There was also a thread about pingoes possibly being "electrical" and I didn't agree. They're well-documented as being sinkholes, essentially. Not every establishment theory is wrong. I believe the Moon rotates on an axis, for example. However, If I am in error about the volcanic origin of the terrestrial forms being debated then that is the nature of life. But it goes both ways. The establishment insists that almost everything on Mars is made from floods or volcanoes which is preposterous.
User avatar
viscount aero
 
Posts: 2379
Joined: Mon May 12, 2008 11:23 pm
Location: Los Angeles, California

Re: Crater chain south of Mt. Ararat ?

Unread postby Rossim » Thu Sep 18, 2014 9:09 am

viscount aero wrote:
Rossim wrote:This is a great example of "the boy who cried wolf (EU)". If we apply EU theories where we don't have sufficient evidence then we lose a lot of credence, especially when the process is historically documented. Same as the crater recently found; impact is an easier explanation to accept than electric discharge, even for us.


I didn't say the impact crater was electrical. There was also a thread about pingoes possibly being "electrical" and I didn't agree. They're well-documented as being sinkholes, essentially. Not every establishment theory is wrong. I believe the Moon rotates on an axis, for example. However, If I am in error about the volcanic origin of the terrestrial forms being debated then that is the nature of life. But it goes both ways. The establishment insists that almost everything on Mars is made from floods or volcanoes which is preposterous.


I think we have to be extremely cautious when comparing EDM effects to topological formations on earth because weathering and volcanism is clearly present. Our argument is stronger on planetary bodies where it must be assumed that volcanoes and weathering existed. Here it is known and while the electrical causation is entirely plausible, it should not be used in favor of established causes due to a lack of overwhelming evidence. It's too much of a stretch to apply the EU theory to when other viable mechanisms are easily applicable on earth.
Rossim
 
Posts: 139
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:46 am

Re: Crater chain south of Mt. Ararat ?

Unread postby viscount aero » Thu Sep 18, 2014 9:26 am

Rossim wrote:
viscount aero wrote:
Rossim wrote:This is a great example of "the boy who cried wolf (EU)". If we apply EU theories where we don't have sufficient evidence then we lose a lot of credence, especially when the process is historically documented. Same as the crater recently found; impact is an easier explanation to accept than electric discharge, even for us.


I didn't say the impact crater was electrical. There was also a thread about pingoes possibly being "electrical" and I didn't agree. They're well-documented as being sinkholes, essentially. Not every establishment theory is wrong. I believe the Moon rotates on an axis, for example. However, If I am in error about the volcanic origin of the terrestrial forms being debated then that is the nature of life. But it goes both ways. The establishment insists that almost everything on Mars is made from floods or volcanoes which is preposterous.


I think we have to be extremely cautious when comparing EDM effects to topological formations on earth because weathering and volcanism is clearly present. Our argument is stronger on planetary bodies where it must be assumed that volcanoes and weathering existed. Here it is known and while the electrical causation is entirely plausible, it should not be used in favor of established causes due to a lack of overwhelming evidence. It's too much of a stretch to apply the EU theory to when other viable mechanisms are easily applicable on earth.


I agree. That same cautionary ethos is often applied by the EU community in cases where Earth-based geological weathering or alteration is applied to Mars or the Moon where such things, ergo, erosion or even vulcanism, probably did not occur.

Moreover, I have criticised the EU community on this forum several times for denying that wind and water erosion are responsible for terrestrial weathering. Too often the EU denies that wind and water (and vulcanism) do actually alter the surface of the Earth and probably other planets. There are billions of planets with billions of ecosystems.
User avatar
viscount aero
 
Posts: 2379
Joined: Mon May 12, 2008 11:23 pm
Location: Los Angeles, California

Thunderbolts and Lightning Craters

Unread postby Enemy of Empire » Wed Jul 15, 2015 7:01 am

I was scheduled to give a presentation at Phoenix, the title being the subject line of this post, but was unable to attend due to visa problems. This title was submitted before I had finished the paper I was working on and I would have liked to revise it to "A complete refutation of the Alvarez Hypothesis - from an EU perspective". The paper was published on July 1st by New Concepts in Global Tectonics. It's title is "Polygonal crater formation by electrical discharges, Wayne BURN". You can view the paper in pdf form for download at http://www.ncgt.org/nws/4a01717953fb71b ... 8e6914.pdf

So, you may have missed my presentation but you can read the paper on which it was based. I think you may find it a very interesting read. My apologies for any confusion with my username but EoE is my general internet tag which I use everywhere.
User avatar
Enemy of Empire
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2015 8:31 am
Location: Nottingham, UK

PreviousNext

Return to Electric Universe - Planetary Science

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest