The Lightning-Scarred Planet Mars

Historic planetary instability and catastrophe. Evidence for electrical scarring on planets and moons. Electrical events in today's solar system. Electric Earth.

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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby Bomb20 » Wed Apr 30, 2014 1:48 am

Hi Jatslo,
you suggested compression of electric fields as source. How should this work? An electric field is not a physical object, it is a man-made concept, a more or (often) less helpful tool for explanations but not an object, not matter.


I think the thrigger event must be connected with the touching, colliding and interpenetrating of plasma shells of celestial bodies. I suggest some possibilities for a discussion here:

1. Extreme solar activities which caused the discharges on Mars by producing z-pinch knot was already mentioned and I share Doug´s doubts. (Why did it happen so strong to Mars and not in a similar or stronger way to the other inner planets?)

2. Intruder(s) into our solar system from outside the system, e.g. an orphan planet.

3. Big celestial bodies from our own system (maybe unknown to us until now because of their long-period orbits) as intruders in the habitable or inner zone of our system.

4. A gas giant in our own system if it was a (dwarf) star in the past, e.g. Saturn/Proto-Saturn.

5. A „collision“ or rather „melting / merging“ of two solar systems. "The "old" solar system with the Proto-Saturn or other system.

6. Is it possible that incoming cosmic radiation of huge events outside our system could thrigger afore mentioned event as well?

other opportunities??? (Where is the „missing“ planet between Mars and Jupiter? Exploded?)

I am listening ...
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby peter » Wed Apr 30, 2014 8:49 am

Immanuel Velikovsky wrote a very compelling theory in 1950 called "Worlds in Collision"

The problem is ,according to Velikovsky ,that the event took place only some 3500 years ago, since he based his theory on the Myths and legends of many diverse cultural groups.

The theory being that first Earth had a close encounter with the Planet we now call Venus and then another close encounter with the planet we call Mars

It would seem that if such an event took place it would have been at a far more distant time - before Homo Sapiens. If so what is the evidence ?
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby Jatslo » Wed Apr 30, 2014 1:21 pm

Are you saying that the changing magnetic field of Mars created two oppositely charged-like electrodes on the surface that were at each end of Valles Marinersis? Then the discharge between the two electrodes created sputtering and the canyon. So then the magnetic field strength was almost removed causing Mars to lose its magnetosphere or shield to prevent loss of atmosphere? What was the trigger for such an event? And, what primordial magnetic field strength is powerful enough to cause such an upheaval?

The problem with any postulated event is that a sequence of certain processes before and after are necessary to make the event a possibility.


I made an educated guess based on my research; a secondary researcher. In that sense, I do have evidence; however, your initial post ask for conjecture, speculation and ideas, which I gave. Furthermore, I don't think you quite grasped exactly what I intended to convey, but that's okay. I appreciate your attempt. If I were to weight the two options; yours against mine, I would say that my idea has a higher chance of holding up.

If I have time, I'll dig up some peer reviewed evidence from my University's library, but don't hold your breath, because I'm very busy. I'm actually here at the request of a friend who I used to post with many years ago. We were part of a debate team, which was fun.

Anyway, I'll Enjoy speaking with you all as I have time,

~ CHEERS
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby Sparky » Thu May 01, 2014 9:16 am

"It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong."
"Doubt is not an agreeable condition, but certainty is an absurd one."
"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby viscount aero » Fri May 02, 2014 1:30 pm

I agree that the Vallis was excavated. There is evidence for it all over the planet in vast boulder fields (the ejecta) and perhaps even the moons Phobos and Deimos.

Taking a scalable cue from comets (which directly interact with electrical potentials), the body which encountered Mars must have nearly touched it, being at least as close as Earth's Moon to the planet (250k miles), but probably unbelievably closer (within a few hundred kms and within the Martian atmospheric boundary). But this had to be a rogue body coming in to the Martian vicinity at high velocity and angle relative to Mars. In other words the rogue body didn't stay long. It "strafed" the planet. This is why the scar is relatively linear and highly localized.

Moreover, the excavation event required the rock be pushed out inasmuch as it was sucked out. Therefore there was an anode/cathode structure as seen in terrestrial lightning whereby a "leader" on the ground searches skyward for the incoming lightning bolt. This ground leader on Mars was what pushed the rock out and formed the Vallis.

I also see this as having happened very rapidly like a tsunami--within minutes Mars was destroyed. As for the intruder planet or body: that is long gone and left no evidence of its passing, save for guessing that the Vallis is such a consequence.

Mars may also be like Io.

It may have been a satellite of one of the Jovian planets whereby it was caught in that planet's radiation torus, pummeled into constant oblivion by this process as is Io. The alleged "volcano" calderas on Mars are more like structures seen on Io than observed in Earthly caldera. The Tharsis region of Mars with its requisite "caldera" does not at all resemble volcano remnants. They appear more like raised nodes than ancient magma domes. Notice that Olympus Mons is more a plateau and less a volcano--a structure that was "pulled" up, like a big round peg (whereas a magma/lava structure is more vertically conical and has gradual tapering).
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby SirWilhelm » Fri May 02, 2014 8:00 pm

Zecharia Sitchin wrote the 12th Planet. The ancient's term for planet, included the Moon and the Sun, hence, those, plus the nine planets we know of, plus the one we can't see, makes 12 planets. The 12th planet was a wandering planet that was captured by the Solar System during it's formation. It had an orbit like a comet's, with a period of 3,600 years. During it's passage through the System circa 10,500 BCE, it passed between the Earth and Mars. Fortunately for Earth, it passed closer to Mars. This planet is the size of Uranus/Neptune. Like the comets, with it's similar orbit, it can be assumed it becomes charged, commensurate with it's size, and speed. The evidence of it's existence, is mostly from a Sumerian text, the Enumma Elish, but there are also engravings depicting it as a celestial body that could be seen in daylight. It was said to give off it's own light, a dark reddish glow, like a dark star. Although it passed closer to Mars, Earth bears many scars from it's passage, and it nearly wiped out life on Earth. There is evidence that it's 3,600 year orbit was altered by it's close encounters with Earth and Mars, so that it's period was shortened. Sitchin calculated that it's next passage would be circa 2060 AD. Those fortunate to be alive at that time, will find out if it is real, or not. In the meantime, those with the expertise, can try to calculate, if it's presence fits the cause of the damage on Mars. Much of the damage on Earth, has been altered by erosion.
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby nick c » Sat May 03, 2014 8:24 am

Hi Sir Wilhelm,
We do not want to get into any discussion of the interpretation of Sumerian myth on the "Electric Universe - Planetary Science" board, other then a passing mention.

Many within the Thunderbolts team do think that the electrical forces necessary to excavate large canyons such as Valles Marineris or craters such as Tycho and Copernicus (on the Moon) are not present today but were in operation in the not to distant past. And that a comparative analysis of world myths can point toward the celestial agents responsible. That being said, the TB team does not agree with Stitchin's analysis of Sumerian myth. They offer explanations of those Sumerian sources without resorting to any references to ET intervention.

Anyway, we want to keep the focus on this thread on the "Planetary Science" board limited to the possible physical mechanisms (electrical or otherwise) that went into the creation of Valles Marineris.

If you have any questions feel free to contact me via PM.
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby dougettinger » Mon May 12, 2014 7:52 am

Addressing Nick, Sir Wilhelm, and Bomb20 comments:

Bomb20 very appropriately listed the possibilities for a close encounter between a sizable cosmic body and Mars. Then in a scientific inquiry one tries to eliminate some of these choices to narrow down the selection. Then the search for the culprit becomes easier and more focused.

Sir Wilhelm merely expanded on one of the possibilities listed by Bomb20 - that of a collision of two solar systems of which one could be the predicted Proto-Saturn system. However, Sir Wilhelm suggested another system of either a Planet X with its own moons or a Nemesis star with its own planets orbiting the Sun. This Nemesis star could very likely be a very dim, undetectable brown or red dwarf star. Dwarf stars are known to be magnetic and highly active. Such a star passing between Mars and Jupiter could be a plausible candidate to cause Valles Marinersis.

Moderator, Nick, smacked down Sir Wilhelm for mentioning the author Zecharia Sitchin because of his suggestion of a cosmic body that orbits the Sun with a long period and passes through the inner solar system. I am sure Sitchin has many errors in his interpretations, but nevertheless, has proposed some good ideas that cannot be discounted. If one is trying to be an honest scientist, one must be very careful not to have certain prejudice creep into their thinking whether they work for NASA supporting the standard model or they work for the Thunderbolts Project supporting the proto-Saturn system.

Personally, the Sun's orbiting brown dwarf concept makes more sense than the polar aligned proto-Saturn system for both electromagnetic and gravitational reasons. And, current astronomical observations certainly support the existence of both orbiting brown dwarfs around other stars and dwarf stars with planets.

Being careful to avoid entrenchment in any thinking,
Doug Ettinger
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby dougettinger » Tue May 13, 2014 11:29 am

Hello Nick,

I apologize for possibly offending you about the "smacking". Let me reply in another way. Sir Wilhelm listed some possibilities for a close encounter with Mars that may have caused Valles Marinersis. Which possibilities do you think are the major contenders and why?

Always a respectful student,
Doug Ettinger
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby Sparky » Tue May 13, 2014 1:54 pm

Doug, me thinks that Nick is on vacation.... ;)

Mars appears to have been hit by electric discharges. Either at birth or by some close encounter. I can't get anymore specific than that. There are those who will.. ;)
"It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong."
"Doubt is not an agreeable condition, but certainty is an absurd one."
"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby Bomb20 » Wed May 14, 2014 3:42 am

If I understood correct then The Thunderbolts think that we see results of one single process that re-shaped the whole Mars rather recently!

The excavation of Valles Marineris is only one part - maybe the last big event - in a series of events connected with each other in this huge process which also created the difference between the northern and the southern hemisphere of Mars in general.

I mean if we are not alternatively assuming that Mars was born with so different hemispheres or that Mars experinced already a re-shaping by an earlier separated and longer lasting event then we have to assume that the excavation of Valles Marineris was (maybe the last?) part of a huge scenario of planetary unrest.

You see what I mean if you look at the 3rd and 4th picture in the following link
http://www.holoscience.com/wp/spiral-galaxies-grand-canyons/

and at some global maps of Mars here:
http://marsoweb.nas.nasa.gov/globalData/datamaps.html

So, the excavation of Valles Marineris could have lasted a short time but the whole process must have been a longer-lasting in comparison.
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby dougettinger » Wed May 14, 2014 5:46 am

Hello Sparky,

Yes, Nick is probably on vacation. Thanks for coming to my rescue. I thought that maybe I lost my tenure at Nick's University.

Mars appears to have been hit by electric discharges. Either at birth or by some close encounter. I can't get anymore specific than that. There are those who will..

I cannot conceive how two different hemispheres would be created at birth. Both Valles Marinersis and the lower -altitude hemisphere were created by electric discharges after Mars was created. The only answer that I can propose is that these two features were created at two different times.

Always a student,
Doug Ettinger
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby dougettinger » Thu May 15, 2014 11:52 am

Hello Sparky and Nick and others,

Has any plasma lab experiment been performed to simulate the complete layer removal of a rounded surface as is demonstrated by the two different hemispheres on Mars?

Always a student,
Doug Ettinger
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Looking for Nick?
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby viscount aero » Fri May 16, 2014 1:53 am

dougettinger wrote:Hello Sparky and Nick and others,

Has any plasma lab experiment been performed to simulate the complete layer removal of a rounded surface as is demonstrated by the two different hemispheres on Mars?

Always a student,
Doug Ettinger
Pittsburgh, PA

Looking for Nick?


I'm not Nick, but to my knowledge, no.

The process for global excavation is unknown. It may not have happened. But the hemispheres of Mars present a picture of two different planets in one. The north nearly doesn't resemble whatsoever the southern hemisphere in appearance or in general height above the baseline. It is as if most of the planet's cratering has been removed from the northern hemisphere.

This presents a problem for EU actually. The southern hemisphere is heavily cratered. Therefore IF the northern plains were once covered with craters then "crater dating" is to some extent a valid dating method--relative to adjacent terrain. It would mean that the southern hemisphere's surface is older than the north.

This leads to the big question as to why. And how did this process happen?

However if catastrophism is a valid phenomenon then Mars is one of the biggest "tragedies" ever seen. Virtually its entire surface shows evidence for massive cataclysm. If it ever had water, thicker air, or life then it was overly destroyed. Mars is a site of terrible disaster.
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Re: Type of close encounter to cause Valles Marineris on Mar

Unread postby Sparky » Fri May 16, 2014 6:14 am

:D Isn't there a theory that Mercury was the core of Mars, which got sucked out.. :?
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