Electric Nature

Historic planetary instability and catastrophe. Evidence for electrical scarring on planets and moons. Electrical events in today's solar system. Electric Earth.

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Re: Comets and the plague ?

Unread postby bboyer » Sat Feb 07, 2009 8:45 pm

Ran across this while looking for something else. I'd imagine the relationship to comets and sun is similar, particularly with regard to solar electrical and magnetic fields such as Io relates to Jupiter's.

Io's Sodium Clouds

cloudfigm.gif

(click for larger view)

There are several processes which eject atoms and molecules from Io's atmosphere. The sodium clouds, which are the most easily oberved consequences of atmospheric escape, are formed primarily by two types of ejection processes: (1) atmospheric sputtering forms the banana cloud, and (2) pickup ion neutralization forms the stream and jet. Some of the sputtered sodium and nearly all of the stream and jet sodium is ejected entirely from the Jupiter system, forming the huge sodium nebula around Jupiter.

# Banana cloud. Atmospheric sputtering ejects sodium atoms from Io in all directions and at relatively low speeds. These atoms end up in orbits similar to Io's, and gradually spread out along Io's orbit both ahead of and behind Io. Those atoms trailing Io also orbit at a slightly larger distance from Jupiter, placing them in the least hospitable portion of Jupiter's plasma torus. As a result, they are quickly ionized and incorporated into the torus, which cannot be seen in these images of sodium emission. The atoms orbiting ahead of Io, however, orbit closer to Jupiter, where there is relatively little plasma to ionize them. As a result, they spread out to relatively large distances ahead of Io in its orbit. The resulting banana cloud thus extends primarily ahead of Io and slightly inside of Io's orbital distance.

# Stream. The stream is formed by a two-step process: (1) molecular ions containing sodium are ripped out of Io's atmosphere by the electric and magnetic fields of Jupiter's magnetosphere and picked up into the plasma torus, then (2) over the course of several hours, these molecular ions dissociatively recombine with electrons, releasing sodium atoms which are visible in these images of sodium emission. The molecular ions which spawn the sodium atoms are invisible in these images, so it looks as if the sodium atoms are magically appearing in the torus. The magnetic and electric fields have no influence on neutral particles, so the new sodium atoms find themselves free to zoom away from Jupiter at high speed, and into the nebula which surrounds Jupiter. Visually, the stream looks like a long fuzzy "rope" of sodium atoms leading Io that flaps up and down. This flapping motion is the result of the recently-escaped pickup ions oscillating north and south along Jupiter's magnetic field lines. The sodium atoms being created by the ions reflect the locations and velocities of their parent ions.

# Jet. The jet is very similar to the stream, the main difference being how long it takes the ions to recombine and relase sodium atoms. The jet is formed by ions which recombine only seconds after leaving the densest regions of Io's atmosphere, compared with hours for the stream. These "fresh" pickup ions move in tight circles perpedicular to the magnetic field, so the sodium atoms that are produced by their recombination fly out into a flat, disk-shaped region, the orientation of which depends on Io's changing magnetic longitude relative to Jupiter. As the hours go by, the magnetic field orientation at Io changes, and so does the orientation of the Jet. The ions in Io's ionosphere escape from the side of Io facing away from Jupiter, so the jet points away from Jupiter as well. There is no jet pointing towards Jupiter.

http://deep-red.bu.edu/model/io/cloudescr.html
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Re: Comets and the plague ?

Unread postby bboyer » Sat Feb 07, 2009 9:57 pm

bdw000 wrote:Just found this very interesting article on the plague of 1347-50 being caused by a comet (or something):

http://www.sott.net/articles/show/145683-New-Light-on-the-Black-Death-The-Cosmic-Connection

It's a review of a book by a tree ring specialist. Something about ammonium in ice cores AND tree rings.

Looks to me like something the comet specialists here would want to check out.


From the referenced page,

Cohn also points out that while the identification of the disease as having buboes relies on the account of Boccaccio and others, they described buboes, abscesses, rashes and carbuncles occurring all over the body, while the modern disease rarely has more than one bubo, most commonly in the groin, and is not characterized by abscesses, rashes and carbuncles which is what Boccaccio described!


I was responding to a post in the NIAMI section about Earth magnetic pole reversals and was wondering about CME's; and I recalled this thread. Anyways, just wondering if perhaps a near-direct encounter with a major CME should be considered in this scenario. Seems like the extreme radiation exposure would account for the various described symptoms above.


November 2005

Dangerous Solar Storms

According to space weather theory - soon to be revised - this is how a proton storm develops:

It begins with an explosion, usually above a sunspot. Sunspots are places where strong magnetic fields poke through the surface of the sun. For reasons no one completely understands, these fields can become unstable and explode, unleashing as much energy as 10 billion hydrogen bombs.

From Earth we see a flash of light and X-rays. This is the "solar flare," and it's the first sign that an explosion has occurred. Light from the flare reaches Earth in only 8 minutes. High energy protons can follow in another ten to twenty minutes, although sometimes they take longer.

The Jan. 20 proton storm was by some measures the biggest since 1989. It was particularly rich in high-speed protons packing more than 100 million electron volts (100 MeV) of energy. Such protons can burrow through 11 centimeters of water. A thin-skinned spacesuit would have offered little resistance.

Astronauts on the International Space Station (ISS), however, were safe. The ISS is heavily shielded, plus the station orbits Earth inside our planet's protective magnetic field. "The crew probably absorbed no more than 1 rem," said Francis Cucinotta, NASA's radiation health officer at the Johnson Space Center.

One rem, short for Roentgen Equivalent Man, is the radiation dose that causes the same injury to human tissue as 1 roentgen of x-rays. A typical diagnostic CAT scan, the kind you might get to check for tumors, delivers about 1 rem. So for the crew of the ISS, the Jan. 20 proton storm was no worse than a trip to the doctor on Earth.

On the moon, Cucinotta estimates, an astronaut protected by no more than a space suit would have absorbed about 50 rem of ionizing radiation. That's enough to cause radiation sickness. "But it would not have been fatal," he adds.

To die, you'd need to suddenly absorb 300 rem or more.

The key word is suddenly. You can get 300 rem spread out over a number of days or weeks with little effect. Spreading the dose gives the body time to repair and replace its own damaged cells. But if that 300 rem comes all at once, "we estimate that 50 percent of people exposed would die within 60 days without medical care," said Cucinotta.

http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/stere ... nauts.html



So far I haven't come across anything that indicates we have any modern record or history of a direct encounter with a head-on class X CME event. Wonder if anyone has examined any of the remains of that era for whatever traces of radiation sickness might be present.
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Re: Comets and the plague ?

Unread postby seasmith » Tue Feb 10, 2009 8:23 pm

~
Track Comet Lulin

http://www.aerith.net/comet/catalog/2007N3/2007N3.html

On the night of Feb. 23 (as it nears its closest point to Earth), Comet Lulin rises in the east around 8 p.m., just two degrees from Saturn, making the comet easy to locate.

Oddly, Comet Lulin's orbit carries it around the sun in the direction opposite to that of the planets and other objects of the solar system.


http://www.mlive.com/living/bay-city/index.ssf/2009/02/comet_lulin_makes_a_flyby_this.html
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Re: Comets and the plague ?

Unread postby Grey Cloud » Wed Feb 11, 2009 3:05 pm

Hi Seasmith,
Thanks for the Lulin update.
Looking at the image on the first link, it seems that the comet passed across the galactic centre last August.
No doubt you are plotting its trajectory using Pharoanic mathematics. :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Comets and the plague ?

Unread postby Grey Cloud » Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:21 pm

Hi Arc-us,
An interesting bit of speculation regarding the radiation poisoning. However I don't think this is the cause as these plagues were a regular occurance and their spread has been fairly well documented both by those contemporary with them and modern 'experts'. Also I would have thought that extreme doses of radiation would have affected the flora and fauna as well as humans? I can't recall ever having read of any mysterious die-offs of plants and animals in history.
The wiki article does a pretty good job of accounting for the variable symptons:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Death
I would be interested in anything you come up with regarding the CMEs as it is something which has been lurking around the back of my mind for some time.
If I have the least bit of knowledge
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Re: Comets and the plague ?

Unread postby Grey Cloud » Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:34 pm

bdw000 wrote:Just found this very interesting article on the plague of 1347-50 being caused by a comet (or something):
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/145683-New-Light-on-the-Black-Death-The-Cosmic-Connection
It's a review of a book by a tree ring specialist. Something about ammonium in ice cores AND tree rings.
Looks to me like something the comet specialists here would want to check out.

Hi bdw000,
You might want to have a read of these:
Baillie's name cropped up in this thread:
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=1026&p=15085&hilit=Baillie#p15085
I did a Google on him but couldn't find anything written by him on the web (typical of British academics).

Clube and Napier: Coherent Catastrophism
http://www.pibburns.com/catastro/clubenap.htm

A cosmic trail with destruction in its wake
http://abob.libs.uga.edu/bobk/clube90.html
There are links to a couple of related articles at the foot of this page.
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Re: Comets and the plague ?

Unread postby seasmith » Wed Feb 11, 2009 6:50 pm

Image

I may be reading it wrong, but this NASA/JPL site makes it look like Lulin passes between the orbits of Mars and Earth;
tho maybe not in the same plane ?

http://ssd.jpl.nasa.gov/sbdb.cgi?sstr=2007+N3&orb=1
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Re: Comets and the plague ?

Unread postby Grey Cloud » Thu Feb 12, 2009 5:00 am

Hi Seasmith,
For what it's worth, I read it the same way as you. I hope it is on a different plane as would appear to intersect Mars' orbit twice.
I'm also wondering why Lulin's trajectory appears to dog-leg several times.

Does anyone know if the EU team have made any predictions / comments about this comet. Or could anyone say what the EU theory predicts/ expects such comets to do, if only in general terms? Will it pass through the solar system unmolested or will it get zapped by the Sun etc?
If I have the least bit of knowledge
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Re: Comets and the plague ?

Unread postby Steve Smith » Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:17 am

One of the tenets of EU theory is that comets, meteors and asteroids could be relatively new members of the Solar System. The close approach to Mars is interesting, since several objects might have been blasted out of its surface by planet-sized lightning bolts. Phobos and Deimos, for instance, look more like asteroids ("dead comets," as I heard one astrophysicist describe them).

The dog-leg is an artifact of the animation tools generated from the ephemeris.

Comet Lulin will most likely pass out of the Solar System, never to be seen again, unless it encounters some force that bends its trajectory into something non-parabolic. It's going to stay pretty far from the Sun, so those influences won't be as dramatic as those that destroyed Comet Linear, for example.

Lulin did experience an "ion tail disconnection event" recently:

Comet Lulin
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Re: Comets and the plague ?

Unread postby StefanR » Thu Feb 12, 2009 11:21 am

In this Sky at Night-episode "The sun revealed" is talked about comets and their tales for a short while but it gives some beautiful images from several probes studying the sun. The sequence mentioned starts around 16.15 min.
What triggered me back then watching the episode was the viewing of the disconnect-event and also what is said in relation to Ullyses and the lenght of comet tails at about 17.25 min.
I will not be a spoiler ;)

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8612090398172483117

Have fun!
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Re: Comets and the plague ?

Unread postby Steve Smith » Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:41 pm

That was a very informative program. The host is such a stereotype, eh? Right down to the monocle...

I won't spoil it, either. I still enjoy watching science programs, like Nova and Science Frontiers, or Quest. It's becoming difficult to listen to them, though.
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Re: Comets and the plague ?

Unread postby Steve Smith » Sun Feb 15, 2009 11:26 pm

Comet Lulin will be at its brightest in dark eastern skies on February 24th:

Image

With a good pair of binoculars, the motion against background stars could be visible...
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Shrimp found far below the Antarctic ice

Unread postby Siggy_G » Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:01 am

http://www.nasa.gov/topics/earth/features/antarctic-shrimp.html

So it seems that larger organisms (not just microbes) can live not just far below the ice and sunlight, but also 12.5 miles from open water (where's the sinking remnants/food for scavenging creatures?). It points further to the possibilities for extra terrestrial life forms, even within our solar system.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europa_(moon)#Potential_for_extraterrestrial_life

Perhaps it also indicates that other energies are vital for triggering and sustaining life...
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Re: Shrimp found far below the Antarctic ice

Unread postby MrAmsterdam » Thu Mar 18, 2010 8:50 am

Siggy_G wrote:http://www.nasa.gov/topics/earth/featur ... hrimp.html

Perhaps it also indicates that other energies are vital for triggering and sustaining life...


From the article;

But for a group of glaciologists, a familiar face was the last thing they expected to see below the ice and so far from the open ocean. "We thought we were just going into a deep, dark cold water hole and never anticipated we'd see any life," Bindshadler added. "The color was what caught our eyes."


Again the textbooks are underestimating the force of life.

Question to you; what kind of ernergies do you suggest ?
Today's scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality. -Nikola Tesla -1934
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Re: Shrimp found far below the Antarctic ice

Unread postby Siggy_G » Thu Mar 18, 2010 4:12 pm

MrAmsterdam wrote:Question to you; what kind of ernergies do you suggest ?


It is just curious that life forms can sustain practically without sunlight (i.e. the Sun isn't directly vital). Perhaps energies more internal / Earth related can be a driving factor. The seabed can release heat, but perhaps also electrical discharges, that may trigger organic molecular structures and hence life forms, like in a recent TPOD: http://thunderbolts.info/tpod/2010/arch10/100309frankencomet.htm Perhaps even within shorter time frames than those we're used to hear about. Early thoughts on the subject...
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