Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

[starbiter]

Unfortunately this computer denies access to anything google...( i am visiting friends )
I am sure "protuberance" is not a geophysical term but merely a description of these towering
features..."Twin Sisters" and "Forsyth rock" are on Magnolia Mtn. just south of the canyon.
Now I am picturing these twins being electro-deposited by a helical vortex of plasma.
Also, I don't deny the floods power in excavating the debris from the canyon, the Boulder Creek
valley below appears to have been victim of an intense flow that washed towards the east.
What about the Boulder Flatirons ? Vertical red sandstone ? And also the local Dakota Ridge
and associated "hogbacks" along the front range...I think limestone...soft coal was mined here.
A lot of unusual features and the Continental Divide ! Coincidence ?

The Flatirons and associated hogbacks all seem to be reverse dunes. I believe they start at a shoreline.

http://goo.gl/maps/NZLbG

http://goo.gl/maps/jYNTT The Grand Hogback

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web I 70 looking West.

michael

[promethean]

The Flatirons and associated hogbacks all seem to be reverse dunes. I believe they start at a shoreline.

michael

I had to review this thread to find "reverse duning" ...of course starting at the beginning !
Now I see the directional element in this concept, and the idea that a combination of this
process with an INTERNAL expansion of earth to cause folding as well...the energy for both
provided by the plasma streams.WOW! This all makes way too much sense !!!
But,the shoreline you hypothesized...why ?
Is it necessary for the limestone,sandstone,lignite formations ?

[starbiter]

I've only seen one formation that seems to be folded. That's the rim of Meteor Crater. Everything else seems to be the result of blowing material. In the midst of all this was a great flood caused by a number of factors. The blowing material wasn't dry sand. Dry sand makes sand dunes. The process described in legend would have the material either wet or molten. Beyond hurricane conditions that build to glow mode plasma. When this condition increases an arc seems to follow. If You zoom into the Grand Hogback photo the layers go from dirt to rocky conglomerate to solid rock, going from right to left.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

The material seems to have blown in from the left, growing in layers. This is the opposite of duning. The material sticks to the windward side because it's either wet, conglomerate, or molten. Many many mountains are composed of conglomerate. It's just the cliffs and canyons that are rock, to quite a depth. The Maroon Bells, and Sangre de Cristo Mountains of CO are known as bad places to climb because of this. The search and rescue people in Fraser CO refer to their work as search and recover because of this conglomerate issue.

The process seems to be accentuated by large diaocotron instabilities concentrating the material rapidly. If You read back a few pages on this thread You'll find this discussed.

http://www.eu-geology.com/wp-content/up ... vortex.pdf

http://www.eu-geology.com/

If the area East of the Flatirons was dry during the process the Flatirons would be farther E. The rocks fall into the water but the smaller material is suspended over water until it hits an obstacle. Think Flatirons as beach. The wind was from the E. From the looks of the layers of the Flatirons it appears much of the material was red-hot and molten.

https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ie=U ... 6,78.433,0

http://www.eu-geology.com/?page_id=223

Experiments are in the works to use different materials in a spray process to see if this is possible. Pinnacles would be a great result. Gunite, Spackle and other coating processes are proposed on different starting shapes and angles. It would be nice to heat the material to glowing if anyone has an idea.


https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web


A result like these above would be cool.

Please let us know if You see this driving through the Flatirons. The drainages coming down the mountain prevented the canyons by washing away the smaller material while the reverse duning was happening.

michael

[starbiter]

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web


The image above is next to a river. The river has undercut the formation revealing the interior like a road cut. The process that appears to have zapped the formation might also be a factor in the visibility. Please click on file, then download to zoom in greatly.

http://goo.gl/maps/4L4rx Looking S from 16.

The highest layers seem rather normal. I see the wind from the left with reverse duning growing to the left into the wind. There is some discoloration and what appears to be the beginning of the metamorphic process, but the layers are fairly even. There is a horizontal line with a large tree below the peak. Below there the metamorphic process seems to take off. The material seems molten and foliated, and the layering is distorted. This formation provides an inside look at the in situ process of electrical metamorphic rock production, IMHO.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

I'm now more confident that the darkened material is metamorphic. If i'm mistaken i would appreciate correction. If the darkened material that connects directly to the unchanged layers above is metamorphic and the connected layers aren't metamorphic i'd like to hear a normal geology explanation. This formation might disprove the entire metamorphic process being taught at every university and college in the world. I think this formation requires a class of geology students crawling all over it.

http://goo.gl/maps/ayAyY

The map above shows the formation is a hogback. It appears to me the formation grew at the waterline, towards the water.

michael

[starbiter]

A piece of cardboard 7" long and 2" wide was placed at a 45 degree angle. Oil based Homax wall texture was sprayed onto the cardboard. The heavy spray setting was used. The angle of application was from horizontal to 20 degrees.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

The image shows the thickness of the cardboard. The material flew past the cardboard leaving the holes open. The material grew back and up. The texture is 3/4" higher than the top of the cardboard.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

The texture is about 1" thick.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

The texture repeated the original angle of the cardboard.

The experiment required two aerosol cans of texture. One can was 20 OZ. The other 25 OZ. I waited a few minutes between coatings. Anyone can repeat this. With a spray system the color of the material can be changed. The results might look like the following.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web Sleeping Woman Mountain/Frenchman mountain, Las Vegas

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web A mountain in Death Valley.

michael

[promethean]

I am still unable to see any google maps or photos due to this machines ill health, but re:

I've only seen one formation that seems to be folded. That's the rim of Meteor Crater. Everything else seems to be the result of blowing material. In the midst of all this was a great flood caused by a number of factors. The blowing material wasn't dry sand. Dry sand makes sand dunes. The process described in legend would have the material either wet or molten. Beyond hurricane conditions that build to glow mode plasma. When this condition increases an arc seems to follow.

michael

This concept required a major brain rewiring , but I think I get it now. Thanks.

[kiwi]

Hi Michael

Have you caught up with the latest release yet?

Published on Apr 16, 2013
Here Paul Anderson, PhD., presents new evidence for an electrical interpretation of unique ravine formations on the Earth.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7w1rGeqXBg


Cheers mate

[starbiter]

Hi Michael

Have you caught up with the latest release yet?

Published on Apr 16, 2013
Here Paul Anderson, PhD., presents new evidence for an electrical interpretation of unique ravine formations on the Earth.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7w1rGeqXBg


Cheers mate

Hi Kiwi,

Thanks for the link. I'm familiar with Dr Anderson's talk. I photographed it. I consider Paul a good friend. He consults with me on experiments to create granitic and metamorphic rock using an arc, created by welding equipment.

I have been looking at the SW region of the USA for five years. I expected to see electrical scarring responsible for canyons. The Grand Canyon in particular. Instead on electrical canyon formation, it became apparent water was the main factor in creating/preventing canyons. Every canyon i've come across seems to be at the lowest point. This might be because electricity seeks the lowest point. I certainly see electricity blackening and bubbling surfaces. In many cases the electricity seems to produce metamorphic rock. But not canyons.

The link below is to a recent TPOD. Wal Thornhill makes an excellent point concerning electrical scarring.

http://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/2013/01 ... strange-2/

" Wal Thornhill predicted that a close examination of the images would demonstrate that the channels go uphill and downhill – not like the action of a moving stream that would always be downhill. In reality what we see on Titan are examples of “sinuous rilles” and are the result of electric discharges."

me again,

The image below is what i would expect from an electrical event.

http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/images/20 ... 05_cut.jpg

http://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/2013/01 ... cal-scars/

This isn't what i see in the field. Rivers seem to always go downhill. It appears that mountains grow up around the drainage. While dust, sand, gravel, rocks, and boulders accumulate on dry land, the drainage removes all but the largest rocks and boulders.

My post from Aug 27, 2012 in the link below describes the Grand Canyon formation.

http://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/forum/phpB ... &start=900

The drainages below have one thing in common. They all go down hill. If You follow the drainages uphill they all stop at the high point. If they were electrical i'd expect them to continue past the high point.

http://goo.gl/maps/Eiysd

It wouldn't be surprising to find electrically produced canyons on Earth as proposed by Dr Anderson. I'll keep looking.

michael

[GaryN]

The drainages below have one thing in common. They all go down hill. If You follow the drainages uphill they all stop at the high point. If they were electrical i'd expect them to continue past the high point.

I'm not following you here Michael. If their was to be a strong vertical electric field, then discharge is from the lowest region to the highest, why would an electrical event continue beyond the highest point? With an electrostatic model, then horizontally seperated patches of differing surface charge could cause a discharge channel that might go over an area of higher elevation, but I haven't seen that kind of effect on Earth. On the Moon, yes.

Rima Ariadaeus. That's a graben according to geologists, but I'd say a horizontal charge flow.

[starbiter]

Hi Gary,

I was going to post the image You just posted. It's a great example of an electric rille. It goes up and over obstructions. Water would go around obstructions. This implies that electrical erosion would go beyond high points.


The patterns I posted earlier from AZ get smaller as you approach the ridge. Water would be expected to do this. Electricity not so much.

michael

[starbiter]

Hi again Gary,

If the Grand Canyon was created by an electrical event the canyon would need to be carved by an event that went up and through the mountain. And the canyon at the bottom is so even it's navigable. Whale boats went down the river years ago. Steamships traveled up the river N of Las Vegas prior to the dams. There aren't any waterfalls. I'd expect waterfalls and lakes if the river was a thunderbot scar.

If the river was always there then flatness would be expected.

michael

[CuriousCat]

The posts about the Flatirons and the Hogback caught my attention, as did the mention of coal. My family worked the mines in Wyoming and Utah, and some relatives at a slight remove, genealogically speaking, worked the mines in the Louisville and Lafayette area. What I was taught in school, says that Colorado was seabed at one time, and also that the San Luis Valley is an ancient lake bed. I know from experience, that the San Luis Valley has a different "feel" to it for some people. As for Meteor Crater, I was just awed and amazed. I found myself trying to imagine the event that produced it. I was not successful. I need to ponder all of this.

Cat

[starbiter]

The posts about the Flatirons and the Hogback caught my attention, as did the mention of coal. My family worked the mines in Wyoming and Utah, and some relatives at a slight remove, genealogically speaking, worked the mines in the Louisville and Lafayette area. What I was taught in school, says that Colorado was seabed at one time, and also that the San Luis Valley is an ancient lake bed. I know from experience, that the San Luis Valley has a different "feel" to it for some people. As for Meteor Crater, I was just awed and amazed. I found myself trying to imagine the event that produced it. I was not successful. I need to ponder all of this.

Cat

Hello CuriousCat,

The linked image below shows a road cut just N of Helper UT.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... lQNHM/edit


http://goo.gl/maps/j7JOP

I believe the dark layers are coal. Originally i though the formation was fluvial caused by a slosh from the equator. Now i'm leaning towards molten dust from above. The ingredients are available from comet dust. Comets are rich in carbon and hydrocarbons.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11539150


The upper right hand side of the following image shows a similar pattern. It appears the wind would have been from the right.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... YtZUU/edit

http://goo.gl/maps/q8T65

The area has an estimated 8,000 million tons of coal.

http://pubs.usgs.gov/bul/0371/report.pdf

"Since a cubic foot of coal of 1.3 specific gravity weighs 81.25 pounds,
and a square mile of such coal 1 foot thick contains 1,132,560 short
tons, on the above assumption the total amount is more than 8,000
million tons. These figures have little value beyond forcibly expressing
the fact that there is here an immense coal reserve."

michael

[GaryN]

Hi again Gary,

If the Grand Canyon was created by an electrical event the canyon would need to be carved by an event that went up and through the mountain. And the canyon at the bottom is so even it's navigable. Whale boats went down the river years ago. Steamships traveled up the river N of Las Vegas prior to the dams. There aren't any waterfalls. I'd expect waterfalls and lakes if the river was a thunderbot scar.

If the river was always there then flatness would be expected.

Good point Michael, and it makes me now consider not just the processes involved, but the order in which they occurred. The major shaping of the land, and cutting of the valleys would be much simpler if they were formed when the surface was very soft or loose, so duning by wind (electric?) or water, and then a force to 'cook' the land form, sandstone lower down, granite, basalt on top. I don't care how big a flood was, or how many hundreds of millions of years they want to use for the cutting of river and stream beds, I don't think it would happen if the land was as hard as granite. If it was soft, I'd buy it, though even in a sandy bed, the flow soon becomes laminar and no further, or perhaps some very minor, deepening or widening can occur. The tearing out of the stream and creek beds, at least in my area, would seem to have been the last stage, as all the dust and gravel and rocks are still in and up the sides of the valleys, meaning they weren't washed away in a catastrophic flood that occurred after their production. Just a suggestion.

[starbiter]

Hi again Gary,

If the Grand Canyon was created by an electrical event the canyon would need to be carved by an event that went up and through the mountain. And the canyon at the bottom is so even it's navigable. Whale boats went down the river years ago. Steamships traveled up the river N of Las Vegas prior to the dams. There aren't any waterfalls. I'd expect waterfalls and lakes if the river was a thunderbot scar.

If the river was always there then flatness would be expected.

Good point Michael, and it makes me now consider not just the processes involved, but the order in which they occurred. The major shaping of the land, and cutting of the valleys would be much simpler if they were formed when the surface was very soft or loose, so duning by wind (electric?) or water, and then a force to 'cook' the land form, sandstone lower down, granite, basalt on top. I don't care how big a flood was, or how many hundreds of millions of years they want to use for the cutting of river and stream beds, I don't think it would happen if the land was as hard as granite. If it was soft, I'd buy it, though even in a sandy bed, the flow soon becomes laminar and no further, or perhaps some very minor, deepening or widening can occur. The tearing out of the stream and creek beds, at least in my area, would seem to have been the last stage, as all the dust and gravel and rocks are still in and up the sides of the valleys, meaning they weren't washed away in a catastrophic flood that occurred after their production. Just a suggestion.

That's pretty much the way i see things. There were probably multiple events separated by varying lengths of time. The top layers of the Grand Canyon would be the end of the process. The Kayenta formation seems like a slosh. As the flood receded the material would be easily removed creating canyons.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kayenta_Formation

The navajo sandstone seems to be molten dust covering the Kayenta. If the area was still flooded the molten dust from the Navajo would fall into the moving water and be washed away. This left a cap of Navajo covering the Kayenta. This would be the end of deposition. The Navajo shows very little erosion. It probably looks similar to the day it was deposited.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Navajo_Sandstone

The Wingate is the same material as the Kayenta but appears to also be molten dust. The Wingate sits above the sloshed and duned Chinle, and below the sloshed Kayenta. The molten Wingate and sloshed Kayenta were probably happening in a similar time frame.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinle_Formation

As the waters returned to the equator the receding flood would clean out the drainages. The Grand Canyon has huge boulders that resisted being washed into the Sea of Cortez.

I hope this isn't confusing. Please let me know if this is gibberish.

michael