Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Historic planetary instability and catastrophe. Evidence for electrical scarring on planets and moons. Electrical events in today's solar system. Electric Earth.

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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby starbiter » Sun Jun 16, 2013 8:03 am

dahlenaz wrote:
dahlenaz wrote:These CRT features are similar to some martian features but not those
on the dunes in Matara Crater,, (the side-bar story). d...z

...


The Dry ice explanation is very convincing and elegant,,, science in action... d...z

...



Fortunately we already have Steve Smith's opinions below.

http://www.thunderbolts.info/tpod/2007/ ... rater3.htm

http://www.thunderbolts.info/tpod/2008/ ... ullies.htm

His position might have changed since the TPODs.

I have problems with the dry ice explanation. There are rilles on the Moon that go up and over hills, without dry ice.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:As10-31-4646.jpg

Why would the rilles all go in one direction? Why not into the crater" Why are the rilles so equal in size. If dry ice was the agent i'd expect greater variation in size.

https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&sit ... OY#imgrc=_

I still have an open mind about the rilles. Gravity seems to play a role in steering their direction. The answer might be dry ice. But in an Electric Universe, other options must be considered.

michael
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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby dahlenaz » Mon Jun 17, 2013 9:42 am

starbiter wrote:
dahlenaz wrote:
dahlenaz wrote:These CRT features are similar to some martian features but not those
on the dunes in Matara Crater,, (the side-bar story). d...z

...


The Dry ice explanation is very convincing and elegant,,, science in action... d...z

...



Fortunately we already have Steve Smith's opinions below.

http://www.thunderbolts.info/tpod/2007/ ... rater3.htm

http://www.thunderbolts.info/tpod/2008/ ... ullies.htm

His position might have changed since the TPODs.

michael


I don't see, in either of the two articles, any comments about dry ice block,, but in
one he does highlight the effect of beams of energy upon dry ice gas...
They are mostly critical of the fluid scenario and the
recent tpod does no better at presenting detailed evidence..

Without experiments to guide the way the scientific method is incomplete.
And referencing TPODs is far from convincing since they are more about talking
up the electric perspective than presenting comprehensive evidence. d...z

...
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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby starbiter » Sat Jul 06, 2013 2:41 pm

The image below might be a road cut, or rocky outcrop. I forget. Didn't really notice.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... JZMjg/edit

The location is in this neck of the woods.

http://goo.gl/maps/LYtyd

It seems to be granite with veins of quartz. The quartz appears to me to be an electrical remnant. I cant see how it would be deposited from above in this pattern. If the air was thickly choked with dust there might be a chance for something like this to form during deposition, as a thunderbolt was present. But i believe this pattern was formed in situ after deposition.

There are gold mines that have quartz veins that seem similar. The gold is often found in the quartz vein next to a layer of rhyolite. I thought the quartz and rhyolite were deposited from above in this pattern. Now i'm leaning towards a thunderbolt concentrating the material after deposition.

These veins are considered hydrothermal, requiring millions of years to form.

http://www.thestreet.com/story/11095299 ... osits.html

I can't see how the first image posted could be hydrothermal. Maybe none of the veins are hydrothermal. Maybe they a electrical remnants.

michael
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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby larryduane100 » Sat Jul 06, 2013 3:42 pm

Michael-This certainly looks like a thunderbolt. What would a mainstream geologist say about this one. Maybe a petrified tree root. This is a wonderful find for electrical geology(Electric Earth).
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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby starbiter » Tue Oct 15, 2013 7:48 am

The image below shows an area along the Deschutes river in Oregon.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

Below is the canyon on the right/East.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web


The image below is taken from the South looking North. The canyon to the East is on the right side of the image.

http://goo.gl/maps/s71wj

It's claimed by geologists that the basalt flowed across the canyon from volcanoes to the West, covering the surface.

The depth of the basalt is apparent in the image below.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

I'm looking West from the right side of the map below.

http://goo.gl/maps/m2xRI

If the Deschutes river was already there as the low point, the basalt would need to fill in the canyon caused by the river before being able to cover the East side. Then the river would need to erode a canyon of basalt to create what we find today. That would require the river to erode the path of greatest resistance, through solid basalt, in order to create the canyon.

On the other hand, if there was iron rich red hot dust in the air, it might cover both sides of the canyon with layers of basalt. This option isn't considered by geologists. Their only option for molten rock is a volcano, not a river of fire/plasma, while the air was choked with dust from comet Venus, or possibly Mars.
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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby starbiter » Tue Oct 15, 2013 8:38 am

The map below shows the confluence of three drainages in Oregon.

http://goo.gl/maps/iZ7Gr

The image below shows the East side of the Crooked river.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

In the map below i'm looking from left to right towards the East side of the river. The canyon wall is coverd with columnar basalt, supposedly from a flow from the South. Newberry volcano is considered the source for this basalt.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newberry_Volcano

http://goo.gl/maps/6Z8Cs

The image below shows the road coming into the canyon.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

The road cut shows that the columnar basalt is only surface deep. It covers horizontal sediment. It's difficult to imagine a flow of basalt causing this formation. On the other hand molten dust might spackel the side of the canyon.

The image below shows the basalt covering what appears to be horizontal sediment consistant with the sedimentology videos.


https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PVnBaqqQw8

Looking towards the East from Cove Palisades Park.

http://goo.gl/maps/tXgAR
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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby starbiter » Wed Oct 16, 2013 12:05 pm

Rocks other than basalt also seem to have a molten dust explanation. The image below shows layers of granite.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

http://goo.gl/maps/lwmMY Please zoom out and switch to terrain for perspective.

It appears to me the wind was from the left, choked with molten dust. As in a hurricane, the wind and current density might have oscillated, causing the layers. The electrical sorting process in this case seems to have produced external granite.

michael
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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby Robertus Maximus » Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:53 am

Does lightning erode mountains?

See: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 094026.htm

With increased erosion does this mean that Earth’s mountain ranges are a lot younger than traditionally thought?

Or perhaps this is evidence of past electrical discharge events on a much larger scale?

My own view is that Earth’s mountains formed recently (within the last 250,000 years?)during a planet shattering cataclysm. A disruption of Earth's rotation resulted in repeated ocean surges forming immense plateaus of sedimentary rock were the ocean waters met pre-existing land areas. These plateaus were then etched by huge electrical discharges leaving behind the typical Lichtenberg morphology we see in many mountain ranges today.

The process would have been similar to that suggested by Michael.
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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby GaryN » Thu Oct 17, 2013 12:58 pm

Interesting videos on stratification Michael. The whole accepted geological column dating may totally erroneous. I'm shocked. ;)

@Robertus Maximus
A disruption of Earth's rotation resulted in repeated ocean surges forming immense plateaus of sedimentary rock were the ocean waters met pre-existing land areas. These plateaus were then etched by huge electrical discharges leaving behind the typical Lichtenberg morphology we see in many mountain ranges today.


I'd wondered about the immense plateaus too, as the videos Michael linked too were only talking about water courses. The large plateaus would indeed have needed those large ocean surges, and I'll not say they were not possible, but I think, from an EU perspective, and from what I have seen locally in some gravel pits, the stratification could be from material falling from above, and not from a horizontal flow of particle laden water. If there were huge, billowing, turbulent clouds of material lofted by electrical excavation, then they may have been size sorted while in the air, and possibly have fallen in such a way as to produce the variations in thickness within those strata, as seen in some of the images Michael linked to, and in the deposits in my local gravel pits.
That off-world material may also have been deposited has to be considered, but most, I think, would be from the material excavated to form the canyons, rivers, etc. On Mars we seem the same stratification, with the deeply cut, sharply defined canyons, looking very much like Earthly mesas, but I'm far from convinced that such a sloshing oceans explanation for the large plateaus on Mars is applicable.
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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby starbiter » Thu Oct 17, 2013 5:57 pm

Robertus Maximus wrote:Does lightning erode mountains?

See: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 094026.htm

With increased erosion does this mean that Earth’s mountain ranges are a lot younger than traditionally thought?

Or perhaps this is evidence of past electrical discharge events on a much larger scale?

My own view is that Earth’s mountains formed recently (within the last 250,000 years?)during a planet shattering cataclysm. A disruption of Earth's rotation resulted in repeated ocean surges forming immense plateaus of sedimentary rock were the ocean waters met pre-existing land areas. These plateaus were then etched by huge electrical discharges leaving behind the typical Lichtenberg morphology we see in many mountain ranges today.

The process would have been similar to that suggested by Michael.



Hi Robertos,

Thanks for the response. I don't get many responses, sadly.

I also believe the Earth reversed it's rotation. I'd date the event to about 3500 years ago. But the date isn't important. Within 10,000 years seems safe. A cessation of rotation would cause the 13.5 mile equatorial bulge of sea level to rush poleward, with sediment. This would fill the area between mountains with sediment.

http://igppweb.ucsd.edu/~gabi/sediment.html

I don't believe the canyons are caused by arc discharge, as i'd like them to be. I'm very EU. The water would return to the equator as the planet started to rotate in the direction we experience today. The fresh soft sediment would be quickly removed as the level of water receded. This fits the patterns i see. Oregon is a great example. While the level of water is high there is little water flow/current. As the level drops below the land mass there would be raging floods returning to the equator. The location of the water current increase is where the canyons start.

http://goo.gl/maps/IdGxG

This fits every location i've visited, including the Grand Canyon. May the EU gods forgive me.

The areas above the waterline seem to have increased as dust from above coated dry areas. Some of the time the material was molten, creating rock. After the material was deposited, electrical events [flowing plasma] metamorphosed the surface in areas of high current density, IMHO.

Hola Gary,

I think it was a combination of slosh and material from above, sometimes molten, as described in Worlds in Collision, that created the surface of Earth.

michael.
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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby starbiter » Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:38 am

The image below shows the Sierra mountains West of Lone Pine CA. Mount Whitney is on the right, in the shade. These mountains are the result of folding according to most geologists.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

http://goo.gl/maps/y3KpB

On the other hand, i see the ridges forming from a wind from the West while the air was full of red hot dust and rocks.

The image below shows the West facing side of Mt Whitney.

https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=3 ... o-91745003

This might be a flat surface that folded up. Or it might be the side of an obstacle that was spackled. The talus surface above solid rock could be the result of lower current density prior to the end of the event. Or possibly rapid cooling after deposition.

michael

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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby Robertus Maximus » Mon Oct 21, 2013 10:48 am

Hi Michael,

I’m painting with a very broad brush here as I’ve yet to work out the finer details. I must be honest, I used the date of 250,000 years ago for the period of mountain building as an upper limit. My preferred age would be 20,000 +/- 10,000 years ago. I base this on the convergence of radiocarbon ages of ‘fossilised’ soft tissue from dinosaurs, megafauna etc. which were preserved in the same cataclysmic event that led to the formation of today’s mountain ranges. (I realise that problems exist regarding carbon dating but it’s the best I can do!)

Whilst I have no problems with airborne material settling and forming layers (from a later electrical event), the fossil record primarily indicates a watery catastrophe. 95% of the fossil record consists of marine invertebrates, 4.75% plants, 0.24% insects and 0.01% fish, amphibians, reptiles, dinosaurs, birds, mammals, basically everything else!

In my scenario as Earth’s rotation was disrupted not only did the ocean waters rush poleward but Coriolis forces led to immense ocean gyres causing ‘sloshing’ (to borrow a term). Where the flow was restricted by then existing landmasses, ranges such as the Alps and Himalaya formed. The Rockies and Andes formed due to the north-south orientation of the Americas acting as a simple barrier to the waters of the proto-Pacific.

At this stage only immense plateaus of folded sediment (were we now find mountain ranges) existed and helped protect continental interiors from further devastating inundations. Electrical events now machined these plateaus forming the typical Lichtenberg morphology (this would have been the time when large amounts of airborne dust would have been present). The Tibetan Plateau is a good example of this, with the Himalaya to the south and Tian Shan to the north (perhaps the Taklimakan Desert is a depository for some machined material?)

To my mind, Paul E. Anderson has done excellent work demonstrating the evidence for the electrical scarring of Earth’s surface: likewise, your work on external granite and basalt – again excellent. This is why I think the main erosive agent would have electrical discharge rather than water and why we find fossilised sea creatures in concretions (electrical fossilisation?) in mountainous areas.

I also think that Earth’s carbonate strata and salt deposits are igneous in origin, that’s why we find carbonate in comets- it was machined from the Earth! Where from exactly, I don’t know but every time I look at the Pacific Ocean I wonder…
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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby starbiter » Mon Oct 21, 2013 2:44 pm

Robertus Maximus wrote:Hi Michael,

I’m painting with a very broad brush here as I’ve yet to work out the finer details. I must be honest, I used the date of 250,000 years ago for the period of mountain building as an upper limit. My preferred age would be 20,000 +/- 10,000 years ago. I base this on the convergence of radiocarbon ages of ‘fossilised’ soft tissue from dinosaurs, megafauna etc. which were preserved in the same cataclysmic event that led to the formation of today’s mountain ranges. (I realise that problems exist regarding carbon dating but it’s the best I can do!)

Whilst I have no problems with airborne material settling and forming layers (from a later electrical event), the fossil record primarily indicates a watery catastrophe. 95% of the fossil record consists of marine invertebrates, 4.75% plants, 0.24% insects and 0.01% fish, amphibians, reptiles, dinosaurs, birds, mammals, basically everything else!

In my scenario as Earth’s rotation was disrupted not only did the ocean waters rush poleward but Coriolis forces led to immense ocean gyres causing ‘sloshing’ (to borrow a term). Where the flow was restricted by then existing landmasses, ranges such as the Alps and Himalaya formed. The Rockies and Andes formed due to the north-south orientation of the Americas acting as a simple barrier to the waters of the proto-Pacific.

At this stage only immense plateaus of folded sediment (were we now find mountain ranges) existed and helped protect continental interiors from further devastating inundations. Electrical events now machined these plateaus forming the typical Lichtenberg morphology (this would have been the time when large amounts of airborne dust would have been present). The Tibetan Plateau is a good example of this, with the Himalaya to the south and Tian Shan to the north (perhaps the Taklimakan Desert is a depository for some machined material?)

To my mind, Paul E. Anderson has done excellent work demonstrating the evidence for the electrical scarring of Earth’s surface: likewise, your work on external granite and basalt – again excellent. This is why I think the main erosive agent would have electrical discharge rather than water and why we find fossilised sea creatures in concretions (electrical fossilisation?) in mountainous areas.

I also think that Earth’s carbonate strata and salt deposits are igneous in origin, that’s why we find carbonate in comets- it was machined from the Earth! Where from exactly, I don’t know but every time I look at the Pacific Ocean I wonder…


Hi Robertus,

Your model is much different than mine. The thought of responding to You is exhausting. I've already presented my case on this thread but either You haven't read it or You disagree.

If canyons were caused by arc discharge i'd expect the canyon to disregard high points. Instead canyons seem to ALWAYS get smaller toward the ridge. On the other side of the ridge the process repeats. The canyon is smaller with less drainage available. A Licthenberg figure wouldn't care about a ridge.

http://goo.gl/maps/VReUr

The map above shows the patterns i refer to. Please provide examples of Lichtenberg patterns running through ridges. Rivers like the Colorado running through the Grand Canyon don't count. There never was a ridge. The river was always there. The mountain surrounding the canyon grew around the river.

Concerning mountain ranges, i see diocotron instabilities as the cause. The maps below show rock types of North America.

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File: ... _types.jpg

The top map showing sediment is telling. It shows mountains rising above sediment. I see a diocotron instability sitting over Four Corners. There is a ring of granitic and metamorphic mountains surrounding the area.

http://goo.gl/maps/UrJCX

Growing out of this ring are the Canadian Rockies and the mountains of Mexico. These mountain seem to be a mirror image. Growing out of these mountains are the Aleutians and Caribbean, which appear to be close to mirror images to me. Of course as we look to the North the globe is distorted. If You use Google Earth and put Four Corners in the middle You might see the pattern.

The map below shows an area in Afghanistan that's supposed to be a volcano.

http://goo.gl/maps/Bo1UV

As You zoom out the grey on the right and red on the left reverse like a Korean flag. Yin/Yang. Then there are a ring of melted looking mountains surrounding that.

http://goo.gl/maps/Js5lX

The Himalayas and Alps grow out of these mountains. To the North of the Himalayas is the Gobi desert. To the South of the Alps is the Sahara desert.

My image has Venus making close approaches causing these formations. The Hebrews saw a pillar of fire and smoke. The Hindus saw a man of fire and smoke. The Hebrews looked to the East. The Hindus looked West.

My model has comets producing carbonates. Earth doesn't seem to produce dolomite. It's a big problem. Comet Halley produces over 7% dolomite in it's coma. This might explain 1,000s of feet of dolomite on mountain tops. Not from comet Halley, but from comet Venus.

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi. ... 010014.pdf


http://www.eu-geology.com/?page_id=107




michael
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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby starbiter » Wed Oct 23, 2013 8:56 am

North of Redmond Oregon Smith Rock State Park rises above the flat landscape.

http://www.foxnews.com/health/2013/10/2 ... -fda-says/

The normal geologic explanation follows.

http://smithrock.org/explore/smith-rock-geology/

The two major types of rock used by climbers are columnar basalt and welded tuff.
Basalt – The gray basalt columns that line the outer canyon are created by lava flow from nearby Newberry Crater. In contrast to the rough tuff found on the primary cliffs within the canyon, basalt is often smoother. The columns of basalt in the upper cliffs of the outer canyon are divided by small to large cracks with create fun and exciting climbing opportunities.
Tuff – The tuff found here is a type of rock created by ash within a volcano that is expelled from a vent while under extreme pressure and heat. Specifically, welded tuff is a pyroclastic rock that, as the name implies, welds together due to high temperatures. The tuff results in an often rough, uneven surface. Holes of varying sizes and small protrusions are common features."

me again,

My images below.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

When i asked the chief park ranger where the molten dust came from to create the formation he claimed it was from the caldera to the SE towards Prineville.

http://goo.gl/maps/APMdB


That would be the missing caldera that sank into the planet. Is it possible the dust was kept hot by a river of fire/plasma. If this proposed river of fire was electrical in nature it would make the term welded tuff quite appropriate.

michael


"
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Re: Are Mountains the Result of a Duning Process?

Unread postby starbiter » Wed Oct 23, 2013 4:06 pm

The explanations for granite, sandstone, dolomite, and welded tuff are quite different.

Granite bubbles up from below but doesn't make it to the surface. After slow cooling the dirt surrounding the hard granite goes away. In the case of the Sierra the whole mess then needs to fold without breaking the solid layers.

Sandstone forms as a dune or underwater sediment. Then it's converted to rock through deep burial or chemical action. Then in some cases it needs to fold.

Dolomite requires millions of years of slow growth under the oceans. Then it wanders many miles to mountain tops. Of course folding is required.

Welded tuff is red hot volcanic dust that travels many miles from the volcano, in some cases. The material stays red hot in the air while not part of a pyroclastic flow, again in some cases. While still molten it sticks to obstructions.

Oddly the cliffs of these different types of rock look similar.

Below is granite.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

Next sandstone.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

Now the Dolomites of Italy.

https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&sit ... 1024%3B768

The tuffs below seems similar.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-GyNP5 ... =drive_web


The cliffs would be the leeward side of the process. Either wet or molten dust sticking the the windward side of obstructions, creating cliffs with chevrons. The chevron shapes might be caused by the intensity of the process oscillating. Could it be that all of these formations were produced by blowing material during the plague of darkness, or later?

michael
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