Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Plasma and electricity in space. Failure of gravity-only cosmology. Exposing the myths of dark matter, dark energy, black holes, neutron stars, and other mathematical constructs. The electric model of stars. Predictions and confirmations of the electric comet.

Moderators: bboyer, MGmirkin

Locked
mharratsc
Posts: 1405
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2009 7:37 am

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by mharratsc » Sun Jan 31, 2010 10:13 am

Don't forget too, that even though they've been focusing on these 'energetic neutrals' of theirs, that there are also energetic charged particles out there that they weren't looking for!

Personally, I don't see these IBEX maps as a complete data set, because they have been colored by the preconceptions of these guys who went out there fishing for what they expected to find, and not really keeping their eyes peeled.

I thought Solrey posted some data regarding that, but I don't remember where. I know that it throws a wrench in their plans to show ions and electrons buzzing around out there in discernable current paths!

Validation of the Electric Sun, anyone! :D
Mike H.

"I have no fear to shout out my ignorance and let the Wise correct me, for every instance of such narrows the gulf between them and me." -- Michael A. Harrington

flyingcloud
Posts: 490
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2008 2:07 am
Location: Honey Brook

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by flyingcloud » Tue May 25, 2010 9:35 am

Ribbon at Edge of Our Solar System: Will the Sun Enter a Million-Degree Cloud of Interstellar Gas?

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 191114.htm
ScienceDaily (May 24, 2010) — Is the Sun going to enter a million-degree galactic cloud of interstellar gas soon?

Scientists from the Space Research Centre of the Polish Academy of Sciences, Los Alamos National Laboratory, Southwest Research Institute, and Boston University suggest that the ribbon of enhanced emissions of energetic neutral atoms, discovered last year by the NASA Small Explorer satellite IBEX, could be explained by a geometric effect coming up because of the approach of the Sun to the boundary between the Local Cloud of interstellar gas and another cloud of a very hot gas called the Local Bubble. If this hypothesis is correct, IBEX is catching matter from a hot neighboring interstellar cloud, which the Sun might enter in a hundred years.

Osmosis
Posts: 423
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 3:52 pm
Location: San Jose, California

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by Osmosis » Tue May 25, 2010 12:29 pm

More hot gas from Science Fiction Daily :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

earls
Posts: 275
Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:48 am

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by earls » Tue May 25, 2010 1:16 pm

So their prediction is "Once in, the heliosphere will reform and may shrink a little, the level of cosmic radiation entering the magnetosphere may rise a bit, but nothing more."

What does EU suggest?

User avatar
MrAmsterdam
Posts: 596
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2009 8:59 am

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by MrAmsterdam » Wed May 26, 2010 7:38 am

flyingcloud wrote:Ribbon at Edge of Our Solar System: Will the Sun Enter a Million-Degree Cloud of Interstellar Gas?

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 191114.htm
ScienceDaily (May 24, 2010) — Is the Sun going to enter a million-degree galactic cloud of interstellar gas soon?

Scientists from the Space Research Centre of the Polish Academy of Sciences, Los Alamos National Laboratory, Southwest Research Institute, and Boston University suggest that the ribbon of enhanced emissions of energetic neutral atoms, discovered last year by the NASA Small Explorer satellite IBEX, could be explained by a geometric effect coming up because of the approach of the Sun to the boundary between the Local Cloud of interstellar gas and another cloud of a very hot gas called the Local Bubble. If this hypothesis is correct, IBEX is catching matter from a hot neighboring interstellar cloud, which the Sun might enter in a hundred years.

Right. The following needs to be explained in plasma terms, I think.
Energetic neutral atoms, registered by IBEX detectors, are born out of ions (protons) speeding from the very hot Local Bubble when they exchange charge with the relatively cool atoms "evaporating" from the Local Interstellar Cloud. The newly created ENA have no electrical charge and therefore can dash freely in straight lines from their birth site, oblivious of the impeding magnetic fields. Some of them may reach Earth orbit and be detected by IBEX. "Had the Ribbon ENA been created at the boundaries of the heliosphere, their birth site would be relatively nearby, within just a couple of hundreds of astronomical units," explains Dr Andrzej Czechowski from SRC PAS, one of the co-authors of the paper. "According to our hypothesis, they are born much, much farther away."

The team of Polish and US scientists suggests that the Ribbon ENA are born by electrical charge exchange between the atoms which "evaporate" from the Local Interstellar Cloud into the nearby Local Bubble of a very hot and fully ionized gas. The Local Bubble is probably a remnant of a series of supernova explosions that occurred a few million years ago and thus is not only very hot (at least million degree Kelvin), but also turbulent. The protons in the Local Bubble nearby to the boundary with the Local Cloud snatch electrons from the neutral atoms and run away in all directions, some of them reaching IBEX.
Blabla...millions of years ago..protons are running away still....at least million degree Kelvin, can someone explain where the input energy is coming from?
Today's scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality. -Nikola Tesla -1934

Osmosis
Posts: 423
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 3:52 pm
Location: San Jose, California

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by Osmosis » Wed May 26, 2010 7:58 am

Where do these people buy their PHD degrees? I'll take one1 :lol:

User avatar
nick c
Moderator
Posts: 2483
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2008 8:12 pm
Location: connecticut

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by nick c » Wed May 26, 2010 8:19 am

Perhaps the electrical environs of the Sun are undergoing some changes, moving out of the Local Interstellar Cloud and into the Local Bubble.

A POSSIBLE GENERATION MECHANISM FOR THE IBEX RIBBON FROM OUTSIDE THE HELIOSPHERE

What does this mean in terms of the Electric Universe?

Nick

keeha
Posts: 112
Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2008 5:20 pm

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by keeha » Fri May 28, 2010 2:20 am

Like blowing on a candle?

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 123747.htm
Dr Wareing and his colleagues used the COBRA supercomputer to simulate in three-dimensions the movement of a dying star through surrounding interstellar gas..

It showed that a shockwave forms ahead of the dying star and giant eddies and whirlpools develop in the tail of material behind the star, similar to those seen in the wake of boats on open water.
Not sure if this has been posted before...
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 152225.htm
The team combined their new data (mostly recorded at the European Southern Observatory in Chile) with previously published results. The new paper represents a catalog of absorption measurements towards 1857 stars located 800 parsecs from the Sun. 1 shows the NaI map of the interstellar gas density within 300 parsecs.
Image
The white area surrounding the Sun (i.e., at the center of the map) corresponds to a very low-density area of neutral gas, known as the Local Cavity. It is about 80 parsecs in radius in most directions and is surrounded by a highly fragmented "wall" of dense neutral gas. The various gaps in the wall are termed "interstellar tunnels" and represent rarefied pathways into other surrounding interstellar cavities. Maps of the distribution of CaII have never been made before, and they reveal that the Local Cavity contains numerous filamentary structures of partially ionized gas that appear to form in a honeycomb-like pattern of small interstellar cells.

Theories of the general interstellar medium require that large rarefied cavities exist, having been formed by the combined action of energetic supernova events and the outflowing winds of clusters of hot and young stars.

mharratsc
Posts: 1405
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2009 7:37 am

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by mharratsc » Wed Sep 29, 2010 3:33 pm

I was re-reading through this thread and got the urge to go check out the IBEX site... here's a quote from IBEX's 'chief investigator' regarding 'what IBEX is seeing':

http://www.ibex.swri.edu/
As the solar wind streams outward from the Sun at a million miles per hour (1.6 million kilometers per hour), the solar wind protons and electrons pile up along the outer boundary of Earth’s magnetosphere, called the “magnetopause”. These charged particles are shocked, heated, and slowed almost to a stop before getting diverted sideways.A few of those charged particles interact with neutral atoms in the very outer reaches of our atmosphere about 35,000 miles (56,000 kilometers) from the surface of the Earth. This extremely low-density region of our atmosphere, called the “exosphere”, extends beyond Earth’s protective magnetic field. The solar wind charged particles exchange electrons with our exosphere’s neutral particles, and the solar wind particles become neutral in the process.Now, they are no longer affected by Earth’s magnetic field and fly off in whatever direction they were going when they became neutral. Because some of these particles happen to be traveling in the direction of the IBEX spacecraft and its sensors, IBEX can detect them. Just like our heliosphere boundary, our magnetosphere boundary does not give off light that we can detect, so we must use particle sensors like those of IBEX to study regions like this.
Are you serious?? :shock:

I'm going to send an email to Saul (the guy working on this project) and ask him if this is truly the extent of the 'science' all our tax dollars are funding on this project. :x
Mike H.

"I have no fear to shout out my ignorance and let the Wise correct me, for every instance of such narrows the gulf between them and me." -- Michael A. Harrington

jjohnson
Posts: 1147
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2009 11:24 am
Location: Thurston County WA

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by jjohnson » Thu Sep 30, 2010 9:23 am

Please let us hear their answer if you get a reply, Mike.
Jim

flyingcloud
Posts: 490
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2008 2:07 am
Location: Honey Brook

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by flyingcloud » Thu Sep 30, 2010 10:11 am

Knot in the ribbon at the edge of the solar system 'unties'
http://www.physorg.com/news205069123.html
The unusual "knot" in the bright, narrow ribbon of neutral atoms emanating in from the boundary between our solar system and interstellar space appears to have "untied," according to a paper published online in the Journal of Geophysical Research.

User avatar
solrey
Posts: 631
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2009 12:54 pm

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by solrey » Thu Sep 30, 2010 12:17 pm

New Map of Sun's Protective "Bubble" Unveiled by IBEX Team, UNH Researcher

Image
The IBEX global maps of the heliosphere show rapid changes in the protective boundaries surrounding our solar system.
However, some features, such as a bright knot of intense emission from the ribbon, appear to spread out in the new maps, revealing rapid changes in these protective boundaries. “Such rapid changes in the emissions over only six months are another stunning surprise from this mission of discovery and exploration,” McComas adds.

More than half a dozen different theories are now vying to explain the origin of the mysterious ribbon. Schwadron elaborates, “The second maps now increase the difficulty in explaining the ribbon itself and how it can change so quickly. While the second images provide some insights into the possible source of the ribbon, none of the ideas so far proposed can fully account for the surprising new observations from IBEX.
hehe... :)
Two predictions:
Changes in energy density in the belt region corresponding to changes in solar activity.
Movement of "hot spots" corresponding to the orbits of the gas giants.
Time to contact saul and get more details.
The new IBEX results, titled “Evolving outer heliosphere: Large-scale stability and time variations observed by the Interstellar Boundary Explorer” by McComas et al, were published in the Sept. 29, 2010 edition of the Journal of Geophysical Research – Space Physics.


Evolving outer heliosphere: Large-scale stability and time variations observed by the Interstellar Boundary Explorer
The first all-sky maps of Energetic Neutral Atoms (ENAs) from the Interstellar Boundary Explorer (IBEX) exhibited smoothly varying, globally distributed flux and a narrow “ribbon” of enhanced ENA emissions. In this study we compare the second set of sky maps to the first in order to assess the possibility of temporal changes over the 6 months between views of each portion of the sky. While the large-scale structure is generally stable between the two sets of maps, there are some remarkable changes that show that the heliosphere is also evolving over this short timescale. In particular, we find that (1) the overall ENA emissions coming from the outer heliosphere appear to be slightly lower in the second set of maps compared to the first, (2) both the north and south poles have significantly lower (∼10–15%) ENA emissions in the second set of maps compared to the first across the energy range from 0.5 to 6 keV, and (3) the “knot” in the northern portion of the ribbon in the first maps is less bright and appears to have spread and/or dissipated by the time the second set was acquired. Finally, the spatial distribution of fluxes in the southernmost portion of the ribbon has evolved slightly, perhaps moving as much as 6° (one map pixel) equatorward on average. The observed large-scale stability and these systematic changes at smaller spatial scales provide important new information about the outer heliosphere and its global interaction with the galaxy and help inform possible mechanisms for producing the IBEX ribbon.
by solrey » Sat Oct 24, 2009 4:32 pm
The timing of when the IBEX data was collected corresponds to about the lowest activity in this current solar cycle. In the past couple of months, solar cycle activity has increased slightly.
I would expect a corresponding, slight increase (around 5% - 8%), in the energy level/density in the ribbon/belt region, although it's such a slight increase that it might not show up outside the "margin of error" on IBEX.
Oops. :oops:
Freakin' amateurs... ;)

Hmmmm, could be a lag in the suns response to changes in the galactic induction current, perhaps relating to the velocity of the incoming drift current? Solar activity kind of spiked for a few months then went back down again and has been pretty quiet until just recently so perhaps that's reflected in the new map with lower emissions compared to the first?

I wouldn't be surprised if over time we find that changes in the ribbon precede and correspond to changes in solar activity by x-amount of time. Seems a logical sequence for an externally powered electric sun. If that's true the data from IBEX should be useful for predicting near term solar activity. Someone with access to the relevant data ought to look into that... :?

cheers
“Today's scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality"
Nikola Tesla

User avatar
solrey
Posts: 631
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2009 12:54 pm

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by solrey » Thu Sep 30, 2010 10:06 pm

both the north and south poles have significantly lower (∼10–15%) ENA emissions in the second set of maps compared to the first across the energy range from 0.5 to 6 keV
Given that this data was collected over the course of six months and probably took another few months to process and get to the press, I thought that if the ENA emissions could be used as a predictor for near term solar activity, I'd check the f10.7 radio flux progression to see how this year has progressed and see if there's a correlation. Well, there just happens to be a drop between early 2010 to mid 2010 from a high around 84 to a low of around 72...a reduction of approximately 14%...in a period of around five or six months.

Image

Coincidence? Looking forward to future IBEX data 'cause two or three coincidences in a row starts to become a trend. ;)

That trend would be pretty strong evidence for an externally powered sun. Time will tell.

cheers.
“Today's scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality"
Nikola Tesla

User avatar
solrey
Posts: 631
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2009 12:54 pm

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by solrey » Sat Oct 02, 2010 8:40 pm

“Today's scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality"
Nikola Tesla

User avatar
GaryN
Posts: 2668
Joined: Tue Apr 01, 2008 8:18 pm
Location: Sooke, BC, Canada

Re: Giant Ribbon Discovered at Edge of Solar System

Unread post by GaryN » Sat Oct 02, 2010 10:42 pm

This time, I like the artists impression!
Image
Animation:
http://vimeo.com/15436595
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller

Locked

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests