Recovered: New Redshift Idea

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Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 1:32 am

Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 1:05 pm Post subject: new redshift idea Reply with quote
OP "bdw000"

Any comments on this very brief idea about redshift and the big bang?

http://www.contrarianthinker.com/Red%20Shift.htm

Can't claim to "know" if this is correct, but it looks to a nonscientist like it makes a lot of sense.

Would love to hear any opinions for or against.
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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 1:34 am

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 1:51 pm Post subject: Reply with quote
OP "redeye"

This is the most sensible thing I have read on the subject in years.
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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 1:35 am

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 6:46 pm Post subject: Re: new redshift idea Reply with quote
OP "Michael Mozina"

bdw000 wrote:Any comments on this very brief idea about redshift and the big bang?

[url] http://www.contrarianthinker.com/Red%20Shift.htm
[/url]

Can't claim to "know" if this is correct, but it looks to a nonscientist like it makes a lot of sense.

Would love to hear any opinions for or against.


This seems very similar to MECO theory.
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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 1:35 am

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 7:43 pm Post subject: Reply with quote
OP "redeye"

http://www.world-science.net/othernews/ ... quasar.htm

Meco theory?
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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 1:40 am

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 8:27 pm Post subject: Reply with quote
OP "mgmirkin"

Michael Mozina wrote:
bdw000 wrote:Any comments on this very brief idea about redshift and the big bang?

http://www.contrarianthinker.com/Red%20Shift.htm

Can't claim to "know" if this is correct, but it looks to a nonscientist like it makes a lot of sense.

Would love to hear any opinions for or against.


This seems very similar to MECO theory.




MECO Theory.

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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 1:44 am

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 10:57 pm Post subject: Reply with quote
OP "Solar"




MECO theory sounds a lot like a "decaying" plasma-focused plasmoid.
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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 1:46 am

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 11:11 pm Post subject: Reply with quote
OP "Michael Mozina"

Solar wrote:


MECO theory sounds a lot like a "decaying" plasma-focused plasmoid.


Which in turn sounds a lot like a neutron star. :)
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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 1:48 am

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 11:16 pm Post subject: Reply with quote
OP "Michael Mozina"

Another link related to MECO theory.

http://arxiv.org/abs/physics/0506183

It should be noted that Einstein himself was not a big fan of "Black Holes", although I do think he would have liked MECO theory. :)

I try to keep an open mind about galaxies (and even stars) containing an object of heavy mass at their core.
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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 2:01 am

Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2007 1:51 am Post subject: What Redshift Reply with quote
OP "SeaSmith"

:arrow:
Some semi-illuminating history to the Redshift Confusion:

Cygnus A, Quasars, and Quandaries

March 13, 2001 :: When Walter Baade and Rudolph Minkowski obtained the spectrum of Cygnus A, they found what they considered to be proof of colliding galaxies: emission lines that indicated they were produced by gas in a high state of excitation. This evidence, combined with the facts that Cygnus A had a distorted shape and was located in the center of a galaxy cluster where collisions of galaxies were more probable, seemed to clinch the case.

But there were some major problems with this interpretation. The spectrum also showed that the emission lines were all red-shifted by the same amount. This in itself was not unexpected, since two decades earlier Edwin Hubble and his colleagues had shown that the spectra of distant galaxies would show a red-shift proportional to their distance. The difficulty was that the measured red-shift implied that Cygnus A was very distant -- possibly 1 billion light years distant!
Radio image of Cygnus AThis Very Large Array image of Cygnus A is characterized by very faint, narrow jets, distinct lobes, and hot spots at the ends of the jets.(NRAO/AUI)
At such a large distance Cygnus A would need an extremely powerful energy source to produce the observed radio and optical radiation. It seemed impossible that galaxies in collision could generate such intense power. This problem was made even worse in the mid-1950's by additional radio observations and theoretical work. The conclusion from these efforts was that radio waves from Cygnus A and other radio-emitting galaxies are produced by high-energy electrons spiraling around magnetic field lines. This process, which was first observed in a particle accelerator called a synchrotron, is called synchrotron radiation.
………..
Still more problems for the collision theory became apparent when R.C. Jennison reported on new measurements of the structure of the Cygnus A radio source. It has the shape of a great cosmic dumbbell, with two huge lobes of high-energy particles located over half a million light years apart. The galaxy, which is several times smaller than the lobes, is located in the middle. It was beginning to look as if the radiation from Cygnus A was not due to galaxies in collision, but to some mysterious explosive process where high-energy particles were being blown out of the galaxy!……………..

Then Schmidt had one of those simple, yet profound insights that one wonders why it was missed by so many others. He showed that the mysterious lines were due to well-known transitions between energy states in a hydrogen atom. They were merely shifted to the longer wavelengths (to the red end of the spectrum) by about 16 percent.

This was not the largest red-shift observed to that point -- Minkowski had shown that the galaxy 3C295 and its associated galaxy cluster had a red-shift of 46 percent. ......" How could a starlike object have such a large red-shift?

xlightRadiate-72sm.jpg
(click to view larger image)

X-Rays - Another Form of Light
Synchrotron Radiation
But this is not the whole story. X-ray photons can also be created under different conditions. When physicists were operating the first particle accelerators, they discovered that electrons can produce photons without colliding at all. This was possible because the magnetic field in the accelerators was causing the electrons to move in large spirals around magnetic field lines of force. This process is called synchrotron radiation.
In the cosmos particles such as electrons can be accelerated to high energies– near the speed of light– by electric and magnetic fields. These high-energy particles can produce synchrotron photons with wavelengths ranging from radio up through X-ray and gamma-ray energies.

Synchrotron radiation from cosmic sources has a distinctive spectrum, or distribution of photons with energy. The radiation falls off with energy less rapidly than does the spectrum of radiation from a hot gas. When synchrotron radiation is observed in supernova remnants, cosmic jets, or other sources, it reveals information about the high-energy electrons and magnetic fields that are present.

0216_radio_purple.jpg
(click to view larger image)

http://chandra.harvard.edu/chronicle/0101/cyga2.html
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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 2:02 am

Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2007 8:43 pm Post subject: Reply with quote
OP "bdw000"

Thanks for the comments.

No negative responses?

For now I put this in my redshift file.

MECO theory looks to me like a way to just keep their black holes under another name. Still just a bunch of speculation based on assumptions (which does NOT equal reality!!!) so they can keep their gravity and ignore electricity.
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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 2:04 am

Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 9:47 pm Post subject: Reply with quote
OP "bdw000"

Solar wrote:
Though MECO may not be totally correct it can sure slap mainstream fairies around pretty good LOL!!!


Good point.

However, even though the article may have some very good points, the IDEA of MECO's (not that article in its entirety) is, in my OPINION, still just another "fairy."

Until they want to cough up some [cough, cough] . . . . hard evidence??
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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 2:05 am

Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 10:40 pm Post subject: Reply with quote
OP "redeye"

It seems many mainstream proponents are quick to pay homage to Einstein and use his accomplishments, and or accomplishments stemming from that work, to bolster these phantasms but it seems more so that they have waxed hypocritical in proposing imaginary constructs which have aspects that violate GR at the same time!!!


I feel that many mainstream proponents take a perverse pleasure from inventing things like MECO's which violate the mainstream laws of the universe and can only be understood by about 00.000001% of the population.

Its basically an obscene form of intellectual elitism!

The only thing in the universe that is "eternally collapsing" is my opinion of mainstream "science"....and my bank balance!
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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 2:10 am

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 12:08 am Post subject: Reply with quote
OP "Tzunamii"

bdw000 wrote:
Solar wrote:
Though MECO may not be totally correct it can sure slap mainstream fairies around pretty good LOL!!!


Good point.

However, even though the article may have some very good points, the IDEA of MECO's (not that article in its entirety) is, in my OPINION, still just another "fairy."

Until they want to cough up some [cough, cough] . . . . hard evidence??


Would be nice huh.
From Wiki's MECO article,
"Recent evidence of magnetic fields unusually close to what are thought to be super-massive black holes in the centers of some galaxies".....
Should point to an Electric effect, NOT another candy coated steaming loaf of Crap.
Only Electric Current can create a Magnetic Field.
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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 2:11 am

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 3:30 am Post subject: Reply with quote
OP "upriver"

Check the HR diagram for stars sizes.
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Re: Recovered: New Redshift Idea

Unread postby bboyer » Mon Mar 24, 2008 2:15 am

Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 3:20 pm Post subject: Re: new redshift idea Reply with quote
OP "Elektra"

bdw000 wrote:Any comments on this very brief idea about redshift and the big bang?

http://www.contrarianthinker.com/Red%20Shift.htm

Can't claim to "know" if this is correct, but it looks to a nonscientist like it makes a lot of sense.

Would love to hear any opinions for or against.

It might make some sense if the galaxies and quasars whose redshifts have been observed were all, and only, points.

Of course they're not, otherwise no one could tell they were galaxies and not stars. But for many quasars it might make sense, except that quasar spectra have both broad and narrow lines.

Perhaps someone else could explain how this gravity well idea would work for galaxies with large redshifts, and for quasars with both broad and narrow lines.
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