The mainstream cannot handle an honest debate on cosmology

Plasma and electricity in space. Failure of gravity-only cosmology. Exposing the myths of dark matter, dark energy, black holes, neutron stars, and other mathematical constructs. The electric model of stars. Predictions and confirmations of the electric comet.

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Re: The mainstream cannot handle an honest debate on cosmolo

Unread postby prioris55555 » Sun Aug 20, 2017 10:32 pm

Mathematically speaking the mainstream still relies upon a form of pseudoscience to explain high energy events in light plasma, only because they are utterly and totally electrophobic. Any suggestion of adding electric fields to a solar model frightens them to death, and causes them to go into an instant online tizzy!


it's like the physics community avoids the E word (or is that A)
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Re: The mainstream cannot handle an honest debate on cosmolo

Unread postby Roshi » Mon Aug 21, 2017 1:49 pm

I grew up thinking the Sun is a big ball of fire. In school I learned it's a kind of nuclear reactor. Cool, but the first image, of a ball of fire stuck, now it was some kind of a nuclear explosion in the sky, still a ball of fire.

But what are we looking at? What do we see when we look at the Sun, on it's surface? Is it fire? The same kind of fire we see on Earth? Is it a "nuclear explosion"? Not really. We see plasma, that means we see something electric, and the Sun is more similar to an electric lightbulb than a nuclear reactor or a ball of fire. But, there is no electricity in space... Maybe there are aliens, but no electricity.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corona
A corona (Latin, 'crown') is an aura of plasma that surrounds the sun and other stars.


No electricity here. Even if I searched for the definition of "plasma" and linked it here, 99% of people would miss the point.
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Re: The mainstream cannot handle an honest debate on cosmolo

Unread postby Michael Mozina » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:42 pm

Roshi wrote:I grew up thinking the Sun is a big ball of fire. In school I learned it's a kind of nuclear reactor. Cool, but the first image, of a ball of fire stuck, now it was some kind of a nuclear explosion in the sky, still a ball of fire.

But what are we looking at? What do we see when we look at the Sun, on it's surface? Is it fire? The same kind of fire we see on Earth? Is it a "nuclear explosion"? Not really. We see plasma, that means we see something electric, and the Sun is more similar to an electric lightbulb than a nuclear reactor or a ball of fire. But, there is no electricity in space... Maybe there are aliens, but no electricity.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corona
A corona (Latin, 'crown') is an aura of plasma that surrounds the sun and other stars.


No electricity here. Even if I searched for the definition of "plasma" and linked it here, 99% of people would miss the point.


It was really sad listening to reporters talking about the eclipse today and claiming that we didn't know the "cause" of the sun's "hot" corona, when in fact it's real physical cause has been known, understood, explained, "predicted" and *demonstrated* in the lab for more than a century.

Man it's hard to be living in the dark ages of astronomy. :(

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m58-CfVrsN4
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Re: The mainstream cannot handle an honest debate on cosmolo

Unread postby Metryq » Tue Aug 22, 2017 4:14 am

Michael Mozina wrote:It was really sad listening to reporters talking about the eclipse today


I passed through a room where someone was watching the start of the eclipse on TV. As I reached the other door, I heard the talking head on TV introducing "Bill Nye." I snorted loudly enough that the TV watcher thought I had sneezed.

I won't say anything else for fear of drawing a reprimand from the moderators.

A friend told a co-worker about the eclipse a few days prior to the event. He explained that the peak in their area would be about 2:15 to 2:30. The co-worker asked, with a straight face, "In the afternoon?"
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Re: The mainstream cannot handle an honest debate on cosmolo

Unread postby Michael Mozina » Sun Dec 17, 2017 2:02 pm

As I've said before, astronomers cannot handle an honest debate on cosmology theory and EU/PC cosmology theory in particular. If you'd like good laugh you'll enjoy the thread below over at CF. A couple of prominent EU/PC haters (selfsim and sjastro) are getting smoked (actually smoking themselves) in a new thread I started on the topic of EU/PC theory at selfsim's request (actually a demand).

https://www.christianforums.com/threads ... y.8040392/

They either don't even understand the theories that they're trying to critique, or they're dishonest as all hell, or both. Selfsim blew himself up trying to defend lyin' Brian Koberlein's "no neutrino" BS. Selfsim even cited Dr. Scott's own website where Scott claimed that there is no neutrino deficit in his model and stated that fusion takes place in the photosphere. Irony overload. You'll get a good laugh out of selfsim's pitiful rationalization for that massive screw up.

Apparently neither of them have read any of the books that I suggested in the OP because they both refuse to answer a simple question about it.

The really funny part is that for all their supposed mathier-than-thou physics abilities, neither of them has been able to cite a single mathematical flaw in any of the materials that I cited, including Dr, Scott's Birkeland current paper. Instead its been all strawmen, unethical personal attacks, blatant misrepresentation of fact, and handwavy nonsense. LOL! So much for the value of the supposed superior math skills.

It was rather amusing watching selfsim hoist himself by his own petard over the no neutrino crap. What a riot. That's what they get for being so damn dishonest and for behaving like a "group-think", butt protecting cult rather than acting like real scientists who can think and speak for themselves. Selfsim destroyed his own credibility with his neutrino crash a burn routine.

Pretty entertaining stuff IMO.
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Re: The mainstream cannot handle an honest debate on cosmolo

Unread postby Michael Mozina » Mon Dec 18, 2017 1:15 pm

That CF conversation is a riot IMO. The EU/PC hater posse foot in mouth routine is just comical at this point. EU/PC haters are so unethical, and their false claims are so weirdly rationalized, that they can't even keep their own convoluted arguments straight anymore. Their own statements are self conflicted to start with, and they don't even agree with each other anymore :) I couldn't have hoped for a better demonstration of the pure lack of ethics and the arguments from absolute ignorance that EU/PC haters engage in. They managed to paint themselves right into a corner by being so deceitful. :) It's funny stuff IMO.
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Re: The mainstream cannot handle an honest debate on cosmolo

Unread postby JHL » Sat Dec 23, 2017 10:52 am

Michael Mozina wrote:The really funny part is that for all their supposed mathier-than-thou physics abilities, neither of them has been able to cite a single mathematical flaw in any of the materials that I cited, including Dr, Scott's Birkeland current paper.


This seems as good a place as any:

If you put tomfoolery into a computer, nothing comes out of it but tomfoolery. But this tomfoolery, having passed through a very expensive machine, is somehow ennobled and no-one dares criticize it.

-Pierre Gallois

That's as good a critique on the modern, de-philosophied cudgel of "science" - or if used by its assumed catch-all literalism and weaponized contemporary brand name, Science! - as any. Feel free to insert any appropriate term in place of tomfoolery. They all work.

Merry Christmas, everyone. And here's to a rousing 2018 among some of the better conversationalists I know or would reasonably expect to ever find.
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Re: The mainstream cannot handle an honest debate on cosmolo

Unread postby JHL » Sat Dec 23, 2017 11:14 am

Michael Mozina wrote:It was rather amusing watching selfsim hoist himself by his own petard over the no neutrino crap. What a riot.


Having read a couple pages of that thread, I found the conversation to go more or like this:

MM: The universe exhibits electrical characteristics. There is copious evidence and work showing this.

selfism: Heretic! Science! [in a previous comment I'd observed that they used the word like a cudgel and selfism actually does wield it in caps, true to form] guys wrote some stuff I can more or less claim to refute your heresy!

MM: Actually, the way it works is [enters X, Y, and Z into evidence]. Allow me to cite my sources, which happen to comport well with any modern observation you'd care to make.

selfism: I trust the Scientists!, MM, and your heresy is further noted as having failed to move me from my position. I am Arbiter; hear me roar.

MM:

selfism: ...my proof-by-presumption therefore trumps your facts.

MM:

selfism: ...and allow me to claim Science! too, while we're at it.

MM: Actually...

selfism: WHO ARE YOU TO CHALLENGE MY FURTHER PROOF-BY-CONSENSUS, HERETIC? For I cite Science!

MM: Well, there's all this actual evidence and all...

selfism: FRAUD! Off with his head! You'll make no friends with an attitude like that!

And on and on.

The great tell for the fallacist is his inevitable reliance on your obligation to shift his hidebound thinking, in this case aided by whatever he can co-opt. If you fail, it is not his turgid intellectual trajectory but your meager ability. He is Arbiter. This victim-blaming - generally associated with dysfunction in other circles and practices - deploys its own ignorance as a bellwether and benchmark. It's as funny as it is discouraging to see. It's also as common as rain.
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