An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

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An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby davesmith_au » Fri Aug 29, 2008 11:05 pm

'08 August 31 ~ Michael Goodspeed

If you've been reading these pages for any length of time, you've likely noticed that the Thunderbolts team has never indulged in "esoteric" speculations in their discussions of the Electric Universe. Although the managers of this site have received countless inquiries from readers who wonder, "What does all this MEAN?" -- i.e. what are the philosophical ramifications, if any, of a cosmology in which electricity, not gravity, dominates -- they (the site's editors) have preferred a "just the facts, ma'am" approach, leaving the inevitable discussions of philosophical quandaries for a later date. ... [More...]
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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby Influx » Sun Aug 31, 2008 2:17 am

There are many anomalies in this world that we do not understand and probably will not understand for the foreseeable future, not only because of the current materialistic stance by the academia, but also because the spiritual world is to complex for simple materialistic minds to comprehend. I believe that the Thunderblog group is doing very important work and a great service to humanity by nothing less than reevaluating our whole knowledge base, which will eventually and hopefully revolutionize our lives for the better. However that said I would like to caution against trying too lump all these perceived anomalies as some sort of benign holistic salvation of humanity. I am sure that all things in the universe are balanced, the old Yin and Yang. Therefore we must be careful in embracing untested and unknown anomalies as all simple being holistic or we might open a door for something that we might later regret. I think it would be more beneficial to figure out what kind of technological possibilities the theory of Electric Universe opens up. The technological breakthroughs will have a great immediate impact and benefit to humanity.
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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby moses » Sun Aug 31, 2008 4:52 am

Therefore we must be careful in embracing untested and unknown anomalies as all simple being holistic or we might open a door for something that we might later regret. I think it would be more beneficial to figure out what kind of technological possibilities the theory of Electric Universe opens up. The technological breakthroughs will have a great immediate impact and benefit to humanity. Influx

Of course the big issue is that an easy method of creating big bombs arises
from some new theory. The greatest benefit to humanity would be a way to
rid ourselves of the influence of the traumatic past. Without this we shall
eventually surely destroy each other. Our god is economic growth. This is a
false god. What can you see as a beneficial technological breakthrough ?
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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby Influx » Sun Aug 31, 2008 6:00 am

Being an avid reader of the Thunderblog, for I myself do not agree with the main stream dogmatic and brainwashed scientific community, I can see numerous possibilities and ideas for incredible technology for the benefit of humanity. Mainly the possibilities of cheap easy space access for the masses to truly set the mentioned masses free. The earth is overpopulated, overcrowded and because of our current pitiful state of the energy and transportation industry, no matter how holistic and enlightened we get, strife and war will not cease. I believe that the EU theory points to technology that will enable humans to massively colonize space and reach for the stars. Because of deliberate or mistaken blunders made in the foundations of modern science, as EU points out, humanity has become stale and stagnant, we are turning inwards to devour ourselves. A massive exodus, a literal stampede of humanity into space will do wonders for the stability, survival and prosperity of the human race for all ages. This is the kind of technology that I see in the glimmer of the theory of EU.
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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby Solar » Sun Aug 31, 2008 7:34 am

Influx wrote: Because of deliberate or mistaken blunders made in the foundations of modern science, as EU points out, humanity has become stale and stagnant, we are turning inwards to devour ourselves. A massive exodus, a literal stampede of humanity into space will do wonders for the stability, survival and prosperity of the human race for all ages. This is the kind of technology that I see in the glimmer of the theory of EU.


My apologies in advance and no offense intended but this sounds so defeatist. Where is all of this 'Stop the world; I want to get off' stuff coming from? You seem to be saying that humanity can't or didn't make things work out on earth so lets all get off the globe and go into space and everything will suddenly magically change for the better because of ... location?

I don't think so. A 'negative' state of mind on earth is the same where ever it goes. Where ever you go; there you are. I for one would have to be forced to go live off planet. I'm not going to trade laying under a shade tree on a crisp 75 degree day for zero gravity and the chance of a pin hole in my space suit from micro-meteors.

See this keyboard. I just got one. Someone is going to catch pure hell trying to tear me away from it to go live off-world. Of course I could run outside and bash someone over the head with it also. I could make the same choice if I lived on Venus and neither the blinding technology within it, nor being a 'Venusian', would've helped me to change my mind now would it?

Technological advancements may have *some* benefits to alleiviating such negative human tendencies but it's by no means the salvation of humanity as some make it out to be. Ever hear of "cyber crime", ID theft, hackers? A new technology (computers) with great benefits to humanity used in dark ways manners. BY CHOICE!!!

One's physical location within the cosmos will not change this. I hope this isn't going to be the real estate angle of future real estate agents to colonize other planets. I don't feel like 'starting over' on a new globe when there is nothing wrong with this one. Learn to see the beauty of life from where ever you are mate.
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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby Michael Goodspeed » Sun Aug 31, 2008 7:55 am

Influx wrote:However that said I would like to caution against trying too lump all these perceived anomalies as some sort of benign holistic salvation of humanity. I am sure that all things in the universe are balanced, the old Yin and Yang. Therefore we must be careful in embracing untested and unknown anomalies as all simple being holistic or we might open a door for something that we might later regret.


I'm not sure I understand your point -- and I'm a bit confused by your use of the word "benign". If you're suggesting that extrasensory abilities have potential "malevolent" misuses (and my apologies if I'm misunderstanding you), I suppose I agree with you (the interest of military super powers in remote viewing is sufficient demonstration of that point). But I don't believe it's correct to describe the phenomena I discuss in the piece as "anomalous" -- they are far too commonplace to warrant such a label. Nor do I think it's correct to describe psychic abilities as "untested" -- they've been widely tested, although most every time a scientist -- no matter how accredited -- has found "positive" results, the pseudoskeptical community has responded with ad hominem or even outright lies. See earlier presentation on Dr. Sheldrake, http://www.thunderbolts.info/mmarchives/081308_ext_animals.htm

Not everyone will agree on the real significance and human ramifications of these phenomena (as you don't apparently like or agree with my use of the word "holistic.") But the absolute first priority of the scientific establishment must be to relent with the pathological, institutional resistance to fair and open discussion of the issues. Again, if you are saying that potential for real danger exists in so-called "paranormal" phenomena, I agree -- but the greatest danger can only come from DENIAL.

Consider this quote from Colonel Dolan M. McKelvy, his abstract from the 1988 USAF-funded scientific study, "Psychic Warfare: Exploring the Mind Frontier."

"Man's greatest potential remains a prisoner of man. Vast untapped mental capabilities create an entirely new battlefield dimension which, if ignored, pose a threat to self and country more serious than nuclear weapons. This threat starts from within. Our fears and cynical attitudes towards psychic capabilities make us our own worst enemies…. Exploring the mind frontier is essential and the key to successful exploration is a greater psychic awareness. The mind is rich in unfathomed resources ripe for exploration, a limitless source of treasures for advancing all mankind, and a serious threat to those who ignore its potential. We must overcome our psychic inhibitions, stop denying the existence of paranormal events, and start trying instead to understand the nature of these phenomena..." Story: http://www.rense.com/general77/more.htm
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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby Divinity » Sun Aug 31, 2008 3:25 pm

All of the above evidence speaks for a universe in which life is connected by invisible forces. It seems strange that so many 'science apologists' express contempt for a POV that views life as less limited, more meaningful, and with far more potential for beauty and greatness. And no "wishful thinking" is required to accept this POV. Not only do all of the facts speak for a more holistic reality, this is the only reality that any sane person can prefer.

How does all of this relate to our exploration of the Electric Universe? This question is best answered by Wallace Thornhill in his (increasingly prescient) essay,
2008 -- Year of the Electric Universe:
A real cosmology must reunite the sciences, humanities and the arts. It cannot be limited to astronomy. It must give real meaning to Life. It is becoming clear to more and more scholars and the questioning public from around the world that the Electric Universe offers such a broad vista of future science. It is time to get started in 2008. We have no time to lose.
Michael Goodspeed


Taken from Michael's article...many thanks Michael and Dave for raising these issues in this new thread. It's a wonderful article, Michael, and I admire your open mind and candid approach to Wal's vision. You have described exactly why I'm here on the forum. Indeed, a more holistic reality IS the only reality that any sane person can prefer. It's up to those sane people to create that reality together - it's time for us to take responsibility and to put ourselves in positions where we glean the knowledge and wisdom necessary to do that. Understanding the correct mechanics of the Universe is a major contributory factor to healing a disillusioned world where knowledge, hope and empowerment is now so vital.:D

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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby Influx » Sun Aug 31, 2008 3:56 pm

My apologies If I was not clear, but technology itself is neutral, it is not evil or good, but it is being used for both, for great evil and good. This point is clear. However when it comes to paranormal events and psychic abilities, to me, it is not clear from where this abilities come from. Granted some of it may be internal and part of human biology albeit ignored, but some of it, and I great deal seems to be external. It is this external part that worries me. There could be incomprehensible evil spiritual forces at work an this planet. If we in our ignorance get entangled with them, who will help us. Then again this could be just my religious brain washing talking. I am not saying that we ignore this field altogether rather just take it slow and use caution.

Yes I am a defeatist and a “stop the world I want to get off” kind of guy, but I am also a realist. The entire world more or less wants the life style that we in have America. Can this planet support two Americas? Three? Ten? Twenty? The planet resources are stretched thin as it is and most of the worlds population lives in abject poverty and stomach gnawing hunger. Developing psychic abilities is great, they may help a nation in the fight for their survival when massive resources wars begin. But how will the feed and clothe the billions. We need new technology for the generation and distribution of massive quantities of clean, cheap and unlimited energy to every corner of the world. This would be of immediate use to the poor and the starving. Desalinating water would be practical and affordable, deserts would become farms. A fed and clothed person is much less to want to be a terrorist and is much more likly to want to get the cool keyboard and make music.I see EU as a way of complimenting this.
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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby Influx » Sun Aug 31, 2008 7:48 pm

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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby Solar » Sun Aug 31, 2008 8:50 pm

:!: YES!

Please see related thread Eric Lerner's Focus Fusion Lecture

I'd like to get to Goodspeed's article. My apologies Michael for getting sidetracked.

I think that this article points to latent abilities within humanity and each individual. In relation to this I think there is an interesting re-evaluation by traditional egyptologist that speaks to the beauty and power that can be wrought when such faculties can be activated and actualized. Case in point the pyramids of Giza:

"The building of the Great Pyramid can provide us with important insights into the reign of Khufu. From the political side, it shows how Khufu controlled the wealth and the population of the country. He organized households all over Egypt into participating in the building of the pyramid, and providing the king with food (grain and beer), and with laborers. This organization reveals that the pyramid was the national project of the nation." - Dr. Zahi Hawass Secretary General of the Supreme Council of Antiquities

These were not "tombs" dedicated to egotistical pharaohs. The same ineffable quality that imbues those factors cited in the article seem 'sensed' by many to have been a, if not *the*, operative factor providing the impetus to bring forth the Giza plateau. I often hear "catastrophism" mentioned and I often wonder if the pyramids are a post catastrophic expression of 'holistic healing' from whence a greater realization was then spread throughout the world. A realization that then had to be immortalized in stone and art requiring the actualization of that particular dormant faculty, as cited via the article, in order to "read" and understand.

That sounds "esoteric". However, as pointed out, the nature of these things only seem uneasy because of the subsequent skepticism with which the positive testing of these abilities was met.

Well done and very interesting.
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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby lizzie » Sun Aug 31, 2008 9:26 pm

Dave Smith said: If you've been reading these pages for any length of time, you've likely noticed that the Thunderbolts team has never indulged in "esoteric" speculations in their discussions of the Electric Universe.


Esoteric
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esoteric

Esoteric knowledge is that which is available only to a narrow circle of "enlightened", "initiated", or specially educated people. In Western, English-speaking societies today, the term, "esotericism," is not necessarily used in the sense of mystical knowledge or practice, but has come informally to mean any perception or knowledge that is difficult to understand or remember, such as theoretical physics.


Therefore, theoretical physics is esoteric knowledge.

Dave Smith said: Although the managers of this site have received countless inquiries from readers who wonder, "What does all this MEAN?" -- i.e. what are the philosophical ramifications, if any, of a cosmology in which electricity, not gravity, dominates


Holism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holism

Holism is the idea that all the properties of a given system (biological, chemical, social, economic, mental, linguistic, etc.) cannot be determined or explained by its component parts alone. Instead, the system as a whole determines in an important way how the parts behave
.

Therefore, the unified field theory is a holistic cosmology.

Influx said: Not everyone will agree on the real significance and human ramifications of these phenomena (as you don't apparently like or agree with my use of the word "holistic.") But the absolute first priority of the scientific establishment must be to relent with the pathological, institutional resistance to fair and open discussion of the issues. Again, if you are saying that potential for real danger exists in so-called "paranormal" phenomena, I agree -- but the greatest danger can only come from DENIAL


Denial
http://www.nh-dwi.com/caip-202.htm

Denial is the psychological process by which human beings protect themselves from things which threaten them by blocking knowledge of those things from their awareness. It is a defense which distorts reality; it keeps us from feeling the pain and uncomfortable truth about things we do not want to face. If we cannot feel or see the consequences of our actions, then everything is fine and we can continue to live without making any changes.


Therefore, a person will deny any information that threatens his belief system whether the knowledge is good, bad or "indifferent".

What does the preponderance of legitimate independent scientific research prove? Yes? No? Possibly? Ridiculous! Bring back gravity! :D
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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby moses » Sun Aug 31, 2008 9:35 pm

We need new technology for the generation and distribution of massive quantities of clean, cheap and unlimited energy to every corner of the world. Influx
People would use this energy for evil purposes. Why is that ?
I put it to you that all this evil is a result of the traumatic experiences
that our ancestors went through, and the subsequent struggle to survive
in new environmental circumstances. Our DNA was changed either through
actual genetic change or through epigenetic changes where the supply of
proteins becomes altered. Recently I was reading where raspberry altered
the epigenetic expression of hundreds of genes, suggesting it might be
useful in cancer treatment. What is of interest is that these epigenetic
changes can be passed on to one's offspring. And trauma changes gene
expression - big time ! Thus the DNA of people before the catastophies
would have been epigenetically very different to today's DNA - and these
differences are the main source of evil today.

So we change our DNA to heal, or maybe we reverse the effects and return
to our ancestor's DNA. Now this may well be technologically possible. Of
course there are many changes to DNA that allow us to adapt better to the
present environment. But healing is our main task. Getting smarter is not.
Smarter people are just better at killing and destruction. And yet within
each of us resides something special. But the actions and feelings of us are
easily controlled by gene expression which is induced by the immediate
circumstances. Get rid of this and then we can use that special something
that we have, or rather what we really are.

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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby davesmith_au » Sun Aug 31, 2008 9:54 pm

Lizzie, um, er, it was Michael Goodspeed who's quotes you are attributing to me, and also his who's quotes you attributed to Influx... Whilst I posted the Thunderblog notice as I always do, the passage of text comes directly from the Thunderblog referenced, not from me. Just thought I'd straighten those points out, for the record.

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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby Influx » Mon Sep 01, 2008 12:01 am

Mosses said.

"So we change our DNA to heal, or maybe we reverse the effects and return
to our ancestor's DNA."


How will we heal our DNA or have it returned to what it was in the times of our ancestors? Psychically? Using esoteric knowledge? Who's to say our ancestors DNA was any better of? Are we to assume that our spirit, our emotions, our desires, both good and bad are the products of chemistry? If so than DNA itself, that is, the information encoded in it is the product of it's environment. People living in war zones subjected to violence daily will not develop peaceful tendencies. The same violent tendencies will be passed down to their children, by both, the nurture and nature processes. The violent conditions, wars, strife and hunger are the results of shortage of natural resources an this planet! We in the western world live in relative peace, stability and wealth because of our abundance of cheap food and consumer goods. If you speak of returning to the Saturnian golden age by somehow rewinding our DNA, then let me remind you that the golden age was not only about enlightenment but also of materialistic abundance.

Mosses said

"But the actions and feelings of us are
easily controlled by gene expression which is induced by the immediate
circumstances. Get rid of this and then we can use that special something
that we have, or rather what we really are."


So lets start drugging ourselves in hopes that we are better off as a race? Or psychically mind-hack ourselves and our DNA? The biggest step towards healing is providing humane living conditions for our fellow human beings!

Lizzie said.

"Therefore, a person will deny any information that threatens his belief system whether the knowledge is good, bad or "indifferent".

I am not I denial, you should now that "new" knowledge and ideas be they esoteric or not, does not mean that by default they are better than the current ones! :roll:
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Re: An Holistic Cosmology For the 21st Century

Unread postby davesmith_au » Mon Sep 01, 2008 12:26 am

Influx wrote:The violent conditions, wars, strife and hunger are the results of shortage of natural resources an this planet!


Um, then how do you explain all the wars which have happened through the eons which were NOT the result of a lack of resources... Most wars are the result of one ideology being held to be more valid than another, greed, etc that is, they are mostly political in origin and have little or nothing to do with resourses per se. And before anyone jumps up and down about 'oil wars' or 'energy wars' etc, I am speaking generally and primarily here about pre modern age wars.

Probably better to steer discussion back towards the subject than to get bogged down over who's right and who's wrong, that may only spark a war...

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