Comet Elenin—the Debate that Never Happened...

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Re: Comet Elenin—the Debate that Never Happened...

Unread postby Aardwolf » Thu Oct 27, 2011 10:16 am

starbiter wrote:Hello Aardwolf: In my last post i stated that a repeat of the Carrington might not melt printed circuits [PC}. Above You ask why it would. I'm not certain an Electromagnetic pulse [EMP] wouldn't melt printed circuits, are You.?
Incorrect, you stated it might melt printed circuits not that it might not.

starbiter wrote:During the Carrington Event [CE} only telegraph operators were burned and injured. I never stated the telegraph system was destroyed. Please. Things have changed slightly since 1859. It's transformers and electronics that are vulnerable, not so much the wires.
Even when the battery power was removed the system remained energized. That is a clue.
Utility companies have been aware of the problems caused by CME’s for decades. It might take a handful out but not sufficiently enough to reduce the population from billions to millions.

starbiter wrote:We have become dependent on a highly sophisticated system requiring electricity and printed circuits. Without these the food that feeds the 2 billion people without electricity would diminish greatly. Water also. Without PC the transportation system would grind to a halt. Logistics would become impossible for the needs of 7 billion.
The 2 billion I refered to are not spoon fed by the rest of the world. They live off the land as well as it can sustain them. The modern world relies on the infrastructure but you have not sufficiently explained the reasoning behind the total loss of electricity and printed circuits.

starbiter wrote:The consequences of an EMP could be mitigated by disconnecting the grid. If more people were aware of EU concepts we would be better prepared now.
The people that matter are fully aware of it due to their previous CME experiences.

starbiter wrote:Unfortunately a CME from the Sun isn't the only option for an EMP. It seems stars have a nasty habit of ejecting gas giants on occasion. At least that is an option in an EU. Or stars occasionally fission creating a binary system. Gas giants are reported to have ejected huge comets and planets. The consequences are part of myth and legend. It was a nightmare for people without a dependency on electricity, as far as we know. We are probably more vulnerable.
That a different matter entirely.

starbiter wrote:I've never said technology wouldn't return without a grid and electronics. It's just the consequences of the time lag.
The grid in Quebec was knocked out by a CME for 9 hours in 1989. Is that long enough to kill 6 billion +?

starbiter wrote:It could be thousands of years before the next electrical event. Tens of thousands with any luck. Or tomorrow.
The sun produces on average around 2-3 CME’s a week.

starbiter wrote:Dr Velikovsky wrote a book called Mankind in Amnesia. The premise is that people couldn't handle the idea of such vulnerability. They suppressed the memory of what had just transpired, Venus/Mars, into a morality play. Reality was too much. We, the descendants of the survivors inherit this problem. It explains the reluctance of people to entertain the possibility of catastrophe. It touches a nerve.
On the contrary Nuclear War, Nuclear Winter, Global Cooling, Global Warming, Global Climate Disruption, Bird Flu, Ozone Layer Depletion, DDT, Peak Oil etc. etc., the list goes on; are evidence that mankind is more than happy to entertain possibilities of catastrophe even when there’s no genuine scientific or logical reason to do so. Normally it’s politically driven and perpetuated by alarmists or individuals with vested interests.
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Re: Comet Elenin—the Debate that Never Happened...

Unread postby starbiter » Thu Oct 27, 2011 10:37 am

Aardwolf wrote:
starbiter wrote:Hello Aardwolf: In my last post i stated that a repeat of the Carrington might not melt printed circuits [PC}. Above You ask why it would. I'm not certain an Electromagnetic pulse [EMP] wouldn't melt printed circuits, are You.?
Incorrect, you stated it might melt printed circuits not that it might not.

Me again,
Excuse me, i should have said two posts ago.


starbiter
[...]Wed Oct 26, 2011 4:43 pm


I'm not sure printed circuits would be vulnerable during a Carrington like event. Hopefully not. Something similar to the Chicago fire where coins melted would probably melt printed circuits. That was a more local event, although spread over three states.
I Ching #49 The Image
Fire in the lake: the image of REVOLUTION
Thus the superior man
Sets the calender in order
And makes the seasons clear

www.EU-geology.com

http://www.michaelsteinbacher.com
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Re: Comet Elenin—the Debate that Never Happened...

Unread postby Osmosis » Tue Mar 27, 2012 8:36 am

Has anyone ever figured out what the frequency of the synchrotron-generated inductive heating would have to be, to melt coins?
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Re: Comet Elenin—the Debate that Never Happened...

Unread postby Sparky » Tue Mar 27, 2012 10:25 am

Why will the next one destroy everything, plugged in or not?


A large enough EMP will induce enough EMF to cause arcing, which could burn wiring. But a smaller EMP would induce enough of a voltage to destroy the chips modern electronics depends on. I don't mean to say the chip will explode or burn, just be rendered inoperative by it's internal circuits shorted or burned open.

You can destroy a chip by just touching it! They are electrically fragile, but mechanically more robust than vacuum tubes!

If anyone has a concern about a coming CME, put the electronics in a metal gargage can and close the lid. The electronics in a vehicle ar another thing! You may beable to remove them, but may need special equipment to get them up and running when reinstalled.!

As for CME/EMP protection, designed into our infrastructure, some of it may work, but taking out a few key transformers would compromise, if not shut down the grid.

Most CME's require long antenna, such as power or phone lines in order to accumulate enough energy to cause problems.

Oh, if you have a pace maker, get a larger garbage can!! ;)
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"Doubt is not an agreeable condition, but certainty is an absurd one."
"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire
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Re: Comet Elenin—the Debate that Never Happened...

Unread postby kiwi » Thu Feb 21, 2013 3:07 pm

Michael (Starbiter) ... hiya mate :D

couple of links here you may enjoy, great reference on historically archived time-line of Solar Storm events ( not totally complete but still the best collection and formatted archive Ive seen)

http://www.solarstorms.org/SRefStorms.html


The Second link is a sub-link from the Carrington event which is first to appear on link above

http://www.solarstorms.org/SS1859.html

Interesting this "snip" quoted below ... Cholera epidemic of 1833? .. what happened in 1883?

'The City' Change of Weather '…Towards half past eight o'clock a singular phenomenon took place. The horizon from north to north east became of a deep crimson hue, which expanding slowly, made the sky appear as if lighted by a Bengal fire…At first it was supposed that some great conflagration had taken place on the outskirts of the city, but it was soon recognized that no natural firs could produce this particular hue…Crowds of people gathered at the street corners, admiring and commenting upon the singular spectacle. Many took it to be the sign of some great disaster or important event, siting numerous instances when such warnings have been given. Several old women were nearly frightened to death, thinking it announced the end of the world, and immediately took to saying their prayers. A fat old citizen tremblingly stated that this was the avant courier of a dreadful epidemic like cholera of 1833, whilst a French gentleman pooh-poohed, and gravely assured us that this was the well known sign of a revolution in Paris, requesting us to make a note of the date. [New Orleans Daily Picayune, p.5]



. The meteor storm of 1833 was of truly superlative strength. One estimate is over one hundred thousand meteors an hour,[8] but another, done as the storm abated, estimated in excess of two hundred thousand meteors an hour[1] over the entire region of North America east of the Rocky Mountains. It was marked by the Native Americans,[9][10] slaves like Harriet Tubman and Frederick Douglass and slave-owners[11][12] and others.[13] Near Independence, Missouri, it was taken as a sign to push the growing Mormon community out of the area.[14]


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leonids

Cheers Kiwi
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Re: Comet Elenin—the Debate that Never Happened...

Unread postby starbiter » Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:55 am

Thanks Kiwi,

It appears we live in an Electric Universe.

michael
I Ching #49 The Image
Fire in the lake: the image of REVOLUTION
Thus the superior man
Sets the calender in order
And makes the seasons clear

www.EU-geology.com

http://www.michaelsteinbacher.com
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