Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Beyond the boundaries of established science an avalanche of exotic ideas compete for our attention. Experts tell us that these ideas should not be permitted to take up the time of working scientists, and for the most part they are surely correct. But what about the gems in the rubble pile? By what ground-rules might we bring extraordinary new possibilities to light?

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GaryN
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by GaryN » Mon Jan 09, 2012 3:33 pm

Dark energy and matter. Nonsense!
But, but...
Clearest picture yet of dark matter points the way to better understanding of dark energy
http://www.physorg.com/news/2012-01-cle ... nergy.html
Astronomers map the universe's dark matter at unprecedented scale
Image
http://www.physorg.com/news/2012-01-ast ... scale.html
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller

flyingcloud
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by flyingcloud » Tue Jan 10, 2012 3:08 pm

just like that Seinfeld episode with the 3-d picture,

you need to lose your focus ;)

mjv1121
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by mjv1121 » Thu Jan 12, 2012 11:17 am

Jeffrey,
Jeffrey wrote:With my theory, we can SEE the stages that the star undergoes as it gives off energy and loses mass, via E=MC^2.
Just one thought among many, but you do know that E=mc2 is a result of Special Relativity, which is an illogical, deluded load of nonsense. Any theory that relies on E=mc2 has strangled itself at birth.

Incidentally, you've kind of got it back to front. Instead of thinking of planets as small stars, you would do better to think of stars as large planets.

Just trying to help out, you can thank me later.

Michael

Sparky
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by Sparky » Sat Jan 21, 2012 7:47 pm

Jeffrey wrote:
With my theory, we can SEE the stages that the star undergoes as it gives off energy and loses mass, via E=MC^2.
Jeffery, Michael can explain this much better than i can, but E=MC^2 says that the Energy in Matter, is because matter is moving. This means that in order to remove energy from a star, matter must do it. Our sun throws off billions of tons of matter, and when it strikes Earth, the energy in it is transfered to other matter and is manifest in auroras and other radiation. Energy does not move by itself. Indeed, it does not exist outside of matter. It's just a math thing.. ;)

So, if a planet continues to shrink, there must be a mechanical mechanism for matter to be removed from it.

Follow the evidence. ;)
"It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong."
"Doubt is not an agreeable condition, but certainty is an absurd one."
"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire

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JeffreyW
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by JeffreyW » Mon Jan 23, 2012 8:10 pm

nick c wrote:
JeffreyW wrote:The moon is a stellar core. The radiometric dating samples from the Apollo mission brought back pieces of the moon that were up to 26+ billion years old.

The moon is the core of a star that was born and died long before the Earth fully formed a crust. This is why there are "lava oceans" on only one side of the moon. The Earth was heating that side of the moon up. Mystery solved.
Are you familiar with the Electric Universe's attack upon radiometric dating, especially in a situation such as the lunar surface which has been sculpted by enormous electrical discharges?
JeffreyW wrote:You can thank me later.
:roll:
sculpted by enormous electrical discharges? sure! The sun does this. The earth was a star the size of the sun when it adopted the moon. I've already gone over this.
http://vixra.org/pdf/1711.0206v4.pdf The Main Book on Stellar Metamorphosis, Version 4

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JeffreyW
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by JeffreyW » Mon Jan 23, 2012 8:13 pm

Aristarchus wrote:
Sparky wrote:Your hypothesis is nonsense. You even contradict yourself!

Come up with a better thought out hypothesis, with less bombast in presentation, and I'll consider it.
With all due respect, Sparky, I don't neccesarily adhere to what is being advanced by JefferyW, but perhaps the discussion would be better served with a proper discourse for presenting an argument.

Remember ...

"Sit down before fact like a little child, and be prepared to give up every preconceived notion. Follow humbly wherever and to whatever abyss Nature leads, or you shall learn nothing." ~ Thomas Henry Huxley
Hehehe. Stages of truth.
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident. -Arthur Schopenhauer

Better hypothesis? None is better Sir! :mrgreen:
http://vixra.org/pdf/1711.0206v4.pdf The Main Book on Stellar Metamorphosis, Version 4

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JeffreyW
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by JeffreyW » Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:39 am

Per wikipedia on their "planets" page:

"It is not known with certainty how planets are formed."

The nebular hypothesis is their best theory.

I have replaced it.

The stellar metamorphosis theory. Stars cool and shrink. We can see this happening in our own solar system. They are called "planets". They are not planets, they are cooling stars. When they completely cool, they leave over their iron cores. Most moons are stellar cores, they were once very large hot stars.

We are done! Now humanity has progressed a little further!
http://vixra.org/pdf/1711.0206v4.pdf The Main Book on Stellar Metamorphosis, Version 4

Sparky
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by Sparky » Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:02 am

Jeffrey, you continue to offer no evidence to support your hypothesis, which, on the face of it, is nonsense. But, I am willing to listen and consider ANY evidence at all which would tend to support your hypothesis.

Do you understand the scientific method?

Your claims to have special insight into how planets and moons are formed, with no supporting evidence that it is at all possible is not science, but belief/superstition. Are you attempting to gain a following in a Shrinking Suns cult? :)
"It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong."
"Doubt is not an agreeable condition, but certainty is an absurd one."
"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire

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JeffreyW
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by JeffreyW » Fri Jan 27, 2012 11:24 am

Sparky wrote:Jeffrey, you continue to offer no evidence to support your hypothesis, which, on the face of it, is nonsense. But, I am willing to listen and consider ANY evidence at all which would tend to support your hypothesis.

Do you understand the scientific method?

Your claims to have special insight into how planets and moons are formed, with no supporting evidence that it is at all possible is not science, but belief/superstition. Are you attempting to gain a following in a Shrinking Suns cult? :)
WTF? Cult? Lets get this record straight right now! According to your "plasma" people, the sun spits out fully formed planets. Show me a picture/movie of this happening and I'll show you the "cult", that is based on belief/superstitious ideas!

With my theory we can SEE the evidence. Stars = planets! All the stars in our solar system are different stages of metamorphosis, (the process by which the newly formed material cools and combines to make ALL THE DAMN MOLECULES ON EARTH!) They are all different ages and all were born in different areas of the galaxy <moderator edit>!

Why do you think Uranus and Neptune have offset axis's? They came from somewhere else! Why do you think Triton orbits retrograde? It came from somewhere else!

My theory unwittingly, debunks both standard cosmology AND plasma cosmology regarding planet formation ONLY! It is not a freggin cult! Did the person who said, "the Earth is round" try to establish a freggin cult, or did they just state something that is obvious as hell?

Plus you can NOT use the scientific method argument to debunk my argument on planet formation, because if you wikipedia "planet", it states only HYPOTHESIS concerning planet formation, and it is currently NOT KNOWN HOW PLANETS ARE FORMED!! I just told you! All planets are just much cooler stars! When they cool completely their iron cores and silicate crusts will be left over. YOU ARE STANDING ON THE CORE OF AN ANCIENT STAR THAT IS STILL COOLING!

<moderator edit>
Last edited by nick c on Tue Mar 06, 2012 5:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: ad hom remarks removed
http://vixra.org/pdf/1711.0206v4.pdf The Main Book on Stellar Metamorphosis, Version 4

Sparky
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by Sparky » Fri Jan 27, 2012 12:07 pm

With my theory we can SEE the evidence. Stars = planets!
I guess we are looking at different universes.

I"m still waiting for evidence. A hypothesis needs to be proven.
It needs supporting evidence. Where is your supportive evidence that can not be explained by another theory?

EU has supportive evidence and can make predictions that other theories can not do. That is science.

A wild, unsupported belief is superstition.
Show me a picture/movie of this happening and I'll show you the "cult", that is based on belief/superstitious ideas!
errrr, wouldn't documented evidence, such as a movie, be supportive scientific evidence for EU? :roll:
Why do you think Uranus and Neptune have offset axis's? They came from somewhere else! Why do you think Triton orbits retrograde? It came from somewhere else!
Possible, but there are also other theories for this: search
http://www.milesmathis.com/index.html

Dense? Yes...probably born that way. But, making an effort to overcome genetic deficiency. We all have something to overcome, don't we? :oops:

Maybe wiki , "scientific method." If you are interested in science, hypothesis, theory, model, etc... 8-)
"It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong."
"Doubt is not an agreeable condition, but certainty is an absurd one."
"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire

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JeffreyW
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by JeffreyW » Tue Mar 06, 2012 11:41 am

Hypothesis being proven? Since when does science require "proof"? Hypothesis are educated guesses that get refined. Nowhere "proof" is needed. Take that to your religion/math nonsense. Science is not math or religion with their proofs and truths.

Science is explanation. If the explanation is bogus or does not make any sense, then we can throw it out.

No where in "plasma cosmology" does it explain how granite is formed. Yet I make sandwhiches on it everyday.

With GTSM I can explain scientifically how the "planets/moons/exoplanets" are formed and even how really specific things like how "granite" is formed. Stars simply cool and combine elements into molecules. Viola! There is your Wolynski style scientific revolution.

Jupiter Saturn Uranus and Neptune are currently combining elements into molecules. Hell, we can see this process with our eyes even!
http://vixra.org/pdf/1711.0206v4.pdf The Main Book on Stellar Metamorphosis, Version 4

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JeffreyW
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by JeffreyW » Tue Mar 06, 2012 11:43 am

Do not refer me to wikipedia either here is their stance on planet formation:

"It is not known for certain how planets are formed".

They will ignore me anyways. Who cares about them? They still believe in things like big bang and black holes.
http://vixra.org/pdf/1711.0206v4.pdf The Main Book on Stellar Metamorphosis, Version 4

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nick c
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by nick c » Tue Mar 06, 2012 5:43 pm

Jeffrey W,
I had to remove two offensive characterizations of a personal nature concerning a fellow forum member from your post earlier in this thread.
Please read the forum rules and guidelines here.
Always treat fellow users, moderators and site administrators with respect. Users come here to discuss matters of common interest in an environment of friendliness and freedom from abuse......
.....Personal or ad hominem attacks will not be tolerated, under any circumstances. If you disagree with something which has been posted, address the post, not the poster.
If you have any questions or need a clarification, feel free to PM me.

Nick

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JeffreyW
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by JeffreyW » Wed Mar 14, 2012 3:08 pm

You think science is supposed to be full of rainbows and glitter? Lol
http://vixra.org/pdf/1711.0206v4.pdf The Main Book on Stellar Metamorphosis, Version 4

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nick c
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Re: Jupiter/Saturn are brown dwarf stars, not planets.

Unread post by nick c » Wed Mar 14, 2012 5:12 pm

JeffreyW wrote:You think science is supposed to be full of rainbows and glitter? Lol
There will be no science if rational discussion is replaced with name calling.
Please address the issues and not the poster.

Nick

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