New Insight Or A Mad Idea (Craters)

Beyond the boundaries of established science an avalanche of exotic ideas compete for our attention. Experts tell us that these ideas should not be permitted to take up the time of working scientists, and for the most part they are surely correct. But what about the gems in the rubble pile? By what ground-rules might we bring extraordinary new possibilities to light?

Moderators: MGmirkin, bboyer

New Insight Or A Mad Idea (Craters)

Unread postby perpetual motion » Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:44 pm

This may or probably will sound way off track, but here we go.
Oh, and by the way this is about craters.
I know, I know, Bolide or Plasma is the name of the game in
the theories of crater holes. But, think a little on this one.
If and when the mantle of this planet was in sort of a
liquid state and rolling and foaming about with lots of water
and air mixed into it, then some or all of either water or
air was separated and gotten trapped underground in cracks,
caverns, or just an air pocket under the surface would create,
after things settled down somewhat, and pressure started to
build up (maybe) from solidification to create a small to large
size blow hole.
Really winded on that one. What I’am trying to say is no one
has seen a Bolide hit or a Plasma strike or in my wildest guess
what I would call Blow Holes. Anyone else ever think about
this Mad Idea.
perpetual motion
 
Posts: 137
Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2008 9:04 pm

Re: New Insight Or A Mad Idea (Craters)

Unread postby EarthOrbitAsteroids » Tue Jun 20, 2017 4:08 pm

I absolutely love off track perpetual mo... it's the only place where hidden truths can be found staring back at you in plain sight.

Yamal B1 with the scalloped edges is an obvious candidate for an electrical discharge crater as is Yamal B3 the 4 meter wide 60 to 100 meter deep perfectly tapered cone found 'drilled into' in solid ice. The methane hydrate/natural gas hypothesis forwarded by the global warmists is going to have a great deal of difficulty explaining that one lol!

'According to local residents, the hole formed on 27 September 2013. 'Observers give several versions. According to the first, initially at the place was smoking, and then there was a bright flash. In the second version, a celestial body fell there.'

Image

B3 can be found here...

Image


"The third crater and hole is in the Taymyr Peninsula and was accidentally discovered by reindeer herders who almost fell into it, in the vicinity of the remote outpost of Nosok.The funnel is a perfectly formed cone, say locals who are mystified over its formation. Its depth is estimated at between 200 to 330ft (60 to 100 metres) and its diameter - more than 13ft (four metres). Experts - geologists, ecologists, and historians - have not come to a consensus about the origin of the funnel, say reports in the region. 'It is not like this is the work of men, but also doesn't look like natural formation,' said one account expressing puzzlement at its creation."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... rness.html


At around the same time on September 27th a small asteroid 'flew' past the earth through the outer Van Allen belt which of course almost links back to earth practically directly above where the craters occurred.

A surprise asteroid which was only spotted by scientists on Friday night, Sept 27, 2013, narrowly missed the Earth just hours later, flying within the orbit of geostationary satellites.

"(The asteroid) was discovered on Friday night by our station near Lake Baikal and nine hours later it flew within 11,300 kilometers of the Earth surface, below the orbit of geostationary satellites. It was about 15 meters in size," said Vladimir Lipunov of the Moscow State University and the Sternberg Astronomical Institute.


Image

Proof positive? Perhaps not... but I am still waiting to hear how a global warming induced explosion 60-100 meters below the ground blew out a perfectly tapered funnel crater out of solid ice... and where did the oxygen for the explosion come from by the way? lol!
EarthOrbitAsteroids
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2017 6:34 pm

Re: New Insight Or A Mad Idea (Craters)

Unread postby nick c » Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:43 pm

Velikovsky later theorized (possibly influenced by Juergens) that rayed craters such as Tycho, Copernicus, Aristarchus, and others originated in interplanetary discharges. However, he thought that most other craters were formed by bubbling of a molten lunar surface. The bubbles filled with gases would collapse forming a crater.
In Worlds In Collision (1950) p.361 he wrote:
During these catastrophes the moon's surface flowed with lava and bubbled into great circular formations, which rapidly cooled off in the long lunar night, unprotected by an atmosphere from the coolness of cosmic spaces. In these cosmic collisions or near contacts the surface of the moon was also marked with clefts and rifts.


i personally think that interplanetary electrical discharges are responsible for most planetary features especially craters. However, I would expect that impacts and bubbling would also play a role as cosmic catastrophes would provide a wealth of opportunities and changing conditions for a variety of causes to explain observed surface features.

But let us not forget that craters have been observed formed in a lab due to EDM (Electric Discharge Machining) albeit at a much smaller scale. But then plasma processes are scalable.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WB_EKVWgbj8

also:
Joseph Priestly, as early as 1766, noticed the similarity between lunar craters and formations created by electrical discharges on various metallic surfaces, see p. 11 of this paper where Priestly is quoted:
https://www.osti.gov/scitech/servlets/purl/823201
June the 14th. I took the spot upon smooth pieces of lead and silver. It was, in both cases,
like that on the brass knob, only the silver consisted of dots disposed with the utmost exactness,
like radii from the center of the circle, each or which terminated a little short of the external
circle. Examining the spots with a microscope, both the shining dots that formed the central spot,
and those which formed the external circle, appeared evidently to consist of cavities, resembling
those on the moon, as they appear through a telescope,
the edges projecting shadows into them,
when they were held in the sun.” ([27], pp. 261, 262)

highlight added
User avatar
nick c
Moderator
 
Posts: 2241
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2008 8:12 pm
Location: connecticut

Re: New Insight Or A Mad Idea (Craters)

Unread postby Cargo » Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:46 am

Velikovsky says
were formed by bubbling of a molten lunar surface. The bubbles filled with gases would collapse forming a crater


I find this to be laughable and ridiculous. The lower part of the bubble would quickly return to a rolling molten state when the pressure of the gas in the bubble was released. What size of 'bubble' are talking about? lol I dare someone to try and recreate that. haha
Cargo
 
Posts: 123
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 2010 7:02 pm

Re: New Insight Or A Mad Idea (Craters)

Unread postby nick c » Wed Jun 21, 2017 8:25 am

Cargo wrote:I find this to be laughable and ridiculous. The lower part of the bubble would quickly return to a rolling molten state when the pressure of the gas in the bubble was released. What size of 'bubble' are talking about? lol I dare someone to try and recreate that. haha
Your quote is incorrectly attributed to Velikovsky, but is rather my summary of his proposal. That being said, the issue depends on how rapidly the surface was cooled. The viscosity would change as the dome was cooled, then when the dome collapses a crater would be formed. At least that is the theory. There are domes on the Moon. In the context of the bubbling theory these would be explained as uncollapsed domes.
see:
http://www.skyandtelescope.com/observin ... nar-domes/
Sky and Telesope wrote:Over 300 lunar domes are known, with many visible in amateur telescopes


If it were determined by future research that some of these domes are filled with gases, ie not solid, then that would support the theory.

Keep in mind that I only posted this because it is relevant to the original post in this thread. As I stated in my post, I am a proponent of EDM as the main agent for most planetary surface features especially craters.
User avatar
nick c
Moderator
 
Posts: 2241
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2008 8:12 pm
Location: connecticut

Re: New Insight Or A Mad Idea (Craters)

Unread postby perpetual motion » Fri Jun 23, 2017 9:42 pm

Ok, now, we may be getting into something wether it be
plasma or otherwise. Now that the mantle is in a muddy
consistency, how did the different types of rock become
separated in amongst all this mud? Then again, as I will
mention just one of them, agates. Now in this muddy
mess we have all the makings of most rock in a given
area.
So these blow holes spew this muddy mass up and about
into (which must have been some ungodly sub zero temp-
rature) to possibly get these agates to solidify to their
present mohs scale. Now these babies are one hard rock
to cut, but they are all over eastern Montana, South Dakota,
and in Brazil, South America. I don't know the terrain of
Brazil, but eastern Montana and the Dakota’s is pretty
much bentonite, gumbo, brackish goo of a soil if one
wants to call it that. Now then, I would like to know how
these got blown all over this place when there are no craters
to be seen (or blow holes). And pretty much on top of
this terrain.
Then some of the other theories say that these were created
further underground with greater pressure. So if these were
underground, with other hard gems, who or what uncover-
ed these at a specific depth so they are now on top of the
ground?
This goes with fossils, also very shallow.
Between what Geologists write and what one sees is not
copacetic.
Still can’t find any craters anywhere in amongst these
western states.
These items 'may be'(all theorists use this phrase) plasma
energized to get the right recipe to create a batch of muffins.
perpetual motion
 
Posts: 137
Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2008 9:04 pm

Re: New Insight Or A Mad Idea (Craters)

Unread postby kevin » Sat Jun 24, 2017 7:29 am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbRUsy7GDEg

Transmutation of mass?
By what?
Kevin
kevin
 
Posts: 1095
Joined: Sun Mar 23, 2008 10:17 am

Re: New Insight Or A Mad Idea (Craters)

Unread postby johnm33 » Thu Jun 29, 2017 2:14 pm

Those particular craters on the Yamal peninsular seem to be caused by slow bacterial action working on the residues left in the permafrost. If you take a look at the Siberian times there's lots of images, http://siberiantimes.com/search/?text=pingo&x=7&y=6 the crater pictured above clearly got off to two starts, judging by the 'cave' off to one side. Before i saw this crater i accepted the mainstream explanation of permafrost, that it was built up over millenia, but once i saw the apparent waves in the sides of this i checked out loads of permafrost images on google and it seemed that there were at least three types, this stuff with waves which is full of filth, what looks like pure ice and some that appears to have levelled off the top. It occured to me that the dirty stuff with waves through it could be the result of sea flash frozen in a catastrophy, and when i checked out it's isotopic content sure enough it carried the signature of seawater but with the salt removed, complete with sea protein residues, and dormant bacteria that had previously only been found in the depths below the antarctic ice shelves. I was curious about how deep this permafrost cover was but couldn't find anything definitive about the bedrock below Yamal, interesting enough though the crater was 70 odd meters deep nowhere on Yamal peninsular is more than 45m above sea level. I think what's going on here is that the bacteria act very slowly, to begin with, on some of the residues creating a small methane pocket, the pressure builds slowly warming the pocket increasing the metabolic rate of the bacteria, and melting some of the permafrost. The water seeps down connecting with the salt that long ago was flash frozen out of the oceanic flood creating the perfect saline enviroment for the bacteria which then got down to work, probably long ago. Seeing how fast it filled with water i suspect that some fraction of the numerous lakes/pools that litter the tundra both in Russia and Canada/US began this way.
I tried to find an analysis of the 'pure ice' type permafrost, which i suspect fell as intense hail storms and should carry the signature of the high atmosphere in some way, but so far no luck.
johnm33
 
Posts: 113
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 4:43 am

Re: New Insight Or A Mad Idea (Craters)

Unread postby johnm33 » Sun Jul 02, 2017 2:51 am

johnm33
 
Posts: 113
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 4:43 am

Re: New Insight Or A Mad Idea (Craters)

Unread postby johnm33 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 3:54 am

Just a random thought to add, is it possible that some electrico-magnetic effect prompted the beggining of these slow rising bubbles, perhaps the massive CME that hit earth back in 1859?
johnm33
 
Posts: 113
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 4:43 am

Re: New Insight Or A Mad Idea (Craters)

Unread postby kevin » Sat Jul 08, 2017 4:11 am

johnm33 wrote:Just a random thought to add, is it possible that some electrico-magnetic effect prompted the beggining of these slow rising bubbles, perhaps the massive CME that hit earth back in 1859?


Or even electrogravitics?
Kevin
kevin
 
Posts: 1095
Joined: Sun Mar 23, 2008 10:17 am


Return to New Insights and Mad Ideas

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests