The ages of the Bible patriarchs

Beyond the boundaries of established science an avalanche of exotic ideas compete for our attention. Experts tell us that these ideas should not be permitted to take up the time of working scientists, and for the most part they are surely correct. But what about the gems in the rubble pile? By what ground-rules might we bring extraordinary new possibilities to light?

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The ages of the Bible patriarchs

Unread postby Royboy » Thu Apr 27, 2017 4:42 pm

I'm an atheist not a creationist but the incredible ages in Genesis 5 have always fascinated me. The explanation that they are 'moon years' doesn't fit. Division by 12 0r 13 results in a far too young 'begetting' age More likely a factor of 8 or 9. If Wal Thornhill is (and I think he is) right and Earth revolved around Saturn the orbital period would be 40-45 days. My maths has gone with age so can somebody tell me how far away from Saturn Earth would have been ?
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Re: The ages of the Bible patriarchs

Unread postby comingfrom » Thu Apr 27, 2017 7:45 pm

Hi RoyBoy.

From my memory, according to Talbot, Earth wasn't orbiting Saturn, but hanging below in a polar configuration.
Saturn was stationary in the sky like the Pole star is today.

~Paul
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Re: The ages of the Bible patriarchs

Unread postby Royboy » Thu Apr 27, 2017 11:02 pm

Hi Paul. I watched TBP last night and Wal thornhill gave me the impression that he thought the earth orbited a brown dwarf star which was Saturn. To comply with Talbot the Earth's axis was tilted much like Uranus. North pole towards Saturn. Genesis was written long before it was copied into the Bible. Where it came from is not known. Obviously these years are not solar years nor lunar. Before finding EU I sort of dismissed them as myth. Let's assume that all the 'Gas Giants' are failed stars i.e. brown dwarfs and the Earth orbited each in turn. moving from one to another caused an iceage. There we have five ice ages. Move from Neptune to Uranus to Saturn to Jupiter then finally the sun. Somewhere along the line a calendar was devised. The year was much shorter possibly by a factor of eight or even less.The year becomes about 45 days. I tried with Kepler's law P² = D³ 1/8 year squared = 0.015625. So that is D³ in A.U.s My calculator will not give me an answer. Online calculator says 0.15625 cannot be reduced so I'm stuck. The nearest I get is 0.25 AU or about 37,000,000kms which would make it the furthest moon from Saturn.
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Re: The ages of the Bible patriarchs

Unread postby Grey Cloud » Fri Apr 28, 2017 2:34 am

Royboy,
The number of years/ages depends on which version of the inerrant word of god you read. If you use the numbers from the Septuagint then the lunar years/months works - men getting married in their late-teens or early twenties and fathering children in their early- to mid-twenties.

Another possible explantion is that the numbers are inflated to give 10 generations thus bringng the Jewish story into line with the Egyptian and Babylonians who both had 10 generations covering this period. Several other cultures did too.

comingfrom is correct about Talbot's Saturn Configuration - I call it the hot air balloon configuration.
If I have the least bit of knowledge
I will follow the great Way alone
and fear nothing but being sidetracked.
The great Way is simple
but people delight in complexity.
Tao Te Ching, 53.
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Re: The ages of the Bible patriarchs

Unread postby LunarSabbathTruth » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:57 am

Saying that the "years" in Genesis 5 actually represented "months" or a similar argument may make those ages line up with today's lifespans, but it is not compatible with the rest of Genesis.

In particular, Genesis 11 (Tower of Babel chapter) has combinations of ages, with various patriarchs having children when they were 35, or 30, 32, etc years old, while at the same time, other patriarchs ages are given in centuries.

However, in the next chapter, the ages exponentially decay, with Abraham's father living 205 years, Abraham himself only for 175, and his sons much less.

The implication is that something occurred at the Tower of Babel that had a dramatic detrimental effect. I think what happened was the breakup of the "Polar Configuration".

I think that the Flood (Genesis chapter 6) was the beginning of the "Polar Configuration" becoming unstable, but it was still relatively intact at the time of Babel.

After that, it fluctuated between periods of relative stability and chaos, until finally settling down around 700 BC.

- joe
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Re: The ages of the Bible patriarchs

Unread postby Grey Cloud » Fri Apr 28, 2017 11:09 am

LunarSabbathTruth wrote:Saying that the "years" in Genesis 5 actually represented "months" or a similar argument may make those ages line up with today's lifespans, but it is not compatible with the rest of Genesis.

In particular, Genesis 11 (Tower of Babel chapter) has combinations of ages, with various patriarchs having children when they were 35, or 30, 32, etc years old, while at the same time, other patriarchs ages are given in centuries.

However, in the next chapter, the ages exponentially decay, with Abraham's father living 205 years, Abraham himself only for 175, and his sons much less.

The implication is that something occurred at the Tower of Babel that had a dramatic detrimental effect. I think what happened was the breakup of the "Polar Configuration".

I think that the Flood (Genesis chapter 6) was the beginning of the "Polar Configuration" becoming unstable, but it was still relatively intact at the time of Babel.

After that, it fluctuated between periods of relative stability and chaos, until finally settling down around 700 BC.

- joe

Thinking something and providing evidence are two different things.
If I have the least bit of knowledge
I will follow the great Way alone
and fear nothing but being sidetracked.
The great Way is simple
but people delight in complexity.
Tao Te Ching, 53.
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Re: The ages of the Bible patriarchs

Unread postby Royboy » Fri Apr 28, 2017 4:20 pm

Grey Cloud wrote:Royboy,
The number of years/ages depends on which version of the inerrant word of god you read. If you use the numbers from the Septuagint then the lunar years/months works - men getting married in their late-teens or early twenties and fathering children in their early- to mid-twenties.

Another possible explantion is that the numbers are inflated to give 10 generations thus bringing the Jewish story into line with the Egyptian and Babylonians who both had 10 generations covering this period. Several other cultures did too.

comingfrom is correct about Talbot's Saturn Configuration - I call it the hot air balloon configuration.
Inerrant word of God ? Not as I see it. I have only seen the King James version which I take to be the history of the Jews although much is borrowed from Babylonia
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Re: The ages of the Bible patriarchs

Unread postby Royboy » Fri Apr 28, 2017 4:31 pm

Grey Cloud wrote:
Thinking something and providing evidence are two different things.


Thinking something and providing evidence are two different things.[/quote] It's called 'speculation'. From reading Wal Thornhill and David Talbot I get the impression that they are saying 'This his how it Could have happened'. Not like Bible bashers and the 'Nobel Set' that say 'This is how it Did happen'. Royboy
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