Time

Beyond the boundaries of established science an avalanche of exotic ideas compete for our attention. Experts tell us that these ideas should not be permitted to take up the time of working scientists, and for the most part they are surely correct. But what about the gems in the rubble pile? By what ground-rules might we bring extraordinary new possibilities to light?

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Time

Unread postby Roshi » Wed Jan 13, 2016 3:36 pm

I write this because I got into an argument regarding "time dilation". "Time dilation" does not exist from my point of view. But that is another problem, first I will write a definition of "time" as I see it:

"Time" is not pushing events forward. The physical world changes continuously. Not because "time passes". There are countless phenomena and physical laws that are behind the changes. Else - we would be looking for the "forces of time" pushing things forward, and I heard nobody looking for those, even if the mainstream says things like "speed of time", "time dilation", "times slows down".... Look, a car goes down the highway. Is it pushed forward by the forces of "time"? Why can it stop then? No, it is pushed by it's motor.

Time is just a number we get, we say "while this event took place, that cyclic phenomenon repeated itself N times". Without a precise cyclic phenomena to use, we cannot measure time, we do not have a number to enter into any equation that contains time. Be it Earth's rotation, an hourglass or the Cesium atom.

We chose the Cesium atom, it looks to be the best precision we can get now. But it does not measure "time". It is influenced by gravity, magnetism, radiation. How can it measure "time"? It could maybe, only if "time" would be responsible for it's emissions, by what forces? Did not hear about anyone looking for such forces.

Also - it cannot measure the "second" because the second it's defined by it, it's just the interval between 2 cycles. It just happens that we chose that atom, to define the "second".

So, this is my view. Past and future do exist, the physical world is in a continuous state of change, but all this is not caused by "time" because then we would have to forget all forces and complex explanation for phenomena, and just say "time pushes everything". By what forces? Time is only our measure of the interval between events, and we do this measuring using the most precise cyclic phenomena we can find. Nothing else. In this way "time dilation" cannot exist. If it would dilate - and push events apart - it would mean it acts on the physical world, in a very magical way - affecting all various processes in a proportional way... It does not matter if we are talking about heartbeat, a chemical reaction, or the speed of the electron... By what forces does time influence all these (proportionately)? Nobody from the mainstream is looking for them.

Also see:
What is wrong with relativity?
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Re: Time

Unread postby kevin » Thu Jan 14, 2016 2:29 am

Tempus fugit.
These are the number 4 notebooks of TT Brown,
http://rexresearch.com/brown4/brown4.htm

He carried out continuous monitoring via graphs hooked up to resistive rocks kept down such as disused mine shafts, these were all about this globe.
He found instant variations upon all graphs.

IMHO,
Time is a local consequence of the switching in that location of universal dual spin flows ( birkland currents) where in our case the earth is within it's unique dual torus field , and everything within it switchs in accordance.
Thus the time on the moon will be different to earths.
Time relative to all other planets will also be different to here, the variant switching rates been responsible for apparent movements of all celestial bodies.

Kevin
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Re: Time

Unread postby Roshi » Thu Jan 14, 2016 3:13 am

What do you mean "time on the Moon will be different from Earth"?

You realize you need to make a comparison between clocks? You need very precise clocks. Synchronize them, then wait and see. Then - be absolutely certain that the clock on the moon is not influenced by magnetism/gravity/radiation/electric fields (and who knows what else). You will have a clock perfectly isolated from the Universe. And not even then - when you will see it going faster than the one on Earth you will not be able to say "time is causing this". Because then I ask - how does time influence the cesium atom, by what forces? Are these included in the standard atom model? Is someone looking for them? Maybe you answer "No forces, no influence, the cesium atom just slows down". It just does that. Well that is magic.

Time is nothing else than a number, it has no physical characteristics. It's a number we get by counting a cyclical process, then we say "this tennis game took X cycles, and me preparing dinner took Y cycles". That's all that time is.

The cyclical process is the best one we can find (currently atomic clocks), that does not mean it's immune to any influence, and it always has physical laws that are it's cause.

Without a cyclic process we can count - we do not have a value to use in any equation that use time. Do not imagine that there is a "speed of time" that just "flows" and the atomic clock is somehow influenced by it. How is it, I ask again? What about an hourglass? Different forces here. If you admit that time flows and drives the processes forward (all the processes - as the twin paradox says) - you must describe the forces time uses to slow down or speed up the heartbeat of the traveling twin, and the forces that act on his mechanical clock, and the forces of time that make his hair grow slower or faster... Also - you should ignore all other physical known forces and laws, because now you have just one: "time flow" that just make things happen faster or slower (by the same rate, no matter the process), no other explanation needed...

About the theory of relativity: one big error that turned into a religion. Math just considered to have physical significance. Well - math can also give us a negative result for a distance. Careers, money for research, etc, these things just reinforce the religion. No career in physics for heretics:

http://www.anti-relativity.com/
http://www.alternativephysics.org/book/ ... llenge.htm

I understand the concept of "seen from A, the clock B looks like it's going slower as it speeds away". Ok. That does not mean clock B is really going slower in B (as the twins paradox wants us to believe).
Time is a concept, a number we use, it has no other meaning. It's also universal. In this very moment, something happens across the entire Universe. I do not care if it will take millions of years (cyclical process used to count "time") for the information about what happened to reach Earth, I know it happens now.
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Re: Time

Unread postby kevin » Thu Jan 14, 2016 6:27 am

Time is relative to the difference between two opposing flows...phase conjugate.
In ancient times this was expressed well at such as Angkor wat, with two sets of little devas pulling the rope around a fixed pole( churning the milky sea)s.

Time flows about the galaxy and reverses at the central zone ( known as a black hole)
it does this at all scale, thus as above, so below.

The timing You are quoting via such as clocks is only relative to the condition about this planet, and will vary if You go far underground, as well as far above the surface.
Any clocks they make here are still relative to this condition and will only begin to transmute to another time slowly.
We see via the time switching rate We are made from, thus We are almost blind to all other times.
Time is how so called flying saucers operate, they do not fly , they alter the time field about them.
Thus time travel is very achievable, but not if You stay fixed into current indoctrinated theory.

You exist within YOUR unique time field , and as that shrinks You age, as All the information within that time field reduces the ability to reset.

None of this knowledge is currently indoctrinated, but our ancient forefathers clearly had such knowledge, and operated with it, as nature does.
Nature adapts to the change in flow rates that create the seasons.
Time flows at superluminal rate, near instant, but enables all of creation , and dissolvement to occur in 3D which We are.
It is very difficult to accept this different perspective, and Your personal time field ( ego) fights to maintain it's imagined truth.

Thank You for starting this thread, as it is central to an electric/magnetic reality created by these phase conjugate flows of consciousness that form individual local time rates.
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Re: Time

Unread postby Roshi » Tue Jan 26, 2016 2:35 am

http://phys.org/news/2012-04-physicists ... space.html
We consider time being only a mathematical quantity of change that we measure with clocks.
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Re: Time

Unread postby Roshi » Wed Jan 27, 2016 2:21 am

Scientists suggest spacetime has no time dimension

along with the idea that time is the fourth dimension of spacetime, are incorrect. They propose to replace these concepts of time with a view that corresponds more accurately to the physical world: time as a measure of the numerical order of change.


There is no "space-time" there is only space. Time is only our count of cyclical processes (the most precise we can find), this count is used to measure the rate of change of other processes. The physical world is continuously transforming, the concepts of "past" and "future" exist, but time is not "flowing" and it's not pushing forward the transformation. There are hundreds of laws, phenomena that are responsible for the change of the physical world. "Time" is not pushing anything, it's just our count, else scientists would be looking for the "forces of time" that affect everything.
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Re: Time

Unread postby kevin » Wed Jan 27, 2016 4:37 am

"There is only space"
Excellent....but.
Universe is a solid matrix of aether....it is perfectly packed and a superconductive system.
No-thing exists except the aether and the empowerment of memory fields....consciousness.
The solid matrix is FIXED.
The geometries involved allow multiple dimensions in the self same location.
That which flows about the geometry is what determines so called TIME.
We are veiled from been able to consider our reality as no more than sets of memories all within each other.

All the clocks etc are made here on Earth of Earth materials, and are devices to record what we call time and movements, no-thing is moving.

Consciousness and the aether are separate, most thinkers join them as one, it took me many sets of shoes coming to terms with a fixed matrix, and then been able to follow the duality of spin flows of consciousness , churches and megalithic sites are located upon very specific compression of consciousness locations to better enable humans to interact with such.

Apparent movement which is measured with such as clocks etc is actually the rate of switchings of multiple individual memories which are subjected to variations dictated from larger memory fields within which they are sited, and the whole system is actually really simple.
As above, so below.

You reader are such a memory field with zillions of smaller memory fields within Your dominant, and Your dominant field is within this planets, and the planets is within this galaxies memory field.

The flows of consciousness are dual toroidal and reverse at the heart centre ( they have termed as black hole)
I am not moving writing this, I am displacing My fingers and in term displacing the keys .

It is a difficult struggle to free oneself from such entrenched indoctrinations thought by Your ego to be true.
Very difficult.

Kevin
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Re: Time

Unread postby moses » Wed Jan 27, 2016 2:12 pm

Think of the physical universe as a page in a book, then the next page is the universe a moment later. Now either this is a mental construct and the universe is actually continuous, or else the universe moves from one discreet state to the next a moment later.

The ancients say that the universe is continuously created and destroyed, moment by moment. When one delves into how this could be possible it becomes apparent that the newly created universe could be considerably different to the universe of the previous moment. Thus there are natural laws that are used to re-create the universe each moment, but it might be possible to interfere with this process to create an unexpected universe.

So, for example, things could be relected and made to move backwards and thus achieve a state before a physical trauma, for instance. Perfect healing, in other words. And an object, or a person, could be made to move at extraordinary speed, probably much greater that the speed of light. Etc.

Consciousness, or more acurately, experiencing, is beyond the physical universe and so could well be involved in the manipulation of the natural laws that govern re-creation of the universe. So through such means a human could produce action that would seem miraculous to most.

Cheers,
Mo
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Re: Time

Unread postby Grey Cloud » Wed Jan 27, 2016 2:52 pm

Kevin and Moses.
Well said.
If I have the least bit of knowledge
I will follow the great Way alone
and fear nothing but being sidetracked.
The great Way is simple
but people delight in complexity.
Tao Te Ching, 53.
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Re: Time

Unread postby Roshi » Mon Jul 04, 2016 2:36 am

Cool video on Thunderbolts channel, talks about time:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OvltlOA8XE

Says exactly this: time is not a physical object it's our count of a repetitive process of our choice. It can't go "faster" or "slower" by itself, unless that physical process goes faster or slower and there are other things that cause that. Other physical laws. Or else - we can just throw every physical and chemical explanation aside, and say "time" is causing everything to go slower or stop, or go faster. If I pull the hands on a clock using physical force, it means time has speed up!

Physics today considers the atomic clock is"time". If it goes faster "time has speed up" they say. Yes sure, is that atomic clock shielded from everything in the Universe? Including gravity? Including magic dark matter? Maybe it goes faster in orbit because there is no gravity there. Simple.

If you have a clock, shielded from absoultely everything, (as far as you know - and real scientists always know that science doest not know everything), and you observe that it varies in speed, what is the first thing you say? "Maybe there is something influencing it, something we did not think of!". That's the normal and scientific thing to say.

Or else you can say "time is making it go faster!". Where, and what are those forces of time influencing the atom then? "Stupid question, we don't care in fact, time just influences it and that's that"... If we admit that - we admit that the magic and unknown "forces of time" influence everything, the speed of every process no need for other physical laws. Look - the water flows from this recipient at a certain rate, on Earth. In space water does not flow out of the recipient. Time has stopped, is the explanation.

In fact - I should have used an atomic clock, an hourglass with water is not a "valid clock" it is clearly influenced by gravity. Atomic clocks are not influenced by gravity, we know that only time influences them and we don't care how. Of course - gravity is "space time" in fact, so things are simple...
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Re: Time

Unread postby Electro » Mon Jul 04, 2016 10:24 am

Time is only a concept, not a thing. It can't be bent, we cannot travel through time. What happened is the past, the future hasn't happened yet, there's only now.

https://www.scientificexploration.org/f ... be-created
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Re: Time

Unread postby LunarSabbathTruth » Mon Jul 04, 2016 1:14 pm

Roshi wrote:Cool video on Thunderbolts channel, talks about time:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OvltlOA8XE
....

Physics today considers the atomic clock is"time". If it goes faster "time has speed up" they say. Yes sure, is that atomic clock shielded from everything in the Universe? Including gravity? Including magic dark matter? Maybe it goes faster in orbit because there is no gravity there. Simple.

If you have a clock, shielded from absoultely everything, (as far as you know - and real scientists always know that science doest not know everything), and you observe that it varies in speed, what is the first thing you say? "Maybe there is something influencing it, something we did not think of!". That's the normal and scientific thing to say.

....


It's worse than that. Modern measurements are circular arguments based upon assumptions.

For example, the modern definition of the "meter" is "the distance light travels in 1 / 299,792,458 seconds". This assumes that the speed of light is constant.

And how long is a "second" anyway? The modern definition is "the duration of 9,192,631,770 periods of the radiation corresponding to the transition between the two hyperfine levels of the ground state of the caesium-133 atom." But this assumes that radioactive decay rates are constant.

If there exists a physical process that alters the speed of light or radioactive decay rates, then the scientifically sanctioned units of time and length are not reliable.

Since it was well known that a standard mechanical clock would be influenced by heat, cold, magnetism, etc, it was decided to use methods that were assumed to be more precise. But how accurate are the assumptions?

- joe
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Re: Time

Unread postby nick c » Mon Jul 04, 2016 2:02 pm

Here is an old thread on the constancy of nuclear decay rates, has some interesting links:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=942
Last edited by nick c on Tue Jul 05, 2016 8:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: spelling correction
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Re: Time

Unread postby Roshi » Tue Jul 05, 2016 3:12 am

Mainstream says: "Time is a force that drives everything forward. It can also be bent, speed up, slowed down"
Also they say: "There is this thing called space-time that is bent by mass, that's why we are pulled down by gravity, and gravity slows time". (let's skip the question - why would a bend, or a hill or any slope in space make us "fall")

Using an hourglass on Earth it has a certain rate. Using it in space, the hourglass is not working. Has time stopped? "No", says the mainstream. Then what? It appears - time flows when there is no gravity, but cannot be measured with an hourglass. What does "time flows" mean? It means things are happening. But does it mean that it was not the time that made the hourglass function? Does it mean that the hourglass functions only when "time is bent"?

I can push the water out of the hourglass in space. Again the water has a flow rate. And we can use it and say: it took half an hourglass for me to read this. Has time resumed? Now we can see what time is, our count of a cyclical process. What an aberation to say "time makes things move". Things move and transform because of millions of causes. If we want to know how fast they do this continuous transformation - we choose a cyclical process, and count it. That's all time is.

We say "3 seconds" it means we counted to 3, or used a clock that ticked 3 times, until a process has completed. It does not mean that the "forces of time" took until we counted to 3 to do their work. If I start spinning the hands of a clock myself I can quicly see that the clock is not connected tot the "Universal time" and I can speed it up myself. This applies even to atomic clocks - these are not connected to some "universal time flow"... If time would make things move, I would only need to wait and do nothing, and reach any destination I wish. Fill the gas tank with "time", it will make things move...
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Re: Time

Unread postby Zyxzevn » Tue Jul 05, 2016 1:59 pm

The Atomic clock is not using the nuclear decay,
but the electromagnetic radiation of its electron shell.
It uses the frequency that Cecium emits when the electrons of the atom change their shell.
It is like using the blue of the sky as a measure of your frequency.
More ** from zyxzevn at: Paradigm change and C@
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