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Thunderbolts Forum • View topic - Humans from another planet

Humans from another planet

Beyond the boundaries of established science an avalanche of exotic ideas compete for our attention. Experts tell us that these ideas should not be permitted to take up the time of working scientists, and for the most part they are surely correct. But what about the gems in the rubble pile? By what ground-rules might we bring extraordinary new possibilities to light?

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Humans from another planet

Unread postby fidelio » Sun Feb 15, 2015 7:23 pm

Why do some of you believe humans come from another planet? Seems like you're just trying to propose outrageous things for the sake of it. Those of you that support this theory, please give me a few lines of reasoning and your best points of evidence.


(I am partial to Mccarthy's pig-chimp theory, though I have a little theory of my own built on his. I'm open to discussing either with anyone interested.)
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Re: Humans from another planet

Unread postby D_Archer » Mon Feb 16, 2015 3:24 am

Who is saying this?

---

In any case, life is everywhere in the universe, so it is not really that far fetched that an advanced civilization settled on this planet.

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Daniel
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Re: Humans from another planet

Unread postby nick c » Mon Feb 16, 2015 9:30 am

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Re: Humans from another planet

Unread postby fidelio » Mon Feb 16, 2015 5:43 pm

I am well aware it is not an official position of Thunderbolts/EU, but I was reading in a thread about human origins and there was quite a lot of talk about us evolving on one of Jupiter's moons. There's also a ridiculous "Cosmos in Collision" theory that borrows a lot from Talbott et al. Sorry, I'm new to this forum! Check out macroevolution.net for more on the pig-chimp theory I mention. I think it is very much in the spirit of the EU model.
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Re: Humans from another planet

Unread postby tholden » Mon Feb 16, 2015 9:20 pm

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Re: Humans from another planet

Unread postby fidelio » Mon Feb 16, 2015 11:07 pm

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Re: Humans from another planet

Unread postby tholden » Tue Feb 17, 2015 8:06 am

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Re: Humans from another planet

Unread postby tholden » Tue Feb 17, 2015 8:12 am

Other than that, there is no general disagreement as to the arrival of Cro Magnon man on Earth. All scholars pretty much agree that Cro Magnon man arrived here straight out of the blue with all of his fancy tools, weaponry, and artwork intact from day one, and absolutely nothing resembling an evolutionary antecedent to be found on the planet anywhere. Further, Cro Magnon man was totaly maladapted to the conditions he encountered here on arrival so that there is no way to believe that he was either created here or evolved here.

If you don't want to believe that he came here from Ganymede, then you need to come up with some other place that he DID come from and you will not find that to bean easy task. Ganymede, for all of the reasons noted in Cosmos in Collision, fills the bill to a T. Nothing else in our system does.
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Re: Humans from another planet

Unread postby tholden » Tue Feb 17, 2015 8:16 am

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Re: Humans from another planet

Unread postby fidelio » Tue Feb 17, 2015 4:27 pm

tholden:

Ok, thanks for explaining to me in detail why Darwinism doesn't work-- But did you notice that I agree with you? I assumed, due to your obsession with adaptation, that you were something of a Darwinist. I guess I figured you wrong. But what do you suggest "designed" these creatures? Maybe I missed that part.

I've already suggested that hybridization is a fantastic explanation for the spontaneous additions of sometimes mal-adapted new forms of life. This includes your "cro-magnon" man, which, by the way, today is thought by your "scholars" to be not very distinguishable from other modern humans.

And I agree humans have a few traits that seem to be aquatic, but we can hardly be said to have been designed for such an environment. Have you looked into the site I linked? I'd be interested in what you have to say about that.
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Re: Humans from another planet

Unread postby tholden » Tue Feb 17, 2015 5:04 pm

You mentioned a pig-chimp hybridization theory but it doesn't look as if you provided any sort of a link to it. Donkeys and horses are enormously closer to each other than a pig is to a chimpanzee and all mules are sterile, so that it would seem hugely unlikely that you'd ever get anything viable from a chimpanzee trying to do anything with a pig other than kill and eat it.

Cro Magnons were modern humans, not meaningfully different from you or me. The thing we're really different from is hominids.

http://cosmosincollision.com/forum/index.php?topic=57.0
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Re: Humans from another planet

Unread postby fidelio » Tue Feb 17, 2015 5:18 pm

You're right those animals are closer and that they always produce sterile offspring, but that does not create any barrier for other animals that are more different. I know it doesn't sound right. But that's how hybridization works. Goats and horses simply don't work together. Again, not because they are too distant from each other on the tree of life. It has been proven to be a myth that animals of different "species" cannot produce fertile offspring; however, they're fertility rate is usually pretty low.

The author of this work is probably the top expert on animal hybridization on planet earth. His site is:

macroevolution.net

--------
And yea........... Cro Magnons are definitely not modern humans. "Cro magnons" isn't even really used anymore, but it was meant to refer to early modern humans in Europe. By early, it is meant around 40,000 years ago while many modern human remains have been found in Africa and other places up to more than 100,000 years ago...
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Re: Humans from another planet

Unread postby tholden » Tue Feb 17, 2015 5:56 pm

Cro Magnon art work contains several portraits:

Image

Image

Those are modern humans. The only Neanderthal reconstruction which I view as valid at this point is that of Danny Vendramini, and you can certainly see a number of differences between Vendramini's Neanderthal reconstructions and the Cro Magnon images:

Image

Image
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Re: Humans from another planet

Unread postby tholden » Tue Feb 17, 2015 6:02 pm

There is no totally good word or term for people who lived prior to Adam and Eve at this point. Scientists don't like "Cro Magnon" because they could never really figure out which groups to include; "Pre-Adamite" is politically incorrect since the term was being used in racist tracts 120 years ago; the current terms AMH and EMH (anatomically or early modern human) are problematical since those terms are generally used to include gracile hominids, which I view as wrong-headed. The Skhul/Kafzeh hominids were just hominids, and never had any artwork or fancy tools or weaponry or any of the other things which distinguish early humans.

Troy and I decided to stick with the original term "Cro Magnon" with the caveat that we are using it in lieu of terms like "pre-Adamites" or "indigenous people".
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