Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Beyond the boundaries of established science an avalanche of exotic ideas compete for our attention. Experts tell us that these ideas should not be permitted to take up the time of working scientists, and for the most part they are surely correct. But what about the gems in the rubble pile? By what ground-rules might we bring extraordinary new possibilities to light?

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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby seasmith » Fri Jun 26, 2015 7:18 am

~

Yet in the same area there are rocks shattered and blasted to smithereens.


My (boring) conclusion regarding those types of juxtapositions, from trekking around places like the American Great Basin and southern Utah where the the entire terrane is pretty much bare and exposed, is that the busted up rocks are from a more recent upthrust event.
They fall from the peaks into the same ravines where the older, hydraulically ground and smoothed boulders lay in the old and new creek beds.
Though as we noted before, Victoria Island is a Very diverse conjunction of land and ocean bottom formations. I envy your back yard.

Check the ages of the two different rock / morphologies for confirmation.
Also, often the rounded boulders are hard, hard granitic and dioritic species (from an earlier time in Earth's crustal history), which is another reason they aren't busted up.
Do you carry a rock hammer and safety glasses ?

As an aside, do you place any credence in the recurring myths of the Andes very rapid and recent rise
?
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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby GaryN » Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:56 am

I envy your back yard.


And I am only now realising just how magnificent it is, viewed through my eyes anyway, as the proof of catastrophism on a scale we can not comprehend. It is only the foothills of the events that have shaped the whole island and the Pacific northwest. You are allowing for slow, hydraulically ground and smoothed formation of the large boulders, but when in one of these often tiny creeks and see the whole picture, no standard model explanation can come close to explaining how it all came to be. These are sharp, often deep incisions into very hard rock, they are not stress cracks, or faults, or from water erosion, and when you see partially formed boulders of a wide variety of rock types, even granite, still attached to the bedrock, well, there is no geological model that can explain it, which is why none of the university departments I have sent images to will even attempt an explanation, they just don't reply.
Though I agree with Velikovsky insofar as the magnitude of past destructions, by way of worldwide legends, I disagree with the cause of the destructions, seeing them as being due to a gigantic Solar event, in which case, even if some life did survive the event itself, they would have perished by starvation, as the atmosphere would have been so choked with dust for so long that there would be no crops for many years, no animals to eat as they would have starved too. Some fish survived? Maybe.
As well as Velikovsky, I think the works of Georges Cuvier should be considered.
All of these facts, (talking about fossils) consistent among themselves, and not opposed by any report, seem to me to prove the existence of a world previous to ours, destroyed by some kind of catastrophe.

Evolution was not possible if the Earth had undergone one or more catastrophic events over time.
He repeatedly emphasized that his extensive experience with fossil material indicated one fossil form does not, as a rule, gradually change into a succeeding, distinct fossil form. Instead, he said, the typical form makes an abrupt appearance in the fossil record, and persists unchanged to the time of its extinction.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georges_Cuvier

There is the full book of the English interpretation of Cuviers work available online.
Essay on the theory of the earth.
http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=m ... 1up;seq=35

Today I see this story:
Iron: A biological element?
Image
The idea that an organism could metabolize iron may seem strange today, but Earth was very different 2.5 billion years ago. With little oxygen in the atmosphere, many organisms derived energy by metabolizing iron instead of oxygen.

Biologists say this process "is really deep in the tree of life, but we've had little evidence from the rock record until now," Johnson says. "These ancient microbes were respiring iron just like we respire oxygen. It's a hard thing to wrap your head around, I admit."


Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2015-06-iron-biolo ... t.html#jCp

I find it impossible to get my head around that idea, never mind hard. Billions of years and countless microbes, or iron from a catastrophic CME? The iron on Mars was from a time when Mars was a warm wet planet then? Iron on the Moon? It was warm and wet too? The past, IMO, and the history of life on Earth, are very, very different from what we are lead to believe.
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby seasmith » Fri Jun 26, 2015 5:50 pm

I find it impossible to get my head around that idea, never mind hard. Billions of years and countless microbes, or iron from a catastrophic CME? The iron on Mars was from a time when Mars was a warm wet planet then?


We touched on rust & dust on Mar 03, previous page; but just to expand bit:

Mars is nearly dead, a skeleton stripped of it's organic layers, and not much of a model for Earth's origins. [Look how comets 'exfoliate'.]

Now consider Venus. A hot, malleable surface exuding methane, carbon dioxide, sulfates and caustic vapors. Wouldn't Earth have been similar in it's early years?

Later, as the pie cools, lighter silicates etc. naturally migrate to the surface of the crust; as most probably an earth-sized body would take some time to cool.
(Slow cooling allows the hard-fine-grained granitics to crystallize).

Eventually the pie crust begins to mold, because biology is inevitable here, who knows why?
The first the primative organic monomers and prokaryotic organisms would be anaerobic, like their distant cousins still surviving around "smokers" at sea bottom trenches. They chemically "fix" mineral iron, sulfur and the like, while exhaling Oxygen.
~as plants do today.

Oil rigs here in the Gulf of Mexico routinely drill through Miles of mud clay sediment, before reaching hard crust; so it shouldn't be surprising that very thick "iron banding" layers appear, where ancient seas and oceans once lay.

Judging by the widespread fossil and geological evidence for a "Cambrian Explosion" of cellular 'life', (whenever it actually occurred, who cares);
it does seem the anaerobic incubation period was far longer.

Cycles of tranquillity and riot, maybe something to do with solar cycles?
No room for sophomoric "gradualism" here ...

G, you didn't answer the earlier question re the Andes?
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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby GaryN » Sat Jun 27, 2015 10:25 am

As an aside, do you place any credence in the recurring myths of the Andes very rapid and recent rise
?

Rapid vertical movements, yes, but horizontal ones, not at all.
Some of the Edgar Cayce readings from the 1930s about the past geography of the Earth were confirmed once space based radar was employed, such as the Nile running into the Atlantic, Egyptian desert having been wet and fertile, but the readings also talk of the sinking of Atlantis, am I to believe that too?
Marine shells found up Mt.Everest and at Lake Titicaca in the Andes also speak of the land having risen, but over what time frame, and by what method? Some believe Titicaca may have been at sea level as little as 12,000 years ago.

A couple of recent images from the Sooke River bed:

A small pothole with the immovable rocks in it, and as usual, the disk type rocks in the gaps. The white on the pebbles in that group is not an organic film, and when the pebbles are wet, they appear a brown coulour, as can be seen on the one where water has wicked up the surface a way. None of these pebbles has ever moved since the event that altered their surfaces, plasma I believe.
Image
This is a new feature for me. Looks like a lichen, but is actually glass-like, with bubbles, it's amorphous silica.
Image
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby seasmith » Sat Jun 27, 2015 3:32 pm

Rapid vertical movements, yes,


Well there's a source for your "shattered" rocks :D Walk any 10-14,000' peaks in the Rocky Mountains, and it is seen aplenty.

Looking on the topo and satellite maps of North America, west of the Mississippi divide, at the seeming wave after wave of orogeny that have broken on the west coast
(whatever the west coast was at that time), the question that always occurs to me is:
what is (or was) the source of that impulse from direction of the Pacific Basin ?
Is it still resonating ?

http://geoscience.wisc.edu/~chuck/Class ... ernUS.html
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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby GaryN » Sat Jun 27, 2015 9:50 pm

Well there's a source for your "shattered" rocks :D Walk any 10-14,000' peaks in the Rocky Mountains, and it is seen aplenty.


A source, but not the only one. And I think upthrust should be taken to be uplift, a pulling from above. And don't forget that case of the geologist admitting to mountain top shattering by electric discharge, but not wanting to consider it for lower level shattering.

I think one of, or perhaps the biggest problem with present geological models is that we, collectively, are not willing to consider that there were events upon the Earth that could have altered the surface to such a huge extent in a short time, especially not over just a few days for something like the Tibetan Plateau. That may be outrageous to most EUers too, but with a model of the Sun that could put out energies of such a nature that the whole planets surface may be deformed by many miles up and down, catastrophic to our way of thinking, but probably not even noticeable observing form the Moon say, and the reliance on radiometric dating, or sediment and rock strata which could also have been laid down in very short order but be interpreted as ancient, well, i guess we'll just never reach agreement amongst ourselves, let alone with mainstream, on even a rough model or time-line of the Earth past.

The idea came to me last night that Golds hypothesis of a plasma cloud squeezing the Earths ionosphere down closer to the surface, taken to a larger scale, could indicate that the Tibetan Plateau may have been the area facing the approaching cloud when just such an event occurred. Uplifting, but with a well defined plasma boundary layer being responsible for the overall flatness of the area. Looking at all the geological formations up there, you see, to a true believer anyway, just about every possible manifestation of violent electromagnetic processes, and even the myriad of lakes up there, and the deserts, suggest an etching/excavating on a truly grand scale.
I think maps such as this suggest large scale flows, and looking outside of this one area, with Google Earth, you can see, or at least imagine, where perhaps flows towards the main area of contact with a very high vertical electric field have travelled.
Image
...
Hey! Look what I found!
Image
Well, that's Costa Rica really, but I don't doubt that with enough creek crawling I'd find one of the boulders that is round or very close to it. The megahertz pulsed near field of a surface discharge track would certainly be capable of shattering the creek bedrock. The petrospheres are a worldwide phenomena. This one in NZ looks like it was hit by lightning:
Image
From beforeitsnews, not a site I frequent, but it conveniently has a number of images on one page, though the first image looks so unnatural it almost looks photoshopped.
http://beforeitsnews.com/paranormal/201 ... 80500.html

Didn't get out exploring today, we are in an unusual heatwave situation, I'd have wilted in no time in the valley. Nice and cool in my basement though, hence the long post!
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby GaryN » Thu Jul 02, 2015 1:13 pm

Experiments open window on landscape formation
Image
On a basic-science front, the findings, which appear in the July 3 issue of the journal Science, provide a long-sought answer to why some landscape features appear so orderly, with distinct and evenly spaced valleys and ridges.

The regularity of hill and valley landforms, he said, is reached after a long tug-of-war between erosion driven by runoff, which influences how rivers cut their paths in valley floors, and soil movement on hillsides caused by disturbances from such things as burrowing gophers, tree roots, digging ants and frost.


Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2015-07-window-lan ... n.html#jCp

I have a very different explanation, no gophers required.
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby GaryN » Wed Jul 08, 2015 11:04 am

Yeah, Up In Smoke, big time! Not been too bad where I am, had a wedge of marine air keeping the smoke higher up. Strange lighting though, felt very ominous a couple of days ago, quite dark, with a pink/orange hue, but the world didn't end.
...
Exploring the moon today to learn more about Earth's youth billions of years ago
The surface of the Earth preserves little or no information about its distant past. Constant tectonic activity has recycled Earth's crust and shifted landmasses. Rainfall, wind, ice and snow have weathered away surface features over billions of years. Most of the craters formed by the impacts of asteroids and comets have been erased from the geologic record, with just over 100 known craters remaining on the continents.

Image
Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2015-07-exploring- ... h.html#jCp

I have to disagree greatly with their assumptions. From what I see, the Earth preserves lots of information about its past, but how distant that past was is questionable. Much of what I see appears to have been unaltered since it was formed, untouched by any of their assumed processes. They like their collisions, but I don't believe their have been many, if any at all, and all craters are electrical in nature, not mechanical. I'd consider that some objects may have approached, but would be destroyed by the Coulomb forces, with associated discharge, before they could ever collide, with dust/sand/gravel and some small chunks being all that reaches the surface.
And as for existing evidence of past electrical activity on a grand scale, I think the Snake River Plain is a prime example.
Secrets of the Snake River Plain Revealed
Image
http://idahoptv.org/outdoors/shows/geol ... rplain.cfm
I can't believe they have it all so wrong.
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby GaryN » Thu Jul 09, 2015 10:38 am

Here's an image from the MAHLI instrument on Mars that seems to show the result of a mixed mode discharge, dark or glow transitioning to arc. The tiny pebbles are being formed at the surface, and not in the bedrock and being exposed by erosion. The quartz veins are formed by internal lightning due to dielectric breakdown, the white patch is likely amorphous silica.

http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl-raw-images ... 0_DXXX.jpg
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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby perpetual motion » Thu Jul 09, 2015 9:56 pm

These are the insides of the 'rocks and stones' that are cut up and tumbled.
South central Montana in the Yellowstone River Valley. The terrain in
Montana is quite different I believe, as it looks to me is that it was the bottom
of the ocean at one time. Then got uplifted some how to say some 3000 feet, this is sea level to what ever it was back when.Then got covered in one to two thousand feet of MUD in all but a few places in the whole state.
We are trying to figure out as where did all this mud come from. I would say that from traveling these western states that it's mostly the states adjacent east of the Rocky Mountains. The ground is just mucky alkali all over the place. Worthless ground.
Check out Google Earth and you can see in some places that the ground under
the muck is flat and then the mud came in over it and that where, along the
edges, you can see these so called Lichtenberg figures but they were formed
by the inflowing mud. To us anyhow.
The earth was in a sloshing mode?
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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby seasmith » Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:30 am

?
Perpetual Motion,

So you don't accept the "Mega-Floods" scenario described in the link from GaryN earlier ?
http://idahoptv.org/outdoors/shows/geol ... floods.cfm

Having been through the area a few times, and looking at GoogleEarth Montana area maps, it seems that drainage is toward the East/Mississippi Basin and/or south and west, via the Snake and Columbia River systems. [Not to mention the incessent blowing of dirt and grit from mountains to plains]

Wouldn't the mud have accumulated when the area was low sea/lake bottom, and the mountains to the West were rising and glaciers to the North were ebbing and flowing ?


Image
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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby perpetual motion » Fri Jul 10, 2015 9:57 pm

I'am speaking mostly of the terrain from the rocky mountains eastward, the
terrain that I'am familiar with. I have been to the west side of the divide
but not much time to study the terrain.
Now the sea floor off the west coast is around 15000 feet deep, now if we take
this sea floor and raise it to say 18000 feet,which is 3000 feet above the shore
line as of now. Which is kind of the average height in Montana. It would flatten
everything in its path, if the mountains weren't in the way. I'am just saying that
could be why the land east of the rockies is pretty much flat, as of now.
The 3000 feet above sea level thingy is true because of the sandstone rims
that we have all around this area is proof of that. So I'am thinking massive
flooding and sloshing as the Pacific sea floor started to raise as the plates were
starting to move. Then there might have been a ridge on the ocean floor that
came in a little later that hit the coast line from north america down to the
tip of south america. THINK BIG HERE. Now we have the rocky and andes
mountains. Think big because, it wasn't our average hydro dam breakage.
Then there are all these small 8000 to 8700 foot (Mountains as they call them)
foot hills in Montana, on the west coast and on the east coast nothing in
the middle. Anyone have any idea as to when or how these came about?
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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby kevin » Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:27 pm

perpetual motion wrote:I'am speaking mostly of the terrain from the rocky mountains eastward, the
terrain that I'am familiar with. I have been to the west side of the divide
but not much time to study the terrain.
Now the sea floor off the west coast is around 15000 feet deep, now if we take
this sea floor and raise it to say 18000 feet,which is 3000 feet above the shore
line as of now. Which is kind of the average height in Montana. It would flatten
everything in its path, if the mountains weren't in the way. I'am just saying that
could be why the land east of the rockies is pretty much flat, as of now.
The 3000 feet above sea level thingy is true because of the sandstone rims
that we have all around this area is proof of that. So I'am thinking massive
flooding and sloshing as the Pacific sea floor started to raise as the plates were
starting to move. Then there might have been a ridge on the ocean floor that
came in a little later that hit the coast line from north america down to the
tip of south america. THINK BIG HERE. Now we have the rocky and andes
mountains. Think big because, it wasn't our average hydro dam breakage.
Then there are all these small 8000 to 8700 foot (Mountains as they call them)
foot hills in Montana, on the west coast and on the east coast nothing in
the middle. Anyone have any idea as to when or how these came about?


Adhering to Your "think big"

Could I suggest that the story of plate movements etc is all assumption.
That what is actually occuring is huge transmutations caused by the galatic flows of consciousness ( commonly called plasma)
That as they vary ,huge displacement of mass occurs that leads to the assumptions .
Our time scale of existance is ultra short relative to the transmutations that occur .

It is very difficult to think really really big and long term, but once You realise the basis of creation, which is most definately not this stupid big bang crap, then You can then better comprehend this magnificent universe, and not be confined within false current assumptions.


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Re: Electro-Magnetic Geomorphology

Unread postby GaryN » Sat Jul 11, 2015 10:31 am

?
Perpetual Motion,
So you don't accept the "Mega-Floods" scenario described in the link from GaryN earlier ?
http://idahoptv.org/outdoors/shows/geol ... floods.cfm


Well I don't accept the mega-floods scenario. Standard geology needs to explain the land form somehow, but they don't have huge electrical events in their tool box, so it must have been water, and huge amounts of it.

Image
Huge blocks of basalt traveled three to six miles before eventually coming to rest high above the river.

They can never show numerical simulations of such action, the laminar flow model applies no matter how much water is flowing, there is no erosion at the base or the sides of the channel, and no large blocks could ever be washed miles downstream. The initial surge you might say, but they can't numerically model that either, so they just resort to such a huge ice dam burst, knowing that nobody is ever going to question their models, these guys are the experts after all.

Starting with the Lake Missoula model, and following some of the links from the Wiki page, it seems to me that assumptions have been piled on assumptions, beginning with a theory about the formation of the great ripples.

The Glacial Lake Missoula National Natural Landmark is located about 68 miles northwest of Missoula, Montana at the north end of the Camas Prairie Valley, just east of Montana Highway 382 and Macfarlane Ranch. It was designated as a National Natural Landmark in 1966 because it contains the great ripples, (often measuring 25 to 50 feet (7.6 to 15.2 m) high and 300 feet (91 m) long), that served as a strong supporting element for J Harlen Bretz's contention that Washington State's Channeled Scablands were formed by repeated cataclysmic floods over only about 2,000 years, rather than through the millions of years of erosion that had been previously assumed.[2]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Missoula

Their whole mega-flood model seems to be based on the interpretation of those ripples being from water action, but again, an assumption.

Rivers are a very confusing and complex issue for geologists, and their ages can not be determined with any degree of accuracy.

Strange Course of Idaho's Rivers
http://idahoptv.org/outdoors/shows/geology/rivers.cfm

A couple of wiki links:
Channeled Scablands
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Channeled_Scablands

Pothole (landform)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pothole_%28landform%29

If it somehow satisfies ones model of reality to believe in the mega floods, erosion by glaciers or water and wind, and the dozens of other assumptions and unprovable processes, well, that's understandable, as the alternative is the formation of all these features by electromagnetic forces on a scale that must lead to the questioning of the survival of any living things in these areas, and if the same EM processes are responsible for similar devastation and shaping of the landforms observed all over the planet, then the theory of evolution, and the origins of all life on Earth must be cast in great doubt, and the TB site, for good reason, probably does not want to go anywhere near such consideration.

@Kevin
Could I suggest that the story of plate movements etc is all assumption.


You could to me. Another case of pseudoscience being somehow accepted as factual. Thinking big is one thing, thinking the correct kind of big is another.

It is very difficult to think really really big and long term, but once You realise the basis of creation, which is most definately not this stupid big bang crap,


With a Vedic model, then there was not one big bang, and as each Sun comes into existence, creating its own mini-universe, there is not so much a big bang as a big flare, and the associated matter creation, and the shaping of that matter into all the objects that fill that 'little' universe.

That what is actually occuring is huge transmutations caused by the galatic flows of consciousness ( commonly called plasma)


A little beyond the present scope of my investigations, I am only looking at the physical level, just trying to figure out the machinery, but I certainly do think about the realms above the physical level, that perhaps we are all Beings of Light, though not light as in photons, and that the Sun is perhaps a Being of light at its core, and we are Children of the Sun, or of the One.

Children of the Sun, Offspring of the Stars
http://www.theosociety.org/pasadena/sun ... e-jvmr.htm
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
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