The Actual Astronomy of 2012

Beyond the boundaries of established science an avalanche of exotic ideas compete for our attention. Experts tell us that these ideas should not be permitted to take up the time of working scientists, and for the most part they are surely correct. But what about the gems in the rubble pile? By what ground-rules might we bring extraordinary new possibilities to light?

Moderators: bboyer, MGmirkin

rcglinsk
Posts: 101
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:06 pm

The Actual Astronomy of 2012

Unread post by rcglinsk » Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:58 pm

I figure this is right up everyone's alley.

http://www.infinitelymystical.com/essay ... part1.html

To summarize, you have to think of the world from the standpoint of Southern Mexico where the Mayans who made that callender lived. They perceived the procession of the Earth's axis and set up a 26000 year long calender as a result. Then they picked an end date based on a special feat of galactic alignment. At the Earth revolves around the sun it passes twice through the plane of the galaxy, and thus twice per year for 15 hours at a time (the sun has a volume) a line between the Earth and the Sun lies in the plane of the mikly way. The other neat deal is the difference between a solar year and a solstice to solstice year. The time it takes to go 360 degrees around the sun is slightly longer (I think) than the time it takes to go from winter solstice to winter solstice because of the procession of the axis. So, the galactic allignment will only occur (from the viewpoint of southern Mexico) entirely on the day of the winter solstice once every 26000 years, and the next time will be on December 21, 2012. in 2011 part of the alignment happens on the 20th, and in 2013 part happens on the 22nd. But in 2012 all 15 hours of allignment happen on the same day. The Mayans built a big temple with a golden statue of their king sitting at the front edge of a long hallway. The hallway points to where the sun will rize on the morning of December 21, 2012. I kind of want to be there, stand and be able to see (but not perceive) almost the whole milky way galaxy in front of me.

User avatar
substance
Posts: 160
Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 12:07 am
Location: Germany
Contact:

Re: The Actual Astronomy of 2012

Unread post by substance » Fri Oct 17, 2008 4:22 am

I`ve always wondered, how they managed to do these complex predictions..
My personal blog about science, technology, society and politics. - Putredo Mundi

rcglinsk
Posts: 101
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:06 pm

Re: The Actual Astronomy of 2012

Unread post by rcglinsk » Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:05 am

substance wrote:I`ve always wondered, how they managed to do these complex predictions..
That's a really good question. Some historians and astronomers insist the tripple alignment in 2012 must be a giant coincidence because even modern astronomers would have trouble making those kinds of calculations. My best guess is they figured out the great year by carefully marking where sunrise happens on thier horizon on soltices. They could have been doing that for thousands of years as some ancient tribal tradition, and with that much data they could get a good estimate for the great year.

Plasmatic
Posts: 800
Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2008 11:14 pm

Re: The Actual Astronomy of 2012

Unread post by Plasmatic » Fri Oct 17, 2008 6:10 pm

First ,this belongs in the NIAMI section. Second this was proposed by John Major Jenkins and if the Comparative Method is used he is mistaken on his extrapolations.
"Logic is the art of non-contradictory identification"......" I am therefore Ill think"
Ayn Rand
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it."
Aristotle

Grey Cloud
Posts: 2477
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 5:47 am
Location: NW UK

Re: The Actual Astronomy of 2012

Unread post by Grey Cloud » Mon Oct 20, 2008 2:52 pm

Plasmatic wrote:First ,this belongs in the NIAMI section. Second this was proposed by John Major Jenkins and if the Comparative Method is used he is mistaken on his extrapolations.
Could you please explain what the comparative method is and how it proves Jenkins wrong?
If I have the least bit of knowledge
I will follow the great Way alone
and fear nothing but being sidetracked.
The great Way is simple
but people delight in complexity.
Tao Te Ching, 53.

soulsurvivor
Posts: 173
Joined: Sun May 25, 2008 6:26 pm
Location: KY

Re: The Actual Astronomy of 2012

Unread post by soulsurvivor » Mon Oct 20, 2008 9:01 pm

What is Sothic Year?
http://www.antikythera-mechanism.gr/faq ... othic-year
"Canopus decree of king Ptolemy III. Euergetes (r.246 BC-222 BC) By decree in 238 BC, Ptolemy ordered an additional day to be added every fourth year."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Library_of_Alexandria
"A story concerns how its collection grew so large: by decree of Ptolemy III of Egypt, all visitors to the city were required to surrender all books, scrolls as well as any form of written media in any language in their possession which, according to Galen, were listed under the heading "books of the ships".

Would the books of the ships be the navigational records made with the hand-held cross and plumb line?
http://www.crichtonmiller.com/instruments.htm

Transvaal Spheres
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUyHrubz ... re=related

How ancient is ancient?

Grey Cloud
Posts: 2477
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 5:47 am
Location: NW UK

Re: The Actual Astronomy of 2012

Unread post by Grey Cloud » Wed Oct 22, 2008 12:25 pm

Hi rcglinsk,
I enjoyed the article, particularly the actual astronomy / celestial movement part. Is part 2 not about or did I miss it?
If I have the least bit of knowledge
I will follow the great Way alone
and fear nothing but being sidetracked.
The great Way is simple
but people delight in complexity.
Tao Te Ching, 53.

User avatar
Tzunamii
Posts: 113
Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:46 pm

Re: The Actual Astronomy of 2012

Unread post by Tzunamii » Wed Oct 22, 2008 4:06 pm

Great Vid, would love to see more :)

soulsurvivor
Posts: 173
Joined: Sun May 25, 2008 6:26 pm
Location: KY

Re: The Actual Astronomy of 2012

Unread post by soulsurvivor » Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:50 pm

The video is well made and easily understood. I posted links to crichtonmiller.com because I think the Maya could have used a cross/plumb line navigational measure. That, along with generational astronomical records, would have helped the Mayans in their accuracy. The cross/plumb line, along with the circular dial, does give a sidereal.

volantis
Guest

Re: 'A stunning light display over Saturn has stumped scientists

Unread post by volantis » Wed Nov 26, 2008 1:17 pm

I just saw this picture posted on the NASA APOD:
http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap081119.html

While NASA is marveling at the blue light, I was immediately captured by the circular patterns in the clouds. These circular patterns look exactly like intense magnetic flux lines being emitted from Saturn's core. The smaller flux tubes are toward the polar axis, and larger diameter flux tubes occur at increasingly lower latitudes. Clearly, something is happening within the core of Saturn, which is significantly increasing the magnetic flux density of its magnetic field.

My own take on this is that Saturn, and all other bodies of the solar system, are responding to an increase in magnetic flux density as the solar system passes through the magnetic plane of the Milky Way galaxy. If this is the case, we could expect further evolution of the magnetic and electric dynamics of our Sun, the Earth, and the other planets in the coming years.

Dave

Plasmatic
Posts: 800
Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2008 11:14 pm

Re: 'A stunning light display over Saturn has stumped scientists

Unread post by Plasmatic » Wed Nov 26, 2008 1:58 pm

Volantis, do you propose a similar scenario to Jenkins in this regard?
"Logic is the art of non-contradictory identification"......" I am therefore Ill think"
Ayn Rand
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it."
Aristotle

volantis
Guest

Re: 'A stunning light display over Saturn has stumped scientists

Unread post by volantis » Thu Nov 27, 2008 8:16 am

Plasmatic wrote:Volantis, do you propose a similar scenario to Jenkins in this regard?
It would be fairer to say that my idea evolved from Jenkins and others, but only because I have been witnessing data consistent with his and other's views. I wouldn't be at all surprised if 2012 brought a space plasma event. The physics required from the planets already appear to be ramping up. The increasingly frequent report of meteors and comets, particularly the green ones, are a sure sign we have entered the galactic magnetic plane. The magnetic flux density data also supports this. The significant change in solar behavior is another sure sign we are passing through the galactic magnetic plane.

Either NASA is incredibly ignorant, or the truth is being intentionally suppressed.

Grey Cloud
Posts: 2477
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 5:47 am
Location: NW UK

Re: 'A stunning light display over Saturn has stumped scientists

Unread post by Grey Cloud » Thu Nov 27, 2008 8:48 am

volantis wrote:
Plasmatic wrote:Volantis, do you propose a similar scenario to Jenkins in this regard?
It would be fairer to say that my idea evolved from Jenkins and others, but only because I have been witnessing data consistent with his and other's views. I wouldn't be at all surprised if 2012 brought a space plasma event. The physics required from the planets already appear to be ramping up. The increasingly frequent report of meteors and comets, particularly the green ones, are a sure sign we have entered the galactic magnetic plane. The magnetic flux density data also supports this. The significant change in solar behavior is another sure sign we are passing through the galactic magnetic plane.

Either NASA is incredibly ignorant, or the truth is being intentionally suppressed.
Hi Volantis,
I more or less agree with your comments. I don't know if you've seen this:
http://www.thunderbolts.info/forum/phpB ... =10&t=1111
In the first post there is a link to a good article on the actual astronomy of the 2012 thing.
If I have the least bit of knowledge
I will follow the great Way alone
and fear nothing but being sidetracked.
The great Way is simple
but people delight in complexity.
Tao Te Ching, 53.

volantis
Guest

Re: 'A stunning light display over Saturn has stumped scientists

Unread post by volantis » Thu Nov 27, 2008 5:01 pm

Grey Cloud wrote:I more or less agree with your comments. I don't know if you've seen this:
http://www.thunderbolts.info/forum/phpB ... =10&t=1111
In the first post there is a link to a good article on the actual astronomy of the 2012 thing.
I had not seen the article. I just read it at your suggestion. I remain open to the possibility that the solar system is moving around the ring of the Milky Way and bobbing up and down through its ring. But I'm also open to the possibility that the solar system actually belongs to the Sagittarius Dwarf galaxy and that we are passing straight through the Milky Way magnetic plane.

Either way, we are passing through the Milky Way magnetic plane. This is supported by the astronomical observation that we have just entered a huge Interstellar dust cloud. It would make sense for the galactic magnetic plane to harbor a thin layer of debris in its magnetic plane, much like the Sun, Saturn, Jupiter, Uranus, and Neptune do on smaller scales. The Interstellar dust cloud is this thin layer of debris.

The article you referenced is not entirely correct. The wobble of the Earth's axis is the cause of the precession of the equinoxes. Yet, because the Earth follows the same orbit around the Sun every year, the precession of the equinoxes has nothing to do with the solar system passing through the Milky Way magnetic plane. Passing through the galactic magnetic plane is a hundred million year cycle. The Mayans may have known this and may have been aware of the consequences. We may never know since nearly all of their surviving records were destroyed by the Spanish invasion.

The Mayan connection is interesting, but not near as interesting as the modern data currently unfolding. The change in the behavior of the Sun, planets, and minor bodies is interesting. The sudden presence of large numbers of green comets and meteors is interesting. The change in background magnetic flux density is interesting. All of these things agree with the idea that the solar system is passing through the galactic plane.

If this is true, we can make reasonable predictions about the behavior of the Sun and planets during this transit. From what I read earlier, it could take us 10,000 years to pass through the Interstellar cloud. If it is full of asteroids, we may see a significant increase in comets and meteors. If the present electrical activity of the planets continue to evolve as they do, we could very well see the space plasmas Dave, Wall, Don, Anthony, and Dwardu have written about. And despite the fact the EU community has made public predictions, movies, and written books, NASA will tell us they just discovered the phenomenon and it is caused by dark matter interacting with a black hole in a unique configuration with strange quarks.

Look how long NASA denied the existence of water on Mars, despite Hoagland's many interpretations of Mars images. We were told it was all carbon dioxide and an insignificant amount of water ice. Now NASA is taking full credit for discovering that the entire planet was and still is covered in water. Right now, NASA is still denying this new solar cycle is severely diminished and they expect it to explode to full strength any day. After next year they will tell us how they always new something was wrong with this solar cycle and they just discovered the black hole spewing dark matter and strangely interacting with quarks that caused it all.

Grey Cloud
Posts: 2477
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 5:47 am
Location: NW UK

Re: The Actual Astronomy of 2012

Unread post by Grey Cloud » Thu Nov 27, 2008 5:50 pm

Hi Volantis,
You wrote:
The article you referenced is not entirely correct. The wobble of the Earth's axis is the cause of the precession of the equinoxes.
There are two threads dealing with this:
Toroidal path of sun due to electromagnetic forces
http://www.thunderbolts.info/forum/phpB ... f=3&t=1176
and
Obvious Truth? Precession due to companion star(s) to Sol
http://www.thunderbolts.info/forum/phpB ... f=10&t=226
The prime suspect is Sirius as it maintains its position relative to us and it features in most of the world's mythologies.
Passing through the galactic magnetic plane is a hundred million year cycle.
Perhaps, but I tend to work more in the 26,000 year, Great year time-frame. I'm a cyclical rather than linear time type of guy.
The Mayan connection is interesting, but not near as interesting as the modern data currently unfolding.
I find the ancient stuff more interesting than the modern but that's just me. The Yugas and the western esoteric tradition tend to back the Maya.

I agree that we may soon be seeing space plasma but it wont just be a pretty firework display in the sky.
I also agree with your comments about NASA but I have some sympathy as they have to make sure they don't stampede the herd by telling the truth, assuming that they know it.
If I have the least bit of knowledge
I will follow the great Way alone
and fear nothing but being sidetracked.
The great Way is simple
but people delight in complexity.
Tao Te Ching, 53.

Locked

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 14 guests